How Does Shoji Kawamori Rate As A Mecha Designer?

[UN Spacy]

He's had quite a history.

[Hikuro]

Agreed, he's got a tracked history of designing as simple as backgrounds for shows.

I remember an interview he had many years ago, he was asked how does he create his transformable mecha?

His response was this, he thinks of the robot as the alternate mode, not the original that transformers into a vehicle, but the other way around.

He would take his ideas and think how each piece could be transformed or manipulated to create something human like.

At first he would take his ideas and go "Hmmm okay here's the robot form, now lets turn it into an air plane" but he thought it didn't look believable at all. So he tried the oppisite, "Okay here's my fighter plane. Now what's gonna go where?"

Course his designs such as the VF-1 etc were all inspired by actual fighter planes in the 20th century and on.

But lets take escaflowne for example. A machine which can change into a skeleton like Dragon, interesting accomplishment. Now did he design the machine as a humanoid than figure out how it'd become a Dragon or did he do the oppisite? I'm sure it didn't take too much messing around.

But what I liked was his mobile suit designs for 0083 since he was the mechanical designer. He took the essence of the original series and blew it up to what was probably the most believable most aw seeing mecha I've ever seen someone do.

I think as a designer of Mecha Kawamori is good, I'm sure others say "blah" towards his work, but he's someone who thinks of the realism, and makes you go "Wow, how'd he do that?"

[yellowlightman]

Everything he's done since Macross Plus have been anorexic designs that look too similar to each other.

The VF-1 was the best design he's done and I doubt he'll ever come close to that level of awesomeness again.

[jenius]

The VFs and YFs from Macross are darn pretty machines. I think I actually like the YF-21 the most due to its Zentraedi influence. He took his sweetest bad guy mech and melded it with a good guy mech to create a bad-butt machine. I can't really comment on what he's done outside of Macross though... I'm not worldly enough in anime.

[Sundown]

Kawamori's incredible in his consistent ability to create transformable mecha that are sometimes radically different from each other... the man has amazing skills. But I haven't been a fan of most of his designs in the past decade. I still think the VF-1 the most elegant of designs, and most of his later stuff have the same themes going through them over and over, like cone heads, rounded out scoops and bevels, and bits reminscent of modern stealth aircraft. I'm not sure these elements work quite as well, and his change in style has even made him change the way he draws the VF-1. They're subtle changes, but his newer mechanical drawings just don't have that quality about them that made me fall in love with his old designs.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

He didn't design guymelef escaflowne.

The latest design he has made is THS-02 Convoy...the redesigned G1 Optimus prime. It came out looking detailed but rather chunky.

I think he is good and I do like his older designs. When I saw his macross 7 sketches I knew a lot of quality was lost in comparison to the older designs(the preproduction ones with the faces and guitars...YUCK!).

[Phyrox]

Hmm,

Most of his (non-Mac 7) stuff from his design works are good.

Everything else is not. Most of it is just forgettable. Nothing that stands out like the VF-1.

I like some of his Armored Core stuff, but there is not as much variety as there could be.

I hate to say it, but I'd call him a one-hit-wonder.

[LinxCrossq]

I really like what he did in Eureka Seven, the LFOs are amazing and quite different to most mechas out there. I didn't really like the Aquarion at first but it grow on me as the series progressed. Now the Production Model of the Aquarion, total uber awesomeness for getter robot.

[Graham]

Deinitely the best mecha designer out there IMO. Beats the pants of of hacks like Kunio Okawara. Even Hajime Katoki is overated IMO with the only designs of his I like being the Gundam Sentinel and Victory Gundam designs.

And don't forget he's done a heck of a lot of designs in his career, not just Macross, Armored Core, Aquarion & Eureaka 7.

His creator credits are listed on Macross Compendium.

I love all his Macross stuff. Even Macross 7 has some great designs such as the Full Armored VF-11C, VF-17D Nightmare and VF-22S.

