Warhammer 40k Questions

[renegadeleader1]

I've only recently gotten into warhammer 40k despite collecting and painting them for the past 10 years. I need some help with lore for designing my own armies so here are some things I'm wondering:

What exactly is the space marines black carapace and why can't the battlesisters have it to fully use their power armour?

Are battlesisters imprinted with a geneseed?

Can Space Marines father children? I want to make a combined battle sister/space marine unit, as a cure to the blood angels black rage with a "Daughters of Sanguinius" adeptus sororitas unit mixed with a blood angels unit.

I'm building a codex space marine army called the chosen men who are based on the british 95th rifles, the elite of the napoleonic wars. They were men chosen for courage and who excelled in combat. I want to have the lore set up that imperial guardsmen who distinguish themselves undergo the astartes recruitment process. As this is an experimental half strengh chapter, the chapter commander is an inquisitor and commisars have a roll in its leadership and likely purging if it becomes impure. Is there any advice you could give me or tips on making this work? Is there anything in the lore that makes this impossible?

I'm working on a blood angels army and I'm confused on the shoulder colors. some pics I've seen have a black outline around the edges of the shoulder while others are just a solid red shoulder with the chapter badge. Which one is right?

What is the marine chapter in green that appeared in WH 40K firewarrior? It looks like they had a white hawks head on their shoulders.

Is the emperor dead, almost dead, a floating energy field, or what? I don't quite understand what happened when he accended to the golden throne.

Has anything been told of what the two chapters were that had their records expunged from the codex of the original 20?

What happened to the few that refused to join their brethren in becoming chaos space marines? Do they have anything to do with the legion of the damned?

Are the Legion of the damned really the chapter that had its fortress monestary lost to the warp?

[Phyrox]

1) I suggest going to DakkaDakka forums with these questions. When I was more active with my 40K armies it was a great place, haven't been there in a while though.

2) That said, I'll put down what I remember:

-The Space Marine armor is only wearable by them because it has some internal attachments and whatnot that are all done up during the initial transformation from man to space marine. They aren't normal men, they are the best of the best who have then been physically transformed in a very severe (and dangerous) procedure.

-I don't know much about the sisters...but last I remember they are in no way transfigured with an ancient gene-seed like the astartes (space marines)

- Again, space marines are made, not born. I see no reason they couldn't have children, but they wouldn't be space marine children...unless you believe in Lamarckian inheritence.

- the bottom line for your armies fluff is this: do whatever you want. This won't have any in-game rules effect of course...but let your army be your army. You can't mix and match rules from diff. codexes, so unless you are using the rules for demonhunters or some other chapter that uses inquisitors, you will have to have your inquisitor really be a chaplain or librarian (you can still use an inquisitor model, in appropriate power armor, but he won't really be an inquisitor "rules-wise").

- as for firewarrior chapter ID, I have no idea. same for the two missing founding chapters. this is the kind of stuff that will be easy to get from the dakkadakka members.

- as for the emperor...it seems to me to depend on what fluff author you read. stuff from the earlier years, and even 2nd ed. seems to be different from the 3rd and more recent stuff. Part of what makes the concept work is that no one really knows...so that's cool with me. One of the biggest divisions amoung the inquisitorial factions deals with interpretations of the emperor's state and future.

- hope that helped a little. I am certainly not a 40K expert.

[HWR MKII]

Wow thats alot to actually spell out on here. The easiest answer i can give to some of those is to invest in the GW books and converse with some of the other WH40K players you know. I can however answer some of your more simple questions.

Blood angels are blood angels as long as they are red and you call them that. The black outline around the white is just someones personal preference in painting.

The MARINES in Fire warrior were ultramarines with blue armor. they guys in green with the eagles on their helmet are Imperial guard and that marking is pretty much standard on all their gear..

The Emporer is "dead" for lack of a better word and kept inside a stasis field until his resurrection.

If i remember correctly the carapace armor is the space marine under armor kind of like a bodysuit and the "sisters" cant wear it since it is only made for the marines and the marines tend to be around 8 feet tall. This adds into the next answer. The marines can sire children since the plumbing is intact that is if the woman doesnt mind intercourse with something bigger than a horse.

You could use carapace armor or something like it for your sisters. Just roll out some VDR rules for it and apply it to the characters. Be sure to ask your opponent if its ok for you to use a VDR unit before you try to field it.

[renegadeleader1]

The MARINES in Fire warrior were ultramarines with blue armor. they guys in green with the eagles on their helmet are Imperial guard and that marking is pretty much standard on all their gear..

367100[/snapback]

No these were definatly Space Marines, the emblem was on the shoulder not the head and it wasn't the imperial two headed eagle, more like the head of an eagle on the back of a US quarter. in the intro they refered to each other as brother this and brother that. I thought they might be Dark Angels but the emblem doesn't match.

EDIT:I checked the FAQ for the game at gamefaqs and it says they are the Raptors space marine chapter, but my how to paint marines book shows them with a blue and yellow scheme.

Edited February 6, 2006 by renegadeleader1

[HWR MKII]

Lemme double check real quick. I remember blue armor in there and the ultras are the onle GW staple army that uses blue..

Sorry i was 1/2 right. It turns out that the adeptus Kidnapped the Tau etherial in the beginning because the commander had just fallen under the influence of chaos so they were following his orders. The Ultras pop up later to "assist" you in getting the Tau leader back and bringing down the"infected" portion if the adeptus chapter of space marines.

Edited February 6, 2006 by HWR MKII

[renegadeleader1]

according to the FAQ I read the space marines are supposed to be the Imperial Fists in multiplayer, Ultramarines, and the Raptors which I have no Idea what they actually look like now that two books and the faq contradict each other.

my old codex marines show the raptors as green with white eagle, which is whats in the game but the how to paint book gives them a blue and yellow scheme

[HWR MKII]

The firewarrior walk through lists them as adeptus. I have always seen the adeptus in green. The shoulder emblem can be anyones guess. Just like space wolves are grey and ultramarines are blue , bloodangels red. Ill have to double check some things though.

Edited February 6, 2006 by HWR MKII

[wolfx]

I am very addicted to Warhammer lore, especially the Space Marines, but never really played the game since its so uber $$$ and time consuming.

I'll answer your questions to best of my knowledge.

What exactly is the space marines black carapace and why can't the battlesisters have it to fully use their power armour?

