The Doctor Who Thread

[Noriko Takaya]

Theres one doctor missed from that list: Peter Cushing (yes, that Peter Cushing) who played the role in two sixties Doctor Who movies. Richard E. Grant also played the role for a BBC web-series, and various well-known British actors including Rowan Atkinson and Joanna Lumley cameo'd in the role for a BBC charity special. The list above, though, represents what might be regarded as the "canon" list for the series. The new series follow on from all the other TV series, although Doctor Who continuity is a bit loose - there have been at least two origin stories for the Daleks, for example.

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There have been two other actors who have also played the Doctor, both on screen and on stage. Richard Hurndall played the first Doctor in "The Five Doctors" and Trevor Martin played the Doctor in the stage play "Doctor Who and the Daleks: Seven Keys to Doomsday".

[valk1j]

The other part, where he stole the body of someone else, was when the Doctor visited Traken, where Nyssa was introduced. The Master was looking for a way to extend his life once more, using his TARDIS, disguised as a demon from Traken lore known as the Melkur, to gain control of the Traken Keepership. The Keeper was able to extend his life by diverting power from what was known as the Source, which was generated by all living beings in the Traken Union. And this was why the Master went to Traken. However, the Doctor foiled his plans, but not before the Master was able to tap some of the Source's energy to possess Tremas' (Nyssa's father) body. In effect, I think the Master would then have become human to an extent, stealing a body that was not Gallifreyan.

I do not think the Master had any other way of extending his own regeneration cycle, but I think the Time Lords knew of a way to do it. I think one of the later Peter Davison or Colin Baker episodes stated that the Master was promised to have his regeneration cycles renewed if he helped to destroy or help the Doctor. I cannot be sure which episode this was, but I have a feeling it may be "The Five Doctors".

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It was "The Five Doctors", you're right about the Keeper of Traken episode, I couldn't remember it fully.

Edited March 15, 2006 by valk1j

[Noriko Takaya]

Thanks for clearing that up. Sometimes my knowledge of older Whovian history astounds even me.

[JELEINEN]

I wonder if K-9 is going to get a redesign (Hope not...) the TARDIS got it, The screwdriver got it, and so did the Dalek. I'm really hoping for some continuity tie-in by bringing back some of the older costumes/props (like the cybermen), to furter tie the new in with the old.

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When they showed him in the previews at the end of the Christmas Invasion, he looked the same, but in pretty bad shape.

[Noriko Takaya]

You know, now that we have a Who thread, I came across these 6 CD titles a little while back called "Kaldor City". Basically, the story follows the episode "Robots of Death", and its follow-up novel "Corpse Marker" both of which were written by Chris Boucher. It seems that they have taken elements from both Doctor Who and Blake's 7 and mixed them together. Paul Darrow is in the series as well and Scott Fredericks reprises his role as Carnell the psychostrategist who worked for Servalan in the 2nd season episode "Weapon" from Blake's 7. Has anyone heard about these? If so, are they any good. If they are still available, I may try to get them. Below are images of the CD covers and a link to where they are.

http://www.kaldorcity.com/audios/occam.html

[F-ZeroOne]

Woo. A Dr. Who thread

After special-ordering the series and watching it, I liked the new who. Really sad to see the switch in doctors though... the 'new' doctor doesn't look as promising in the slightest >_>

Is that based on the very last scene of the 2005 series? Give him some time, hes pretty good in the Christmas special, although a bit more "traditional" than the Eccleston take on the character (that may change though, hes barely had more than half-an-hours screen time so far!). Also, Tennants versions look has a few resonances if you're British; he looks vaguely like a university professor but at the same time also a bit like a "mod" from the 70s...

Bringing back the Daleks was an interesting move, but I'm surprised they didn't resolve the Dalek Civil war (Rememberance of the Daleks, 7th doctor). And what about Davros? He DID escape... is he just floating in space sometime during 1969 then?

I suspect its unlikely we'll see Davros back for some time. He'd make a good movie villain though, wouldn't he...?

 

and surprised that an OLDER cyberman helmet appeared instead of just pulling out a newer one to use.

Reasons, my son, reasons for that.