Personally, I prefer his newer Macross designs like the YF-19, VF-0S/D, SV-51, VF-17S/D, VF-11B/C to the classic VF-1.

Graham

[haro genki]

Classic VF-1S is one of my favorite mech ever, so it's safe to say that Kawamori is one of my favorite mecha designers . Mamoru Nagano and Izubuchi are still #1 for me though, but Kawamori runs close second.

[Cruel Angel's Thesis]

Macross was one the anime i hold to my heart, growing up in the middle of nowhere in the Free State of Northren California there wasn't a lot to watch on TV, but there was plenty of translated anime for a young boy to watch. I enjoyed mecha anime back then as i do today. While i have not watched it all and have a so-so love for Gundam (considered the proper of watching for mecha gearheads). Kawamori bought out a lot of skill for Macross, it was his big test to see if he had it and he did. The popularity of Macross set off something that could not be stopped. Trying to recreate that is something hard and his designs show it, you can't top what made you famous. Kawamori is one of my favorites, he has done many mecha show designs and we all come back to Macross. He is in my top of mecha designers, but mostly cause of Macross, some of his other designs are good, but its Macross that i learned of him and respected him. So the groundbreaking he did in Macross is like a measuring stick and try as you may, nothing can really top a VF-1S with a Strike Package. Miyatake (sp?) is another i love and Matsumoto (he may do manga, but damn), the Arcadia is one great ship.

Cruel Angel's Thesis

[Boxer]

One of the most creative mech designers that I've ever seen... rivaled only by the modelmaking creativity of Makoto Kobayashi.

Even the Macross seven designs, when you consider the theme of the anime they're native to, are innovative and unique. Even though we think they're really out there, they could be a lot worse and really shine in what M7 is supposed to represent.

Anyway, what I'd like to know is how he got to his position as a Mecha designer. I hear about this position as a career now and again, but how does one get there? Where would one have to go to earn that title?

[azrael]

Anyway, what I'd like to know is how he got to his position as a Mecha designer. I hear about this position as a career now and again, but how does one get there? Where would one have to go to earn that title?

349309[/snapback]

You start drawing. Instead of drawing characters, you draw mechs.

[UN Spacy]

The latest design he has made is THS-02 Convoy...the redesigned G1 Optimus prime.  It came out looking detailed but rather chunky.

349239[/snapback]

Kawamori designed those?!?!?!?

[Sundown]

I personally dig Miyatake's work a whole lot more, and think he's a whole lot more consistent than Kawamori. Not only did he design one standout mecha in SDF Macross, he designed several:

The Tomahawk Destroid (my favorite)

The Mac II Monster (a close favorite)

The other destroids with exception to the Spartan (created by Kawamori which also happens to be my least favorite)

The Zentradi Ships

The Glaug

And of course, the Macross itself.

He also seems to share design credit on the YF-21 and the Q-Rau, as far as I can tell from Miyatake Design Works. Seems he was responsible for the 21's cockpit.

Yes, he was also responsible for some mediocre to horrible designs, like Battle 7 and the Protodevlin, but what can you do under the constraints of "lets make a silly show?"

Now I'll give Kawamori major props for pulling off the Koenig Monster, having it transform into not one, but two additional modes, both of which look very good. It's designed completely opposite to how he normally works, starting from the alternate vehicle mode. On top of that, he had to start with an old design that had never meant to transform, never looked like it could be anything but a mobile artillery piece, and manage not only to munge in into a passable shuttle, but squeezed out a battroid mode out of nowhere as well. The Koenig, as silly as its premise is, is an absolute marvel of design.

So all in all, my favorite of the Macross aesthetics is SDF by far, and Miyatake nearly designed the entire SDF world. Sure, the VF-1's its centerpiece, but I don't see myself repeatedly falling in love with nearly all of Kawamori's designs the way I do with Miyatake's.

[Gui]

Definitely a very good mecha designer IMO, maybe one of the best but I don't think that comparisons can really be made objectively between good artists: there's the good, the bad and the ugly overally, as long as a creator is good everything else is a matter of tastes and personnal preferences...