The black carapace is somewhat like a spandex suit. I will quote from the Codex space marines when i get back from work later. It serves as a intermediary between the marine and the armour, so that the Marine can move the armour as if its part of his own body. After reading some novels, you get the impression that the marines NEVER remove their power armour.

Why battlesisters don't need it, well i assume they aren't as huge as the space marines and their power armour are the newer and "weaker" sort, as compared to the space marine's which are supposed to be ancient relics of the past. I think the battle sisters power armour are somewhat like space marine scout armour. Scouts don't have the black carapace yet.

Are battlesisters imprinted with a geneseed?

Can Space Marines father children? I want to make a combined battle sister/space marine unit, as a cure to the blood angels black rage with a "Daughters of Sanguinius" adeptus sororitas unit mixed with a blood angels unit.

No battle sisters have no geneseed. They are normal women by all accounts.

Can space marines father children.....no special mention on this, but with all that genetic manipulation, i wonder if they should. And with all the wars and devotion they have to the Emperor, i doubt they have the time to even think of procreating.

Is there any advice you could give me or tips on making this work? Is there anything in the lore that makes this impossible?

You can give your unit all the background and story you like. But bear in mind that if you want to make it playeable, you gotta take into account all the rules in Wh40k. As Phyrox said, you can't have an Inquisitor with Inquisitor rules/stats as a chapter leader and etc.

I'm working on a blood angels army and I'm confused on the shoulder colors. some pics I've seen have a black outline around the edges of the shoulder while others are just a solid red shoulder with the chapter badge. Which one is right?

There's a book called Codex Insigniarium(sp?) or something like that. It tells you how Space Marines color their armour and what the insignias mean. Different shoulder colors differentiate the squad's company. In normal Space Marines organisation, there are about 10 companies in a chapter. Each company has its own captain, apothecary, librarian , chaplain, and about 10 squads, each consisting 10 battle brothers.

If you want to be true to canon for your Blood Angels army, maybe you should see if Codex Angels of Death would be of any help. I'm not sure if that Codex is updated though. Been awhile since i been update with WH40k.

What is the marine chapter in green that appeared in WH 40K firewarrior? It looks like they had a white hawks head on their shoulders.

Those sound like Dark Angels to me. But i never played FireWarrior. Heard it was a substandard game. Most of the WH40k games revolve around the Blood Angels or a lesser known chapter.

Is the emperor dead, almost dead, a floating energy field, or what? I don't quite understand what happened when he accended to the golden throne.

From the 1st ed books (which i started off with) there are very rough sketches of the emperor, which looks like some skinny rotting body wearing a crown with tubes up his nose and body. So everytime i think of the emperor, i think of a rotting body in a stasis field.....well not rotting but rotted? What much we do know about the emperor:

1.) They keep him alive because his mind is what keeps all the chaos gates , safe the Eye of Terror, closed. Should the emperor be destroyed in anyway, all the gates will open and its the end of the universe.

2.) The emperor needs daily ritual sacrifice of psykers to maintain him in the Golden Throne. They usually gather those unstable psykers or criminals for the sacrifice.

3.) He's somewhere in Holy Terra.

Has anything been told of what the two chapters were that had their records expunged from the codex of the original 20?

What happened to the few that refused to join their brethren in becoming chaos space marines? Do they have anything to do with the legion of the damned?

Are the Legion of the damned really the chapter that had its fortress monestary lost to the warp?

So far what i've collected about the Legion of The Damned, are mostly fanfiction created by Games Workshop authors and players. Don't think there are any books or official material that references to them. And i think this is what GW is planning for LOTD. Keep them unofficial and fan-based. A treatment fitting for the damned legion shrouded in mystery.

Hope this helps somewhat. Wh40k has one of the best story writers evar. Really makes the future look bleak, where there is only war.

Edited February 6, 2006 by wolfx

[Warmaker]

My recalling of WH40K fluff is pretty old. I spent most of my days with that game in the original "Rogue Trader" rulebook and a bit into the 2nd Ed.

The Black Carapace is a protective... carapace in the Space Marine's body (under skin, flesh). I think it was only on the torso. It helped protect the internal organs of the SM. It slowly was formed as the Space Marine recruit ages and is transformed genetically. The recruits MUST be young boys: The transformation of a healthy boy into a new Space Marine takes a long time but pays off handsomely in the end.

Battlesisters? The only time I saw a picure of a Battle Sister (Adeptus Sororitas?) was in the Rogue Tradre rulebook. They get a VERY brief mention in that same book as part of an explanation of the organization of the Imperium Of Man.

Space Marines can father children but it simply doesn't happen, although at extremely rare occasions in WH40K fluff you hear of it. The reason is simple. The Space Marines are utterly dedicated to service to the Imperium and the Emperor. The various Chapters altogether don't even reach 1 million. The Imperial Guard (army) though has teeming numbers of normal men but heavy equipment. With the Space Marine Chapters in relatively small numbers and highly skilled and well equipped, they are extremely busy. They are indoctrinated to perform constant service until their death (natural or otherwise).

Regarding your custom Space Marine army: Make out your rules but I suggest to keep them balanced (Con's to offset any great Pro's). Keep them simple, preferrably. And if you're using that army against another player, show him your rules beforehand and see if he agrees to it.

As for the Blood Angels: As long as they're predominantly Red and have the Blood Angels emblem (or a close variation of it), then you're good to go. The current armor (Mark VII) has smooth shoulderpads with raised edges. In the current era, Chapters normally assign a color to each of their companies and those are painted on the raised edges. Sometimes numbers are seen on those shoulderpads, and those may be used instead to designate their company or squad (usually squad).

Codex Paint Scheme:

- Uniform Armor Color (or pattern... like the Howling Griffons)

- Shoulder Pad edges sometimes colored for companies

- Squad tactical symbol on one Shoulder Pad

- Chapter Symbol on the opposite Shoulder Pad

- Squad or Company number on same side as tactical symbol (usually Squad)

- Sergeants have a different colored helmet. Traditionally, Sergeants have a yellow helmet in the Blood Angels.

The main thing is this when painting Space Marines is that they need to look uniform and you can tell what Chapter they're from. All you essentially need is:

- Uniform Armor Color / Pattern

- Chapter Symbol

That's how it used to be in the Rogue Trader days. There were symbols for Sergeants and Officers that were sometimes hard to paint, but that was not the focus. As long as your Space Marines have that uniform look, then you're set. Just make them look real good!

The Emperor is sort of dead. He is kept in stasis on Earth ever since being critically injured in the Horus Heresy. Wild, uncontrolled "Psykers" are killed every day to feed their Psychic energy to keep the Emperor alive.

