Tamiya Paints: Some Kind Of Cruel Joke On Modelors

[armentage]

Go very, very light with primers on plastic. Keep the can far away, and put on a very thin coat. It's just going on there to help the paint stick, and to give you a good under-coat base for your colors to stand out on. Spray froma distance, and don't let the primer build on and get wet. You don't want to cake it on.

When it comes to brush painting, I too have had nothing but trouble with un-thinned Tamiya. The worst that happens is that you pull of paint while trying to get coverage, because it dries so fast. The stuff is AWESOME for airbrushing though. Some of the replies in this thread make me think I need to thin it out a lot more before I try to brush paint with it.

When I do bother to prime, I tend to use Gunze Sangyo MR.SURFACER. It goes on nice and SUPER thin. Often I skip priming, especially on smaller pieces, because a thick coat can cover up surface details.

If MR.SURFACER is too expensive for you (they charge an arm & leg for it), I've heard good things about various kinds of Automotic Primers from Walmart.

[Dangard Ace]

INTERMISSION:

I'm tempted to mod at this point, but I'm still waiting for some sort of guidelines or even "training" at this point from either Graham or the full mods.  I'm hesitant to act on any thread with newly-granted mini-mod status.

368195[/snapback]

Just follow the FAQs and use your own judgement. You'll do fine. Bye!!

(tosses David into the deepend with no life jacket).

End INTERMISSION

[fulcy]

Go very, very light with primers on plastic.  Keep the can far away, and put on a very thin coat.  It's just going on there to help the paint stick, and to give you a good under-coat base for your colors to stand out on.  Spray froma  distance, and don't let the primer build on and get wet.  You don't want to cake it on.

When it comes to brush painting, I too have had nothing but trouble with un-thinned Tamiya.  The worst that happens is that you pull of paint while trying to get coverage, because it dries so fast.  The stuff is AWESOME for airbrushing though.  Some of the replies in this thread make me think I need to thin it out a lot more before I try to brush paint with it.

When I do bother to prime, I tend to use Gunze Sangyo MR.SURFACER.  It goes on nice and SUPER thin.  Often I skip priming, especially on smaller pieces, because a thick coat can cover up surface details.

If MR.SURFACER is too expensive for you (they charge an arm & leg for it), I've heard good things about various kinds of Automotic Primers from Walmart.

368416[/snapback]

You also want to make sure your parts - even if they are plastic - are nice and clean before you put any primer on them. Wash them with a mild dish detergent, and rinse thoroughly with warm water, to get any grease or release agents off the parts...

Edited February 9, 2006 by fulcy

[promethuem5]

I used most of this advice and had a primer disaster last night... the primer surface cracked first, so then I tried to strip it off with Simple Green and it started to eat the plastic where the primer had bonded...

[Sdf-1]

Primer ate through plastic? Wrong type of primer.

[promethuem5]

I wouldn't have believed you until today... I've used it on plastic before.. it was basic Krylon grey spray primer.... I've never had any issue wtih it before. The kit was salvageable, just a little textured now.

[honneamise]

Why don´t you try Citadel primer? Makes a thin, even coat even if sprayed on at little distance, leaves all detail intact, creates just the right texture for the paint to stick, does not dissolve anything - expensive,though.

And, regardless of the brand, remember never to just point your spray can on one spot of your model! Always move the can alongside the part while spraying - that way you get an even surface and avoid too much primer buildup on one spot. Just in case you didn´t already do that...

[promethuem5]

I have Citadel stuff too, but it's all colors for specific paint schemes, so I don't waste it. I've never had a problem with the Krylon stuff before, and I use it all the time... this was just incredibly strange. The model seems to be fine now though, so I'm not terribly worried, I'm just going to have to try something else next time...

Edited February 10, 2006 by promethuem5

[robodog562000]

I've used Tamiya acrylic paints on some difficult vinyl like plastics and I never had any problems with them. Although, I prefer Testors regular paints or Model Master series, they have always worked well for me. As long as you sand the plastic well the paint should stick.

[Spatula]

Interestingly, just today I just bought 12 bottles at $2.99 each of various colors of Tamiya - quite a few different shades of the metallic scheme.

I've always wondered how Tamiya would react with water, but I guess I found out the easy way. I bought the quarter-litre of Tamiya X-20A thinner, as well as a few smaller ones so I can clean brushes etc. It's expensive, but a worthy investment.

I believe each of us learns about the do's and dont's of modelling through trial and error, and also just as important: advice.

[buglips]

The only really, really, really good advice I should pass on about Tamiya is MAKE SURE YOU NEVER DRINK IT!!!!

It's a long story. Well, actually it isn't a long story, it's a stupid story.

Suffice it to say that although it actually tastes better than one might think, it is NOT non-toxic.

The moral of the story: always read the label before taking a bet.

Side note: I used testors tube glue in an enclosed small area for ten years before I finally read the label. "vapor harmful". Prolly shoulda read that many years before.