 

I also liked the stories before that captain guy showed up. Didn't like him really >_>

Really? Hes proven to be a popular charcater here, so much so a spin-off series "Torchwood" will be featuring him in a lead role.

 

I wonder if K-9 is going to get a redesign (Hope not...)

Almost all shots released so far is that K-9 is getting the same kind of make-over as the Dalek i.e. basically the same, just updated a touch.

Something that US/Rest of the World watchers of this show might not be aware of is that, by BBC standards, Doctor Who is a big series and was a massive risk for the BBC, which have traditionally been a bit stingy towards SF. One report I read stated that it costs over a million pounds per episode, which is a huge amount for a BBC drama and on a par with their widely acclaimed wildlife programmes (and those are often co-productions, offsetting some of the cost). Just about everyone has been amazed by its success.

Incidentally, those suffering "Who" withdrawl systems might want to check out the recent and also excellent BBC series "Life on Mars", about a modern detective who gets transported back in time to 1970s Britain (by means as yet not entirely clear). Its vaguely SF, and very well written. However, it is somewhat immersed in British TV culture of the past thirty years, so you may wish to check out British police series like "Dixon of Dock Green", "The Sweeny" and "The Professionals" to get some idea of whats being sent up on occasion...

Edited March 15, 2006 by F-ZeroOne

[Boxer]

Seeing old cybermen show up would be awesome.

Haven't gotten a hold of the christmas special yet. As I said we purchased the first season from the UK, so no christmas special on it Looking forward to seeing new goodies... but not too optimistic about the new Dr. We'll see.

Noriko: Did Darrow reprise his role as Avon in that series? As another B-7 fan, it would be of interest to see a tie-in between the two series. A shame they trashed the liberator and effectively killed the series.

Should also say that of all the old sci-fi series to get a recent revamp (BSG, ST:E, etx), Dr. Who is by far the most sucessful comeback in terms of story, chracters, and design.

[JELEINEN]

Noriko: Did Darrow reprise his role as Avon in that series? As another B-7 fan, it would be of interest to see a tie-in between the two series. A shame they trashed the liberator and effectively killed the series.

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In a lot of ways, I thought the post-Liberator series was better.

[Noriko Takaya]

Noriko: Did Darrow reprise his role as Avon in that series? As another B-7 fan, it would be of interest to see a tie-in between the two series. A shame they trashed the liberator and effectively killed the series.

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No. He plays a character called Kaston Iago. Russell Hunter, who was in the story "Robots of Death," reprises his role as Uvanov. Since the product description states that Scott Fredericks reprises his Blake's 7 role in a story which obviously takes place in the Whovian universe, I don't see why other characters can't be in it.

Edited March 16, 2006 by Noriko Takaya

[Boxer]

I guess it should be noted that Terrance Dicks created both series, so I suppose the masterminds behind the Whovian-verse could inevitably fit both series in....

Then again, Blake's Seven doesn't really accomodate the existance of other races, does it? Maybe they're the 'second' bountiful human empire... or something to that effect. The history of the future has never been established

As a matter of fact, doesn't the new series break cannon in a number of ways? As I said earlier we never saw the real end of the Dalek Civil war (Cyberdaleks V. 'natural' daleks), the cybermen may or may not be on the virtual edge of extinction, and nothing is said of what became of the Movellans.

I also wonder, if the Doctor is the 'last Time Lord', then what happend to his other incarnations? Were they elliminated from the timestream also or could we face another 'Five doctors' scenario? (Dissapointing though since Doctors 1-4 are effectively unable to participate).

[Noriko Takaya]

I guess it should be noted that Terrance Dicks created both series, so I suppose the masterminds behind the Whovian-verse could inevitably fit both series in....

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Terrance Dicks did not create Blake's 7 or Doctor Who. Blake's 7 was the brain child of Terry Nation, creator of the Daleks, while Doctor Who was brought into existence by Sydney Newman.

[Boxer]

Ah right... sorry about that mixup...

Still, the Daleks are iconic to who, and Blake's Seven was (For a time) a good TV series...