As for the removed chapters of the Original Founding, let them be. That keeps the original Space Marine Chapters have their special mystique compared to the newer ones.

My memory is vague as to what happened with the few Space Marines that remained loyal but whose Chapters betrayed the Emperor to follow Horus. I believe most were discovered and hunted down by their traitor brothers but some escaped back to the Emperor's service.

The Legion Of The Damned was actually from another chapter, who's name I can't recall. Their entire fleet was lost in the warp and most killed. They didn't have a Fortress Monastery. The survivors are pretty much "living dead." They pop up sometimes when Imperial forces are in great distress. Their Space Marines that get "killed" leave no bodies. Nothing is left of them after the battle.

I used to really this stuff and I still prefer the "old school" Rogue Trader style of Space Marines. I used to have a Dark Angel army and when the Codexes came out with them in that dark emerald green armor, I refused to change over. My Dark Angels remained in black.

Most of them were in the old, Mark VI armor ("beakies" to the newer players).

Loyalty to the Emperor,

Loyalty to the Imperium of Man...

"And they shall know no fear"

Adeptus Astartes, Legiones Astartes, but widely known as the Space Marines.

[wolfx]

oh, and this question

What happened to the few that refused to join their brethren in becoming chaos space marines? Do they have anything to do with the legion of the damned?

In any case, they were either killed for treason by their traitor brethren or even if they escaped and absorbed into other chapters, they would've died of old age, since the Primarchs themselves died of old age eventually.

Interesting to note though, weren't there any Chaos primarchs left since time is immaterial in the warp? Guess they all died during the Horus Heresy. I do know that Leman Russ (space wolves) and the Ultramarines primarch survived the Heresy.

[Twoducks]

The background section in the Warseer forums has all the information you could want. A member named Brusilov knows a lot.

If you want fluff regarding the 40k universe you have this: FluffBible.

I think I still have the elusive bigger version of the FluffBible. PM me if you want it. It has A LOT of short stories and descriptions for every race.

[Ghadrack]

Check your used book stores for a copy of the first edition Warhammer 40K rules, the Rogue Trader, they have the detailed process under which a recruit who has survived the process was transformed into a marine.

I don't have the book with me here at work, but the original process involved the marines having carapace plates implanted in their body and it grew inside them and fused with their skin and bones internally, the process was very painful and dangerous, many marines die at this stage in the process.

So far as I know, Sisters of Battle do not have the Geneseed treatment.

Can marines father children? I have never read any place that they were castrated so I would assume that if they could mate without killing their partner then probably, take some artistic license, chapters are meant to be unique.

IG's becoming marines is pretty improbable. But again, make what you want, if your story is cool, some will like it and the idiot rules-lawyers will poo-poo it like they do anything original.

Shoulder armor colors vary by unit, by regiment, by rank, they are probably both right, depending on the unit and rank of the troop you are looking at.

I think someone else got you on the marine chapter in the game, I never played it.

The emperor was badly wounded in the battle with Horus the assension to the Golden Throne, well he was essentially put on Life Support, In the old lore, essentially the status of the Emperor is a big secret, no one knows if he is capable of cognizant thought, he is in stasis and like Lenin's Body for old Russia was a source of inspiration. The Emperor's power however is still supposed to be affecting the Fate of mankind in some abstract sense.

Still going from memory here, so I'd have to check up on the books, but there were several chapters wiped off the books of the original founding chapters I want to think it was the Thousand Sons and the Emperor's Children that sided with Horus and Chaos and were wiped from the records as any exposure to or knowledge of the powers of Chaos was cause for cleansing with fire in the old game. 40K used to be so very dark, they really lost a lot of their Umph when they started trying to make it a family game.

A buddy of mine has been playing Legion of the Damned since he read about them in White dwarf long, long ago, I'll see if he has the original back story on them.

[Twoducks]

The Legion of the Damned was a "cursed founding". They were made long after the Horus Heresy:

In the year 963 of the current millennium, Space Marine chapter 'Fire Hawks' was ordered into the Crows World sub-sector. Crows World and adjacent planetary systems had fallen into anarchy following heavy raiding by Eldar Pirates. The 'Fire Hawks' intervention would drive the Eldar from the human worlds, restoring Imperial rule and teaching the alien invaders an important lesson. The entire chapter-fleet, including the chapter's mobile space-fortress, made a successful warp jump from the Piraeus system a mere 120 light years from Crows World. The five ships, over eight

hundred brethren, and two thousand other personnel expected to reach Crows World years after the event the chapter was officially declared lost in the warp and presumed destroyed. The great Bell of Lost Souls tolled a thousand times, and it said that the Emperor himself ordered a Black Candle to be lit in the Adeptus Chapel of Fallen Heroes.

On 9667986.M41 a routine Imperial patrol passed through the Ork held system of Jakor-tal. The squadron uncovered altogether unexpected scenes of devastation. The limited facilities available to the patrol could uncover no clue to the identity of the attacking forces. The incident was noted and passed into the everlasting record of the Administratum. A rash of similar incidents within the same and adjoining sectors soon began to arouse the interest of the Inquisition. Squadron commanders throughout these sectors were reinforced and ordered to double their routine patrols. The incidents continued pace, increasing rather than declining in frequency and destructiveness. Even so, no sign of the 3628987.M41, a patrol ship in the Maran

sub-sector narrowly avoided a collision with a space-craft at the Cift jump-point. The patrol ship was entering the Cift system as the unidentified craft was leaving. Alerted by the close encounter, the patrol crew scanned the entire jump-area and discovered two long cylindrical objects within the intruder's projected flight-path. These were hauled aboard and proved to be standard space coffins without identification markings.

The coffins were shipped back to earth and opened by the Adeptus Mechanicus. The coffins themselves were identified as belonging to the Absolute, one of the spacecraft from the vanished Fire Hawk fleet. Inside were the armoured remains of two Space Marines. The unconventional armour colours and unofficial insignia puzzled the investigators, but serial numbers tallied with equipment made by or issued to the Fire Hawks. The armoured suits were expected to house members of the lost chapter, and were carefully broken open. The bodies within were human, but further identification proved impossible due to their advanced state of decay.