I tried the non-toxic stuff my last kit but for some reason building just... didn't seem to be as much... fun...

*insert gratuitous "White Rabbit" music here*

[Spatula]

10 years eh? Well I've inhaled it for about 6 months now. So is smoking worse. Let's find out.

[big F]

10 years eh?  Well I've inhaled it for about 6 months now.  So is smoking worse.  Let's find out.

369444[/snapback]

You could try smoking the glue

[armentage]

I've used citadel primer on Resin kits. It's not bad, but it can go on a little too thick if you don't shake the hell out of the can... I'm sure Promethius knows about all this from his minatures though...

[promethuem5]

Yeah, Citadel Primer can get too fast quickly if you are too heavy handed. This is true of most primers tho, but Citadel seems to be a little tiny bit thicker than most to prevent drips, which then also means that it will build up easier if you don't know what you're doing.

[robodog562000]

10 years eh? Well I've inhaled it for about 6 months now. So is smoking worse. Let's find out

Testors modeling cement isn't really one of my favorite glues for modeling. I've probably used it once. It's really thick, takes to long to dry, and it has an orange reek smell to it . I really don't mind the smell from the testors enamels Just make sure you open the windows when brushing. If you spray do it outside under the patio when it's not windy. A glue that's not to bad that I have been using for years now is krazy glue. It holds well, but you have to use it very sparingly and you can buy it at the 99 cents store. My chest is filled with packs of this stuff. Just watch your fingers when you glue parts.

Edited February 13, 2006 by robodog562000

[buglips]

10 years eh? Well I've inhaled it for about 6 months now. So is smoking worse. Let's find out

Testors modeling cement isn't really one of my favorite glues for modeling. I've probably used it once. It's really thick, takes to long to dry, and it has an orange reek smell to it . I really don't mind the smell from the testors enamels Just make sure you open the windows when brushing. If you spray do it outside under the patio when it's not windy. A glue that's not to bad that I have been using for years now is krazy glue. It holds well, but you have to use it very sparingly and you can buy it at the 99 cents store. My chest is filled with packs of this stuff. Just watch your fingers when you glue parts.

369722[/snapback]

Do you mean the blue tube or the orange tube? Blue tube smells like oranges and is utterly useless except as makeshift filler. Really tube glue is pretty primitive anyways, but the orange tube Testors is the kind that melts the plastic to form a bond. The blue tube... well... I held a part in place for ten minutes and it still wasn't stuck. That's not glue, that's just torture.

Krazy glue (and other cyanoacrylates) are good, yup. I love 'em. Even if I sometimes wind up with a dragon wing glued to my head.

[promethuem5]

Hahah, yeah, that is the only problem with CA glue, but it's still the best as far as I can tell.

[armentage]

While we're having such a spirited discussion of modeling supplies...

Anyone try these Vallejo acrylic paints? Both FineScale Modeler AND Tamiya Model Mag have been pushing these paints. Almost all the build-up articles use Vallejo paints in some capacity (Tamiya's own mag!). The colors look beautiful, airbrushed, or brush painted on to scale figures. There seem to be hundreds of colors, more along the lines of old-school Polly-S rather than Tamiya's Mix it yourself (something I prefer, given that I suck).

[big F]

Says it all if Tamiya are willing to give it print space in their mag. Well im going to have to look out for these.

[Ghadrack]

I haven't bought any Vallejo paints yet, but they have been "all the rage" in the warhammer communities for the past few years, vibrant colors, supposedly have very good mixture consistency and high paint quality. Personally, I have been using Polly-S / Testors water based acrylics and Tamiya paints for years and just haven't felt any compulsion to add a new brand to the mix.

I'll end up breaking down and getting a couple bottle eventually and giving them a try.

[DatterBoy]

Recently used some Tamiyas on a custom. I have to say, the consistency of the thickness of Tamiyas is quite inconsistent. I've got a red that's too thin, a white that is too thick, and ablack that is just right. I own about 7 10ml jars which I only brush on, and none of them have the same consistency. However, they do end up looking great if they are not the thicker dryer ones.

[Stamen0083]

Vallejo is all the rage in the miniature community, but I should point out that miniature painting techniques don't translate well to scale models, and the paint catered to miniature painting techniques may not translate well to scale models either.

Does anyone have scans of the scale models painted with Vallejo? I'm probably wrong, but I would like to see how wrong.

[promethuem5]

EDIT: double post...see blelow

Edited February 15, 2006 by promethuem5

[promethuem5]

Vallejo is all the rage in the miniature community, but I should point out that miniature painting techniques don't translate well to scale models

That might be part of my problem

I have a few bottles of Valeijo paints and love them. They have wonderful color properties, fantastic consistency, and are absolutlely perfect for mixing and blending.

Here are some pics of a model I used Valeijo on... the cape is Valeijo basic blue shaded and highlghted with just white or black I think.... the stuff really is awesome.