What are eveyone's reactions to the redesigned Dalek? I'm surprised they went with the siren ears of the movie. Wasn't too happy about the emperor Dalek design but eh, beggers can't be choosers.

And what happened to the cool Imperial Dalek ships we see in RotD? They were replaced by gaudy saucers... why? Does it go with the 'alien invasion' factor? or is it simply becase we've heard of more 'Dalek Saucers' (Twice that I know of, INvasion of Earth and one of the 3rd doctor stories) than conventional spacecraft?

[Noriko Takaya]

Well, the first 2 episodes of Eccleston's version of the Doctor have aired and I have to admit, I really liked it. The excitement and anticipation I always had when I was going to watch a new episode was there, and I am happy to say I was not dissapointed. However, questions do arise. Sylvester McCoy's portrayal of the Doctor is the last good memory I had of the original series. I'm talking about the episode "Survival" and not that crappy movie version which introduced McGann's 8th Doctor. So, where the hell did Ace go? I know there were a group of novels published after "Survival" aired and there were also books featuring McGann's Doctor. But I have not read any of them. So, where did Ace go? It is hinted at in the novelization of "The Curse of Fenric" that she remained behind in 19th century Paris where she fell in love with Count Sorin, who she was destined to meet. Then we have this Time War thing. What the hell happened to the 8th Doctor? How were the Time Lords and Gallifrey destroyed? Are we ever going to get an explanation as to how McGann's Doctor regenerated as Eccleston's version? Inquiring minds would like to know. If this is all explained later on in the series, then do not tell me. If there are books dedicated to this story, please post the titles. I have been out of the loop for a while, so I need to catch up.

[MrDisco]

you can now pre-order the Christmas special on DVD which also comes with the first ep of the '06 season from the BBC Dr.Who website. ships sometime in May.

[F-ZeroOne]

Well, the first 2 episodes of Eccleston's version of the Doctor have aired and I have to admit, I really liked it. The excitement and anticipation I always had when I was going to watch a new episode was there, and I am happy to say I was not dissapointed. However, questions do arise. Sylvester McCoy's portrayal of the Doctor is the last good memory I had of the original series. I'm talking about the episode "Survival" and not that crappy movie version which introduced McGann's 8th Doctor. So, where the hell did Ace go?

381558[/snapback]

I am mostly familiar with the TV incarnation of Who so I can't provide a complete answer, but I seem to recall that a) reading recently in a UK SF magazine that Ace is now dead (killed in a novelisation; how "canon" this is I don't know) and b) I believe the long running Doctor Who magazine covered the fate of the 8th Doctor and the Time War, although I don't know again if this is official and if the magazine Time War is the same as the TV series version.

Noriko, have you tried this website? It can probably answer a great many Who-related questions:

http://www.gallifreyone.com/

Edited March 18, 2006 by F-ZeroOne

[Noriko Takaya]

I am mostly familiar with the TV incarnation of Who so I can't provide a complete answer, but I seem to recall that a) reading recently in a UK SF magazine that Ace is now dead (killed in a novelisation; how "canon" this is I don't know)...

381667[/snapback]

I wouldn't think that it is canon, but the BBC includes the 1995 movie as part of the Doctor's timeline, so it may be. I just find it kind of odd that they would kill Ace off when Ian Briggs (who wrote the screenplay and novelization for "Fenric") established her eventual future as the grandmother of Sorin, known as one of the "Wolves of Fenric". This is even hinted at in the actual televised story. So if they are changing things around, maybe her dying is part of an alternate timeline.

[JsARCLIGHT]

All I have ever seen was the TV series on Public Access TV back in Chicago when I was at school... from what I recall of Ace she and the Sylvester McCoy Doctor where the last to be seen then all of a sudden the 96 movie came out with McCoy but no Ace. I just assumed that so much time had passed that the actor who played Ace was either too old to pull it off or unavailable so they just "skipped" her.

Then again I have been going under the assumption that the 96 movie was an American one-off that was not supposed to tie in with the franchise. I always thought that Who was dead and the movie was simply the last gasp of the franchise in an attempt to port it to the states. The movie always seemed more like a failed pilot and less like a movie if you know what I mean.