The full truth would not emerge until almost a year later when a besieged Imperial research station received unexpected help. The garrison had been attacked suddenly by Ork pirates. After three hours of fighting the situation looked hopeless. Then, without warning, the Orks found themselves attacked in the rear. The ferocity of the fighting appalled even the station's defenders. Within half an hour, several hundred Orks had fallen to the mysterious, power-armoured figures. Then, as suddenly

as they had appeared, the warriors vanished. This time they left behind a banner - the gnarled chapter flag of the Fire Hawks - and inscribed upon it was the motto In dedicato imperatum ultra articulo mortis (For the Emperor beyond the point of death). As well as the banner there was a recorder and sundry other sealed items. These were immediately shipped to Earth. From the data contained in the recorder the Administratum was able to determine exactly what had happened to the lost chapter. Following their warp-jump the entire fleet had been caught within a

warp-storm of terrific intensity. Stunned by the power of the warp, the chapter was forced to endure the attacks of powerful warp entities. Ship after ship was destroyed and absorbed into the fabric of the warp. Soon only one craft remained. By a daring warp-exit maneuver the craft burst out of warpspace, emerging far in the galactic east, thousands of light years off-course and beyond even the psychic light of the Emperor. The original survivors numbered two hundred brethren. All gene-seed had been lost, all initiates killed, and most of the chapter's masters were gone. None of the ordinary human staff have survived at all. To make matters worse the brethren had changed. This change became more obvious over the next few months. Skins began to blacken and blister, flesh began to fester and putrefy. Slowly they began to die. Within days of the transition into normal space it became obvious that the

chapter had been exposed to some form of dangerous mutation or disease. It took many years to navigate a way back into the Imperium, during which time almost half the brethren succumbed to the malady. Those who remained were no longer sane. Pain and despair had driven even their hardened minds beyond the point of rationality. Doomed to agonizing deaths, they gradually became obsessed with their fate. Now they only wanted to die. But they were still marines, still loyal to the Emperor and humanity. They would not die without purpose.

So began the unstoppable war of the Legion of the Damned! The marines elected to remove all insignia from their armour. Instead their armour would be black, decorated by each brother with whatever emblems of death he chose (the accompanying illustrations show some typical variations). Most brothers employed a similar theme - skeletons, bones and skulls.

All ranks and companies were abolished, most of the chapter's officers were already dead and the remaining warriors were too few to make up a fully functional chapter hierarchy. all brothers were to be equal before death - leveled by the certainty of their assured extinction. The warriors decided to expend their lives attacking enemies wherever they could be found. The disease had robbed them of their sanity, but not their loyalty! And their condition gave them powers - powers that endow them with incredible fighting abilities.

As the fatal malady takes a firm hold, the victim begins to degenerate and putrefy. However, even as his body decays, he grows in supernatural vigor. Even though the marine's limbs become rotten and twisted he gains strength far beyond that of a normal marine. These powers heighten as the disease rages through the victim's body. At the moment of death, each brother reaches a peak in power, at which point the raw energies of the warp transmute the death throes of the doomed marine into a berserk orgy of destruction. These changes are reflected by the profile and special rules given later.

Make no mistake - the Legion of the Damned may be few in numbers, but their powers are awesome! Just as their bodies are changed by contact with the warp, so their minds are hardened too. Brethren are completely immune to all forms of psychic attack or interference. They cannot be affected by the special psychic attacks of warp-creatures - although they may be harmed physically by physical attacks that such creatures may have. Astral specters and other immaterial creatures

cannot harm them in any way.

Space Marines can't reproduce. They do contain two "geen seed" thingies (the basic thing to start making a normal human into a Space Marine). Stracting this things are the only way to have gene seeds to make more marines. Each chapter donates part of their gene seeds to the Adeptus Mechanichus (the faction of the Imperium that knows about technology only in a mistacal/religious kind of way). They check their health (mutations are constantly controlled), and use them also to make new Chapters.

[wolfx]

40K used to be so very dark, they really lost a lot of their Umph when they started trying to make it a family game.

I read some of the new codexes. It still is very dark....and not Disney family game kinda way.

Btw...I keep hearing Rogue Trader, but that's such a weird name...you play traders and barter stuff in the the universe?

Kudos to Twoducks for digging that info from somewhere.....nice read.

Space Marines can't reproduce. They do contain two "geen seed" thingies (the basic thing to start making a normal human into a Space Marine). Stracting this things are the only way to have gene seeds to make more marines. Each chapter donates part of their gene seeds to the Adeptus Mechanichus (the faction of the Imperium that knows about technology only in a mistacal/religious kind of way). They check their health (mutations are constantly controlled), and use them also to make new Chapters.

They might reproduce but a baby marine might not be born. We don't know if they are sterile. And its not the gene seed that's donated to Adeptus Mechanicus i think, but the initiates who are sent there to be trained into Techmarines. Anyway....the 2 gene seeds are the progenoid glands.

From Codex Space marines:

Each Space marine carries two replicating organs known as progenoid glands. They absorb genetic material from the Space Marine's other implants and store them for later removal. If the Space Marine dies, the progenoids can be extracted and used to grow fresh impants.

I never really got this.These 2 gene-seeds don't seem to be important for the marine to function, so why not just remove it when you think its there long enough instead of risk it getting blown to bits or vaporised on the battlefield, if they're such important organs?

And as promised, about the Black carapace:

Once he has proved his valour and skill, a Scout is implanted with the Black Carapace, a subcutaneous membrane that allows his internal organs to interface directly with a suit of Space Marine power armour, making the armour a natural extension of his body.

And this a list of the Space Marine Legions (not chapters)

Dark Angels

***expunged***

Emperor's Children (traitor)

Iron Warriors (traitor)

White Scars

Space Wolves

Imperial Fists

Night Lords (traitor)

Blood Angels

Iron Hands

***expunged***

World Eaters (traitor)

Ultramarines

Death Guard (traitor)

Thousand Sons (traitor)

LunaWolves (traitor) <---- Horus' legion

Word Bearers (traitor)

Salamanders

Raven Guard

Alpha Legion (traitor)

Edited February 6, 2006 by wolfx

[Ghadrack]

Btw...I keep hearing Rogue Trader, but that's such a weird name...you play traders and barter stuff in the the universe?

I think that it was intended to be considered from the viewpoint of you are perusing an equipment or army catalog through which you (the commander, general, mercenary pirate, whatever) would buy your army and equipment. No telling though. It had some great flavor text throughout.

I have read much of the latest edition and they are returning some of the gore factor to the game, but if you read any of the original rules for Chaos or the first edition stuff, there is a glaring difference, second edition was a blatant attmept to soften the image of the game and draw in a different, more family friendly crowd.