Kawamori did inovate a lot with the VF-1, we could almost say he invented something brand new in terms of 'creative method' but the transformable mecha concept is not his: it existed since some time, Kawamori gave it the 'realistic' feeling introduced by Gundam but he's the one who did this at the best at this time

Of course, mechanical design has greatly improved since the early 80s and I think we can safely assume that everything, or almost, has been done already. This is probably the reason why we don't see any really inovative things on this point... All new designs may be considered as some sort of 'recaps' of previous desings basically

Still, Kawamori did mark his time: it's one of the many signs of a great artist

[Mr March]

Shoji Kawamori is definitely up there in the top 10 mecha designers of all time, without a doubt. The VF-1 alone assures Kawamori his place in anime history as one of the great mecha designers, particularly due to the difficulty of designing a transforming mecha that looks aesthetically pleasing in all configurations. The YF-19, YF-21, and VF-11 from Macross Plus establishes him as even better. Kawamori also proved his ability to remain true to his own mecha style, yet create totally different themes for his mecha with Armored Core. In AC, Kawamori abandons the graceful lines and smooth aerodynamic curves of his previous work, opting instead for sharp angles and rugged, tank-like styles while still remaining true to his slim, long legged motif.

Kawamori is certainly one of the best designers of all time.

Edited December 3, 2005 by Mr March

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

So nobody thinks AIBO the dog is cool too?

I wish he made a transforming toy robot dog-like mecha similar to that thing in Gundam Seed Destiny. I think it was the Gaia Gundam.

I think humanoid and chicken-leg design are cool but he should do more spider and dog style mecha. (the typical insect like stuff Shirow does. Wouldn't you like to see more of this kind in macross?)

That reminds me I need to get the miyatake design works. Almost forgot about it.

As for the koenig: that is a work of art. 3 modes and all the weapons and parts still have a function and purpose to use in each mode. It has a heavy look to it in gerwalk mode, but it looks nice and slim in shuttle.

Aqaurion is cool for super robot. Still haven't even seen the non-super version since mahou is taking so long . I'm thinking of getting this toy. The fighters look like something from a Gradius shoot em up.

Edited December 3, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Black Valkyrie]

I agree about the Taka/Bandai VF-1 in the 80`s being the perfect transformable robot toy. The VF-1 or the VF-1A is my fave all time anime robot, second YF-19 and just the look of it in fighter mode and battroid mode makes you love it (if you are into this kind of stuff).

The first time I saw the Taka VF-1S in 84 before watching any mac or r.t. at that time I didn`t know how to transform it, its was something new to me back then but a few years later I had my first Bandai 1/55 VF-1S.

Overall Kawamori is a very talented mech designer, making the best anime transformable fighter of all time and the VF-1 has no age/timeless.

PS : THS-2 Convoy by Kawamori ?!

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

See the transformers thread. I think it looks a bit too wide chested. I like optimus to be slim. Kind of like how you see him in the marvel comics.

Edited December 3, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Black Valkyrie]

I read it, thanks

[F-ZeroOne]

Kawamori designed the VF-1 Valkyrie; if he had done nothing else with his life, if people from planet Oni had descended and whisked him off into space, he would still be one of the greatest mecha designers of all time. He has his off-days - all greats do - but when hes at the top of his game, hes almost untouchable.

[promethuem5]

Mac+, Destroids, and Crusher Joe

[valkyrietestpilot]

he was the only designer to create a mech that has held my attention & adoration for 22 years now.i just feel that he perfectly blended a touch of humanity & realism to the vf-1 and it works.it's believable in the way it transforms,but still holds a "used" feel.dirt,burn marks and scoring make it look like it actually goes to work every day.i love the way it seems to have a living human soul when it moves in battroid mode.sure,the pilot may add the humanity,but i feel the machine exudes it's own too.he's definately my favorite mecha designer of all time because he has designed the vf-1 with the true soul of an artist.those that appreciate art know what i'm talking about.the artists vision is more than just what's visible in front of you,it's a feeling too.