[Boxer]

Well given the fact that the '8th doctor' has only just that movie as an appearance is kinda evidence to that fact. Still, he's considered canon by many circles... though you know since this 9th doctor hasn't called himself 'the 9th', I suppose they could just bump off the movie to make room for anothe regeneration.

Could have done better remaking the Dalek invasion of earth than doing the '96 plot.

And speaking of Daleks and inavsions, what do people here say to the rumor of Daleks V. Cybermen for the second season finale? The cybermen exist in the new series (not impressed with the design...), but how and in what position remains to be seen (after all the cybermen were on the verge of extinction in the stories they have appeared in).

[Noriko Takaya]

Surprisingly, the movie did very well in the UK than it did here in the US. From what I understand, the scene of the Doctor kissing his 'girlfriend' and the statement of him being half-human were pressed into being by Fox. The movie was supposed to start a new series as the BBC by that time was looking for outside influences to produce their properties, which is why the new show is produced by BBC Wales instead of the original studio. However, it was doomed to failure as the general American public has never been big on Doctor Who. I mean, how could it be? You have a series which has been around since the 60's with a very detailed and rich elaborate history. This is something which George Lucas should have paid attention to with his Star Wars films. As for Sophie Aldred, I met her a few years back and she did look a bit older, but not much. She was a very nice woman and very patient with the fans.

Edit: You know, I noticed that one of the episodes is called "Dalek". How in God's name did the BBC wrangle the rights to use them from Terry Nation's estate? I decided to write a book invloving the fourth Doctor when the BBC was asking for new adventures from the fans to keep the series going. I submitted the story, even had permission from the creators of characters not held by the BBC, but was flatly rejected by Terry Nation on all accounts because he stated to me over the telephone that there was never going to be another Dalek story for Doctor Who. He was apparently displeased with the way the Daleks had been featured as of late, especially with the last story "Revelation of the Daleks". The BBC must have paid a small fortune to Nation's wife for the rights.

Oh, I also wanted to share some of my autographs which I obtained over the years. Here they are:

Edited March 19, 2006 by Noriko Takaya

[Boxer]

That's true. In a way Dr. Who is to the UK as Star Trek is to us. It's bound to do better in the UK than the US because nearly everyone in the UK has heard of it, and many currently in the Who staff 'grew up with' doctor who as a constant.

I'm glad it's out of the rut that it was in for a while. It's a good replacement for the failed Enterprise and less-than-satisfactory battlestar galactica.

[F-ZeroOne]

Edit: You know, I noticed that one of the episodes is called "Dalek". How in God's name did the BBC wrangle the rights to use them from Terry Nation's estate?

381818[/snapback]

It was a very close-run thing, according to newspaper accounts. For some time it seemed that the rights were not going to be released, and one of the main tabloid papers here ran a "Save Our Daleks" campaign (can you imagine that? The Daleks need saving!). I guess someone decided a) Doctor Who and the Daleks are almost the same property (Daleks having appeared as early as the second Doctor Who TV story, back in the 60s) and b) as you say, one massive pile of cash.

Edited March 19, 2006 by F-ZeroOne

[F-ZeroOne]

That's true. In a way Dr. Who is to the UK as Star Trek is to us. It's bound to do better in the UK than the US because nearly everyone in the UK has heard of it, and many currently in the Who staff 'grew up with' doctor who as a constant.

I'm glad it's out of the rut that it was in for a while. It's a good replacement for the failed Enterprise and less-than-satisfactory battlestar galactica.

381822[/snapback]

By "rut", do you mean the hiatus the show was on until the 2005 series?

Also, thanks for the above comments - its does me good to hear "our" Doctor compared to those high quality shows! Its interesting to get a new perspective on what is, to many UK people of my generation, a national treasure.

[Boxer]

Hehe...

I was first introduced to Dr. Who on the fifth doctor story 'englightenment'. It's grown on me ever since... my dad wasn't sure if I'd like it because (being a trek fan at the time), it had no starship enterprise

The thing that I like most about Dr. Who compared to ENT and the new BSG is the quality writing that went into the episodes. At least for the '05 series, it had a perfect blend of tie-ins, humor, and drama that made the series all the more an awesome comeback from it's hiatus.