GW has really alienated most of their old player base anyhow, they now consider players and their retailers for that matter to be a revolving door resource. I could rant at length about their business practices, but this isn't the place for that.

Cool miniatures, neat game.

[Warmaker]

Rogue Trader is the original Warhammer 40K Rulebook! It came about it the mid-late 80's. I recall getting one in Jr.High.

I still recall the cover: A clustered group of Crimson Fists Space Marines making a last stand... equipped in what is now called Mark VI Power Armor.

What was truly wonderful with the Rogue Trader book was that the players were utterly limitless on what they wanted to do. The book gave the basic guidelines, rules, stats, and LOTS of fluff. It tells the basic story of the galaxy, the Orks, Eldar, a bit of Chaos, and the Imperium.

There were no constrictive numbers as to how many troopers were in a squad and what they could be equipped with. Nothing like that.

Basic stuff like point costs for equipment and basic troop types. It felt easier for other players to accept custom rules & units back then, just as long as you give them a heads up about it.

Customizing your leaders and troops had LOTS of freedom. You could literally stack alot of c**p onto your leaders or even a single trooper, if you wanted to. Example: I made, because I thought it would look cool, a Dark Angel Terminator (in BLACK... not this Ivory White s**t) with an Assault Cannon, Cyclone Missile Launcher, and a Chainfist. Of course, he was a walking Lascannon / Missile Launcher / Defense Laser's favorite target...

I recall in the Rogue Trader days, waaay even before 2nd Edition, that I decided to hold a truly grand campaign for me and my buddies. The "Resumption of the Crusade." The story was that FINALLY, there were leaders in the Imperium that believed that no longer would Man await the onslaught of the Orks and treacherous Eldar. No longer would Man take shot after shot from the forces of Chaos and do little in return. No longer would Man await the numerous alien onslaughts. It was time for Man to take up the Crusades in the way the Emperor once did. There was a great mobilization of the Imperium's forces. Chapters being raised and the existing ones will take up the sword. Among the Space Marines, the original Chapters will take the leading roles, just as their predecessors have done under the Emperor. "Our" part of the Crusade was represented by mixed forces from my buddies. The Dark Angels and my friends' White Scars, Iron Hands, and Blood Angels. We had enough guys out there that had Orks, Eldar, various alien races, etc. Heck, we even made up more aliens from other, non-WH figure lines that were readily and cheaply available.

It was to be a tremendously long campaign and I acted as sort of a "Dungeon Master" and gave the guys a story and objectives. If they failed in the objective or succeeded, certain things will happen in the next.

Since it was a long campaign, I allowed on uncommon circumstances a single point to be added to a sergeant or officer's stats. Yes, we had names for our Sergeants, Officers, and Specialists (Techmarines & Medics). The Medics also had a chance to heal downed SMs or recover them for healing after a battle. If worse came to worse, the Marine was dead and his Geneseed recovered. On long ranged, expeditionary missions where reinforcements were unlikely, lost Marines in battle may be recovered by the Medic (if he survives of course). Some are still lost. It made things dramatic for when I put the guys in a "You MUST hold the fortress ruins until reinforcements arrive" scenario. The guys would have dwindling numbers of Space Marines with successive firefights but the enemy would keep on coming.

We never really "finished" the Crusade but it was a great backdrop for many campaigns using the same heroes.

Oh, BTW, there was a time when there were Jet Packs for the Space Marines, back in the Rogue Trader days...

Again, the train of thought back then and the rulebook lent lots of freedom compared to now.

In Rogue Trader, the Space Marines of course get quite a bit of fluff and pictures. One worthy, little note is that Space Marines DID use camouflage!

In Rogue Trader, you see a single Space Marine walking through the wild in a Blue / Dk.Blue tigerstripe patterned armor. Believe it or not, he was an Ultramarine. He had a small Ultramarine logo in a white circle on his right shoulderpad. He was hunting for what looked to be a humanoid who was trying to lay in ambush.

Some of those figures from back then still look tremendously great, especially the Space Marine Officers and Sergeants. Having them in a current Space Marine Army could seriously provide that "old veteran" who's seen more s**t than these newer Space Marines could ever hope to see.

Another thing with WH40K back then. It was cheap to build a good sized army. For the Space Marines, there was a plastic Space Marine kit with enough parts to build 30 of them. Missile Launchers and Flamers were the standard Hvy.Weapon / Special Weapons. That box costed about $15-20 U.S.

BTW, Twoducks, I PM'ed you. I need that big WH40K Fluffbook...

Edited February 7, 2006 by Warmaker

[HWR MKII]

Personally i prefer to play as the tau. They are so new that their rules are pretty basic and allow room for "expanion". That and they have the fireower of gods.

[renegadeleader1]

Some of those figures from back then still look tremendously great, especially the Space Marine Officers and Sergeants.  Having them in a current Space Marine Army could seriously provide that "old veteran" who's seen more s**t than these newer Space Marines could ever hope to see.

Another thing with WH40K back then.  It was cheap to build a good sized army.  For the Space Marines, there was a plastic Space Marine kit with enough parts to build 30 of them.  Missile Launchers and Flamers were the standard Hvy.Weapon / Special Weapons.  That box costed about $15-20 U.S.

BTW, Twoducks, I PM'ed you.  I need that big WH40K Fluffbook...

367665[/snapback]

I don't suppose these old version figures are still available somewhere? You're also right about the price $40.00 these days gets me 10 marines and a bunch of parts that don't actually go with the marines I bought. (chaos and IG parts)

[lord_breetai]

sorry didn't read through the whole thread but skimmed and didn't notice the answer here

- Again, space marines are made, not born. I see no reason they couldn't have children, but they wouldn't be space marine children...unless you believe in Lamarckian inheritence.

They can not have children, one of the side effects of the genetic enhancements they undergo is sterelity.

Sisters do not have Geneseed they are just girls in power armour, that's why they arn't 8 feet tall...

yeh.

[Guest Bromgrev]

Some of those figures from back then still look tremendously great, especially the Space Marine Officers and Sergeants.  Having them in a current Space Marine Army could seriously provide that "old veteran" who's seen more s**t than these newer Space Marines could ever hope to see.

Another thing with WH40K back then.  It was cheap to build a good sized army.  For the Space Marines, there was a plastic Space Marine kit with enough parts to build 30 of them.  Missile Launchers and Flamers were the standard Hvy.Weapon / Special Weapons.  That box costed about $15-20 U.S.