[Boxer]

Anyway, what I'd like to know is how he got to his position as a Mecha designer. I hear about this position as a career now and again, but how does one get there? Where would one have to go to earn that title?

349309[/snapback]

You start drawing. Instead of drawing characters, you draw mechs.

349319[/snapback]

So does this mean that since I draw mechs already, some company somewhere will hire me for my designs so I can 'officially' have a career as a 'mech designer?'

I'm seriously seeking to find a way to get into this profession, and I'd like to know how to get there. I think this is a good place to ask, since Kawamori is obviously sucessful. But how did he do it?

[azrael]

So does this mean that since I draw mechs already, some company somewhere will hire me for my designs so I can 'officially' have a career as a 'mech designer?'

I'm seriously seeking to find a way to get into this profession, and I'd like to know how to get there. I think this is a good place to ask, since Kawamori is obviously sucessful. But how did he do it?

349556[/snapback]

In that case....you need to set up a portfolio. Then join an art studio/production house (like Lucasarts/ILM or WETA). That's the easy way. Another way is to start designing products. Syd Mead (of Blade Runner/Aliens/Turn A Gundam...) started as designer for Ford Motors and various other companies and ended up as a production designer.

Kawamori made it by pitching his idea to Big West. And since then, he's done lots of projects, not his own.

Look for jobs in designing and see where that take you. But the best thing to do would be to have a portfolio if you are seriously considering a career in design.

Edited December 4, 2005 by azrael

[daeudi]

I am in shock! I find the title of this thread offensive!

The Froating Head is SUPREME!

[Zinjo]

I am in shock! I find the title of this thread offensive!

The Froating Head is SUPREME!

349569[/snapback]

Then avert your eyes...

[Zinjo]

I personally dig Miyatake's work a whole lot more, and think he's a whole lot more consistent than Kawamori.  Not only did he design one standout mecha in SDF Macross, he designed several:

The Glaug

349327[/snapback]

Sorry IMO that was the only weak link in the Macross show were the Glaugs. They were ill conceived and not an effective weapon by any standards.

I may not be the biggest fan of Mac 7, but even the Varuta's "modified" VF fighters were more of a threat to the humans than the glaugs...

Edited December 6, 2005 by Zinjo

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Yes fellas, THS-02 is by Kawamori! Knew SOMETHING was familiar with that design!

And for portfolios, Alice Carter came down for a lecture and told us that for ILM they do NOT want to see star wars stuff if you apply to them for a job or internship as a concept artist. They want to see that you can draw. Draw everything around you, life drawing is the most integral thing.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

But the variable glaug looks cool though! ;D

Now all we need is a varialbe regult, and some more variable destroid. I liked that octos thing in macross 0 - good to see transformable vehicles in different environments.

[Zinjo]

But the variable glaug looks cool though! ;D

Now all we need is a varialbe regult, and some more variable destroid. I liked that octos thing in macross 0 - good to see transformable vehicles in different environments.

349845[/snapback]

I didn't say anything about variable glaugs, those were cool indeed, but not featured in SDF Macross...

[Boxer]

I liked all of the Zjentohaledy mecha, even the Glaugs. The exception though is the detailed-up images. I liked the Zjent mecha the smooth way they were presented in the TV series.

[Gui]

I'm very fond of zentran designs aswell: they really looked ahead of their time overally

True, the Glaug may look out of place for some compared to other mechas in the same show but it's still one of my favorite mecha designs ever: it has very smooth but also very agressive lines/colors in the same time... That's not easy to do

Edited December 7, 2005 by Gui

[Sundown]

Not sure there's even any apology needed for the Glaug. It looks like a more angular, advanced, better armed version of the Regult, which is exactly what it's supposed to be. I suppose if there's any criticism of it, is that it's just a little too angular compared with the rest of the Zentradi designs and breaks away a little bit from the organic theme. Even so, to me, it's one of the most memorable designs around. Variable coneheads have nothing on it.