Edited February 15, 2006 by promethuem5

[buglips]

I've heard about the Vallejo paints, I know some pro mini painters who swear by them.

Since the Tamiya consistency problem came up, it jogged my memory about another problem (though infrequent) with Tamiya.

Color inconsistency. Dark Yellow, for example, can be as much as five shades off between 3 or four bottles. Not good if you're looking for surface coverage over time. Of course, the easy solution to this (and one I use), is to dump all the bottles into a glass jar, mix 'em, and use 'em as fast as you can.

I've noticed this with Dark Yellow, Deck Tan, Buff, JA Grey, JN Grey, and Red Brown.

The only other problem I've noticed is that Flat Flesh has a real nasty tendency to turn an orange shade after application. Doesn't always do this, but I got a giant who's looking a bit like an angry cheezy right now and needs a redo.

[Noyhauser]

I've been building models for at least 15 years, and at this point I'll probably never switch away from Tamiya. I'm at the point where I've probably gone through 50~100 bottles of it over the years in various colours, and I've rarely had a problem with it.

I use it for everything. Originally I started as a 1/72 WW2 Aircraft, got into 1/35 Late German dioramas, I still do miniatures, mostly Heavy Gear, but really I've attempted to stick to 1/72 stuff exclusively.

I think the advantage of tamiya stuff, is that you can use it for just about everything. Granted its not the best in certain areas, but overall I've found that its done me pretty good. As a airbrush paint Its the best I've used, hands down. I can't think of a time after that I wasn't satisfied about how it went on... its always looked amazing. There are a few areas it is weak, the Gunmetal is terrible, I don't know if its me but the silver always causes me problems, and I too have had problems with flat flesh.

What I'm trying to get better at now is hand painting 1/72 aircraft (rather than airbrushing, which is universally the best way to do things, but I like a challenge) And with each project I'm starting to get a better feel for it (multiple levels without stripping the base layer is a new trick I'm trying to learn). Using the Tamiya thinner is vital, I used to use the big bottle of 97% isopropylnol, and it never worked right for brushing.

[Noriko Takaya]

I had problems with Tamiya's paints as well the first time I used them, and figured the water I thinned it with had to be the problem. I now use the paints religously on my military models without any problems.

[Sdf-1]

I just airbrushed Tamiya for the first time in my life (I ordered a big set of them). WTH?!? They scratch off so damn easily! I had a mr.surfacer 1000 spray can primed surface, and I used Tamiya's own thinner. How well Tamiyas are supposed to adhere then? Yeah I can/will clear coat them, but it still should be able to take at least a little of handling... I thought you can even sand them, but no, I need only to touch the paint with sandpaper and it scratches off. No chipping, but scratching.

This sucks.

[HWR MKII]

What grit of sandpaper were you using? Also tamiya airbrushes on very thin so it isnt that tough to scratch off. No paint is tough to scratch actually, i have yet to find a hobby paint thats acrylic and wont chip or scratch.

[GutsAndCasca]

Well, primer seems to be a universal consensus as to at least part of my dillema... It could ahve been old paint too, DH, as I bought it from this dinky little store that I doubt sells out of the stuff often.  Thanks for the advice though guys, but for right now at least this stuff sounds more complicated than it's worth.  At least I actually got help on this forum.  I posted the same comment on a Gundam modeling forum, and the site owner (who's models are /clearly/ better than mine) posted back that I was obviosuly an idiot, locked my thread, and put me on some kind of 'posting probation.'  All I can say is "Well, there goes the fun in that hobby."

367638[/snapback]

Geezus what a prick. People like that shouldn't have websites.

[armentage]

Maybe one of the expert model builders (HWKII, wm.cheng, etc) can give us an overview of basic painting techniques!

I mean, I've been building models for almot 23 years, and I still have alot of trouble hand-painting things. I have alot of trouble with Tamiya paints drying on the brush (and scraping off on the next stroke), or with Polly.S paints having very obvious brush strokes. Do I need to prime better? Lightly sand surfaces? Thin the paint? I just don't know!

[Sdf-1]

As for me, I think I got better results already. It's been a while when I really painted something with airbrush. And I guess new supplies need a little practice always. One thing I can say, Tamiya paints flow very nicely, and they're very good to paint.

This time I cleaned the model with white spirit before painting, and painted a bit thicker layer, since it's so thin.

Yeah, (Tamiya) painting guide by an expert modeler would be nice.

Edited April 3, 2006 by Sdf-1

[neptunesurvey]

With me its always trial and error with paints. I use Tamiya paints, with a paint brush, on minis, figures, and dry brushing. I use Testor Model Master paints on everything else.

[specr0101]

Armentage,

As for preventing the brush from caking w/ paint, have a dapper dish w/ water handy. You can dip the tip of your brush in every so often. It'll prevent the paint from hardening and your brush hairs will stay supple. Hope that helps.