367665[/snapback]

Ah, the days ... I still have that original set of Space Marines with the skinny lower leg armour - much battered now, of course.

[Warmaker]

The plastic Space Marines from the Rogue Trader kits should be quite hard to find in a complete box. Rogue Trader came out in 1987 so this kit probably came out not long afterwards.

Any WH40K fan would find it hard not to build and paint a box of 30 plastic space Marines that were considered cheap to buy back then.

I tried doing searches on E-Bay which only yielded a small, opened portion with parts for 6 S.Marines.

Even if you get them, I heartily recommend you do alot of conversion work to give them more unique poses and stances. The standard leg, body, and arm pieces aren't very yielding for pose variety. Get that hobby knife ready.

Plus, the old Space Marines have a few things going for them in that kit, other than that "Old School" look.

- Lots of extra parts for "bayonets" including blades and chainsword-type of attachment.

- Knives. Lots and lots of Combat Knives. Actually, they look more like Short Swords. Power Gloves / Power Fists are also there for your Officers / Sergeants.

- Bolt Pistols, Bolt Rifles, Flamers, and Missile Launchers are the other ranged weapons with the kit.

Also, for old RT fans who have the Dawn Of War game, take a look at this:

Mark VI Armor Mod

It's not completely faithful, but it gets the look down enough.

Fluff again about the creation of Space Marines. They are both born and created. Each highly trained, genetically engineered, well equipped Space Marine was born a normal human male. On average, they were selected from various means as young adolescents. The "selection" can often be deadly enough by competition or tough screening processes. It depended on the chapter. There's good fluff out there for the selection proces.

The Space Marines are also "created" due to the extensive geneseed processes and every step it takes to make the Space Marine.

The Space Marines, though much superior to a normal human being and no longer fully human, at least realize that they have one vital link to their past... that they were all born naturally and were human. Their task was to protect and fight for humanity. The traitors of the Horus Heresy forgot this.

The book "Angels Of Darkness" has a chapter about the Dark Angels' selection of its recruits. They always select from "savage," underdeveloped worlds. Many young boys who compete may get killed, since only the best and fittest of them can hope to endure the process of becoming a Space Marine, and even then, not all of those make it. It's also got lots of good fluff there too.

There's a character there named "Astelan" and he has some... interesting opinions on the state of the Imperium when the Emperor was alive compared to the current WH40K universe. Makes you think on what the Imperium could do...

Edited February 8, 2006 by Warmaker

[Lynx7725]

Ahh.. I love these threads. All the skulking 40K nuts come pouring out. I skimmed through but didn't read every thread -- too much words. So some info is doubtlessly repeated.

What exactly is the space marines black carapace and why can't the battlesisters have it to fully use their power armour?

Space Marines Black Carapace is a second skin implanted specifically for them to interface more closely with their power armour. The implant is part of a ritual that elevate a man into a Space Marine, and all these implants are closely guarded by the Adeptus Astartes.

The Adepta Sororitas, being an arm of the Ecclesiarchy (the Church of the Emperor), do not have access to the geneseeds. Also, the relationship between the Ecclesiarchy and the Adeptus Astartes, as well as the veneration of the Emperor as a divine being, precludes the Ecclesiarchy even thinking about asking for the implants.

Are battlesisters imprinted with a geneseed?

There is no specific given reason why geneseed implants cannot work on a female anatomy, the religious fervour which the Adeptus Astartes preserves their tradition (and the general anti-progress outlook of the Imperium) AND the powers-that-be within the Ecclesiarchy prevent such experimentation from being carried out.

Not to mention, the Adepta Sororitas are fanatics. Not too sure if they would want such an implant anyway.

Can Space Marines father children? I want to make a combined battle sister/space marine unit, as a cure to the blood angels black rage with a "Daughters of Sanguinius" adeptus sororitas unit mixed with a blood angels unit.

No specific reason why Space Marines cannot bred -- there are no specific mention of castration or impotency involved -- but the genetic manipulation required to create a Space Marines may cause that (or inability to bred with humans, or inability to pass the genetic makeup to the next generation, etc.)

Also, the Adeptus Astartes are chiefly monastic orders... so are the Adepta Sororitas. You can have that kind of background, but it pretty much guarantees one of two things. One, the resultant offsprings are working for the Imperium but hunted by them, or Two, they are working for Chaos.

I'm building a codex space marine army called the chosen men who are  based on the british 95th rifles, the elite of the napoleonic wars.  They were men chosen for courage and who excelled in combat. I want to have the lore set up that imperial guardsmen who distinguish themselves  undergo the astartes recruitment process. As this is an experimental half strengh chapter, the chapter commander is an inquisitor and commisars have a roll in its leadership and likely purging if it becomes impure. Is there any advice you could give me or tips on making this work? Is there anything in the lore that makes this impossible?

Well.. Genetic manipulation of boys to become Space Marines start before puberty; generally the men you are thinking of is too old -- there are mentions that the implants would not take and may kill them.

However, there is an option. In one of the White Dwarf magazine, there is talk of genetic manipulation of Imperial Guardsmen to create super-soldiers not on the scale of Space Marines (with drawbacks -- everybody hates them. ). What you can do is to write it up as a secret experiment by the High Lords of Terra, to create a brand new chapter from distinguishied Imperial Guardsmen. Perhaps this is to create a breed of Space Marines that are more controllable than normal Marines.

In game terms, you just use the basic Space Marine Codex, plus pull an Inqusitor HQ ally either from the Daemonhunters or Witchhunters codex. Witchhunters seems more appropriate.

I'm working on a blood angels army and I'm confused on the shoulder colors. some pics I've seen have a black outline around the edges of the shoulder while others are just a solid red shoulder with the chapter badge. Which one is right?

Ok, this is tricky. The Codex Astartes specificed very standardized colouring to indicate chapter and company markings, but I cannot recall the BA markings offhand (and they may not be following the standard to begin with..). Generally, the shoulder pad trim would indicate which company the Marine belongs to. The the left shoulder usually carries the Chapter markings, while the right shoulder generally carries the squad markings (or specialist markings).

What is the marine chapter in green that appeared in WH 40K firewarrior? It looks like they had a white hawks head on their shoulders.

I never got that far. Generally, Dark Green is Dark Angels, but this could be Salamanders as well. Without a screencap it's difficult to tell.

Is the emperor dead, almost dead, a floating energy field, or what? I don't quite understand what happened when he accended to the golden throne.

He's dying, but kept alive in a stasis field and by feeding on soul energy (hence the Carrion God reference). The Golden Throne is the stasis machine keeping him alive.

Has anything been told of what the two chapters were that had their records expunged from the codex of the original 20?

No, and unlikely; GW hasn't touch that in decades, and is unlikely to touch it.

What happened to the few that refused to join their brethren in becoming chaos space marines? Do they have anything to do with the legion of the damned?

Typically executed after the Horus Heresy.

Are the Legion of the damned really the chapter that had its fortress monestary lost to the warp?

367094[/snapback]

Someone else gave a detailed writeup on this, so I won't bother repeating this.

[RFT]

I think the thing with the original "Rogue Trader" rulebook was that they intended the game to be a skirmish game with small numbers of characters per side. The suggested scenarios (I remeber one being chase through a spaceport) seem to bear this out. the "rogue traders" in question where the space-pirate/freelancer characters they saw the game being based around.

However, people used it as a massed-army game, which made a lot of the rules in the RT book redundant and those that were left were really clunky- I remeber a really tedious way of dealing with vehicles that got introduced based on a cutaway grid of the vehicle you had to aim at a point on. it took minutes to resolve just one hit, and if you had a heavy weapon squad firing at an enemy tank it took bloody ages...

The second edition rules (1993, I think) improved things a lot by speeding things up, but the 3rd seemed to take it too far- I never understood why they made all the races and characters have the same movement amount.

Oh, memories. I gave away most of my army (a large number of Space Wolves) a few years ago, but I kept the Metal characters and Terminators. I only got anywhere near decent at painting when I was on the cusp of growing out of it.

It's a shame GW stopped doing the stand-alone boxed games. they were a great introduction to the hobby.

My first was dark future, a car wars rip-off that was set in the dim, far-off year of... 1995.

Happy memories of staying inside during school lunchtimes of the turn of the 90s playing blood bowl, Space Hulk, and whatever that space-combat game was called.

[Lynx7725]

The second edition rules (1993, I think) improved things a lot by speeding things up, but the 3rd seemed to take it too far- I never understood why they made all the races and characters have the same movement amount.

The problem with 2nd Ed is that it is the Uber-character edition. Lots of tooled up characters wiping out whole armies. I mean, yeah, but WHOLE ARMIES?

And of course the Vortex Grenade Delivery System, or the Exarch Delivery System, or the IG favourite (not!) Virus Grenade....

[Warmaker]

Super-Characters have always been a problem with WH40K games.

They alone have the potential to win a scenario single-handedly.

Except for truly exceptional scenarios, my group of players only utilized plain / generic leaders / officers when we got better feels of 2nd Ed.

2nd Edition was a decent compromise between the truly freeform Rogue Trader to the Codex-heavy system that progressed late in 2nd Edition's existence, and into 3rd Ed.

I like rules and all, but not to a point where making your army was frustrating.

I still miss my platoon of Jet Packed equipped Dark Angels from the late Rogue Trader days...

[Guest Bromgrev]

Ah, the days ... I still have that original set of Space Marines with the skinny lower leg armour - much battered now, of course. 

368024[/snapback]

I knew they were still around, but I seem to be missing some. Boy, they could use a strip and re-paint ...

[Ghadrack]

First edition was the worst for kitted out characters that wipe out armies.

I fought in a league battle with seom friends one of which had a 2000 point Ratling on a Hoverboard, on the front of the hoverboard he had a Phase Field Generator, the Hoverboard moved 72" a round which gave a minus 7 to hit him he had 10 Synchronized strength 10 power fieldswhich meant you had to do more than 100points of damage in a round to hurt him, for weapons he wore a Harlequin double grenade launcher loaded wiht Vortex grenades on his back and used 10 Jakaero Digital weapons, 5 needlers with death poison, and 5 flamers.

First edition was fun with friends, it was horrible for competition though, because if you wanted to you could really break the game.

The worst I ever saw was a league battle 8,000 points a side, 4 on four, one team was comprised of 4 Level 4 Psychers in a teleporting predator tank, each round they used the time control power to take away the enemys Psychic and Firing Phases while they got used for target practice with various psychic attacks and missile barrages. It was totally weak.

A close second, was another friend of mine created a vehicle it was an apache helecopter, it flew 90 inches above the board and used a Defense Laser (Planetary defense weapon with unlimited range to shoot his apponnent who could not hit him because he was out of range of anything but two weapons in the game that the opposing player (me) didn't have.

Fun when playing with freinds. no fun competetively.

[Warmaker]

We never took it THAT far with Rogue Trader

We had some well equipped "main characters" as our "avatars" on the field. But nothing to promote one-man armies.

There's no fun in near invincible characters.

It was far more fun for us to pit a worn down platoon of Space Marines against a large Ork force.

[Ghadrack]

We never took it THAT far with Rogue Trader

We had some well equipped "main characters" as our "avatars" on the field.  But nothing to promote one-man armies.

There's no fun in near invincible characters.

It was far more fun for us to pit a worn down platoon of Space Marines against a large Ork force.

369008[/snapback]

Yeah, with friend's it was great, once we started forming Leagues and having prizes at the end of the League Season competition forced the arms race till it turned into a farce, even with league rules, there were so many ways to exploit the game mechanics of the Rogue Trader rulebook that it always turned ugly in the end.

Second edition ruined the game for some races, it made orks the comic relief of the game with the Malfunction deck, I switched over to Eldar in second edition then started on my Marine army, by third edition I had given up on GW because of the completely ludicrous price structure they have set forth, and the bogus basis of the Lead to "Pewter" miniature production, now their price structure is based upon the utility and power of the figure in the army, which is just out and out theft from theri customers.

Every time I start talking about it I end up ranting, I absolutely love their stuff, and have been addicted to it for the past 15+ years, but I haven't bought anything from them in 6 months, they have just lost their minds on prices.

[Ghadrack]

Back to the topic, I had the day off and pulled out my Rogue Trader, I was wrong, the section on the Transformation to a Space marine, wasn't in there, it was in the Warhammer 40K White Dwarf Presents Compilation from 1989 from the Compilation:

" Phase 19 - Black Carapace. This is the last and the most distinctive implant. It looks like a film of black plastic when it's growing in the tanks. This is removed from its culture-solution and cut into sheets which are implanted directly beneath the skin of the Marine's torso. Within a few hours the tissue expands, hardens on the outside, and sends invasive neural bundles deep inside the Marine. After Several months the carapace will have fully matured and the recipient is then fitted with nerual sensors and transfusion points cut into the hardened carapace. These artificial 'plug in' points mesh with features integral to the powered armor, such as the monitoring, medicinal and maintenance units. Without the benefit of a black carapace a Space Marine's armour is relatively useless."

On the subject of the Emperor, from teh Rogue trader, here is a short passage from the two pages dedicated to the Emperor of Mankind, I think it illustrated their original concept of the emperor and his role in the game:

" It is ironic that this creature, whose will extends to over a million worlds, is no unable to leave the life giving machinery of his imperial throne, unable to so much as lift a shrivelled finger or twitch a shrunken eye. The living caracss of the Emperor if immobile, held fast within the bio-machine that sustains his spirit.

Held within this perversion of science lies the Emperor himself, or rather what now remains of his carcass, the seat of his omnipotent will.

he Emperor is now the custodian of his race, and he alone bears the knowledge of its fate. To this end the Emperor maintains strict control over the development of humanity and contributes directly to its survival by utilising his pwers. He plays a vital role in space travel within the Imperium. In order to steer a craft over great distances, a human navigator uses a mental homing signal, a sort of psychic beacon to guide him through warp space. To provide a mental signal throughout human controlled space would not be possible to any ordinary psyker - his powers go beyond those of mortals. Even so the strain of transmitting a contnuous signal would prove far too sternuous, and he merely concentrates his powers on directing a signal created by others. These are the imperial servants known as Adeptus Astronomicua, psykers whose bodies and souls are leeched of energy. This energy is projected by the mind of the Emperor in the form of the psychic beaconknown as the Astronomican.

For the Emperor the only viable form of sustenance is the human life-force-soul and he has a great insatiable appetite. "

It goes on and on

[HWR MKII]

It almost sounds as if the emporer is of a chaos influence every time i hear that. He is an abomination. It would be interesting if GW decided to actually "heal" the emporer and see what would happen once he woke up.

[Warmaker]

There was a book that came out in the time between Rogue Trader and 2nd Edition called "Warhammer 40,000 Compendium."

It basically was a collection of White Dwarf articles / rules and quite a bit of fluff.

In there, it had a large section on the selection, creation, and training of a Space Marine. I vaguely recall reading of the various processes and special organs that the Marine gets.

It's also there that I first saw a 2 page colored section showing the Space Marine chapters that participated in the "Badab War." The compendium never went into what exactly was the Badab War but judging from the number of Chapters involved, it must have been quite nasty. It is also from that chart that I see for the first time the Salamanders & Howling Griffons.

That's also the first place where I saw rule section for the Harlequins. I bought the original metal box set for $30 U.S and it had maybe under 20 metal Harlequin figures. Those were tough to paint but once done properly, I received "ooh's" and "aaah's" from a bunch of people. The Death Jesters were fun to do...

Regarding the Rogue Trader rules... we did enjoy the freedom it gave out, but as you said, it could be exploited. The same freedom that allowed me to create a squad of Dark Angel Jetpack (not Jump Pack) Space Marines, could allow me to equip these same guys with a whole set of Heavy Weapons and Targetters. But I didn't do that... that screams more cheese than the super characters with 3 different kinds of protective fields + Terminator Armor + Following Fire Weapon Attached to a Lascannon

[Warmaker]

It almost sounds as if the emporer is of a chaos influence every time i hear that. He is an abomination. It would be interesting if GW decided to actually "heal" the emporer and see what would happen once he woke up.

369026[/snapback]

It would be a mess at first then a consolidation and resurgence of the Imperium.

There would be a bit of Civil War, which would be necessary. The Space Marines, especially the Founding Chapters and their successors, I wager would readily align with the Emperor. Their loyalty is with the Emperor and mankind.

The ones that would be against the Emperor are those that wanted to hold on to what power they enjoyed. My guess would be remote governors with little contact with the Imperium or maybe some of the High Lords of Terra.

Once the Emperor settles any Civil War, there's a good chance in the resumption of the Great Crusade. The Imperium, ever since the Horus Heresy, had been lackluster and stale. Only in extremely rare instances, under the leadership of great military men like Macharius, were there great strides in the expansion and fighting for the Imperium. Before the Heresy, it was all about expansion and reclaiming lost worlds.

There would be a renewed fervor in the Space Marines, when they see that the Emperor walks again. Again for the Founding Chapters, it would be the greatest honor to take up where their original brothers once did. For the Dark Angels, they would have many reasons to be quite happy: They get a chance to attone on the battlefield in the eyes of the Emperor for their failings in the Heresey. They are also the FIRST Space Marine Chapter to be ever created under the Emperor's guidance. To be led by him would be a great honor for the Dark Angels.

[wolfx]

he Emperor is now the custodian of his race, and he alone bears the knowledge of its fate.  To this end the Emperor maintains strict control over the development of humanity and contributes directly to its survival by utilising his pwers.  He plays a vital role in space travel within the Imperium.  In order to steer a craft over great distances, a human navigator uses a mental homing signal, a sort of psychic beacon to guide him through warp space.  To provide a mental signal throughout human controlled space would not be possible to any ordinary psyker - his powers go beyond those of mortals.  Even so the strain of transmitting a contnuous signal would prove far too sternuous, and he merely concentrates his powers on directing a signal created by others.  These are the imperial servants known as Adeptus Astronomicua, psykers whose bodies and souls are leeched of energy. This energy is projected by the mind of the Emperor in the form of the psychic beaconknown as the Astronomican.

For the Emperor the only viable form of sustenance is the human life-force-soul and he has a great insatiable appetite.[/color] "

It goes on and on

369018[/snapback]

That's something new. It seems that the emperor himself is the core of warp travel. I see Astronomican mentioned a few times but never knew what it was. So is this to say should the emperor die, human worlds will be forever lost in space, with no means of interstellar travel?

Or if i read it again, does it mean like he himself is a beacon, so that from anywhere in human controlled space, a psyker can warp back to Terra easily instead of making multiple jumps towards terra?

[Phyrox]

That's something new. It seems that the emperor himself is the core of warp travel. I see Astronomican mentioned a few times but never knew what it was. So is this to say should the emperor die, human worlds will be forever lost in space, with no means of interstellar travel?

Or if i read it again, does it mean like he himself is a beacon, so that from anywhere in human controlled space, a psyker can warp back to Terra easily instead of making multiple jumps towards terra?

369265[/snapback]

The Former.

You still have to make multiple jumps. But the Emperor is an intersteller reference point. Without him...everyone in the impirium would be flying blind, and the empire would likely cease to be.