In fact, if we had Dr. Who in the states, it would be the only science fiction show I'd be watching now. Nothing else deserves my attention. But fortunately for us, it's UK produced, and not mangled by american writers and directors

Edited March 20, 2006 by Boxer

[F-ZeroOne]

Hehe...

I was first introduced to Dr. Who on the fifth doctor story 'englightenment'. It's grown on me ever since... my dad wasn't sure if I'd like it because (being a trek fan at the time), it had no starship enterprise

The thing that I like most about Dr. Who compared to ENT and the new BSG is the quality writing that went into the episodes.

382280[/snapback]

Well, Russell T. Davies - lead writer/producer - on the 05/06 series is pretty much God of TV writers in the UK at the moment; several of the other writers are well known - Paul Cornell has, I believe, done several Dr. Who books, and a number of other writers represent the cream of UK comedy writing talent. Also lined up for the third series is the well known UK actor/author/writer Stephen Fry, possibly the smartest man on the planet...

Dr. Who also had Douglas Adams on the script-writing roster at one time, and he was responsible for "City of Death", sometimes said to be the best Who story ever written.

[Boxer]

Adams also wrote Destiny of the Daleks, which was a good episode. You can tell because some of his Hitchhiker's guide characters are mentioned here and there. The Movellans were a good enemy too... pitty they weren't as prevalent as the Daleks were. The Mechanoids were interesting, also.

Seeing Sarah again for this new series is going to be interesting. It's a shame she's only going to be in one episode and not travelling with the Doctor again... that would be a first. Then again there's always K-9...

[Otaku-Smeghead]

Funny no one mentioned the Audio Drama's

http://www.bigfinish.com for more info on the 8th Dr

[Noriko Takaya]

Adams also wrote Destiny of the Daleks, which was a good episode.

382679[/snapback]

Where do you get your information on Doctor Who? The screenplay for "Destiny of the Daleks" was written by Terry Nation, whereas the novelization was written by Terrance Dicks. "Steerike Two..."

[F-ZeroOne]

Just a heads-up, its looking resonably definite that the new, David Tennant, Doctor Who series will start airing in the UK on April 15th, which coincides with the Easter holiday here.

[Doktor Gonzo]

Okay, let's move on to the real question:

Anybody else suspecting/hoping that when Tony Head shows up in "School Reunion", it will be as a new incarnation of the Doctor's old nemesis, The Master?

Things supporting this:

-the casting has been rumored forever in fan speculation and the tabloid press

-that title is pretty suspicious, given the Doctor's and Master's shared history

-the name the Master uses (and/or the credit for the actor playing him) has frequently been a wordplay hinting at his presence in the episode - AH's character of Mr. Finch, "the Headmaster" could easily be hinting at "Head[ is the ]Master"

-the same ep will also bring us Sarah Jane and K-9, might as well throw some more old "friends" in

-it'd just be SO damn cool

Things against:

-Davies and the BBC have publically denied the rumor

-it's been a rumor forever in fan speculation and the tabloid press

-the "reunion" of the title is probably just Sarah and K9, and it takes place at a "school"

-it'd be TOO damn cool - and hence the BBC would never do it...

[F-ZeroOne]

Its possible, but I suspect we'd have heard something definite by now. The combined power of the British tabloid press and the Doctor Who fan network would put the CIA to shame! Also, I suspect its too "obvious" for the current production team - I suspect if The Master does return, it will be in a way we don't suspect...

[Boxer]

Ah, my Who knowledge isn't really up to stuff. It was just an assumption.

I wonder how the new Doctor will take to seeing Sarah Jane again. This is the first time (outside of the "# doctors' episodes) that a former companion has come back to meet the doctor again. And after six regenerations, do you think he'll remember her and K-9?

[Doktor Gonzo]

Ah, my Who knowledge isn't really up to stuff. It was just an assumption.

I wonder how the new Doctor will take to seeing Sarah Jane again. This is the first time (outside of the "# doctors' episodes) that a former companion has come back to meet the doctor again. And after six regenerations, do you think he'll remember her and K-9?

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Well, we know he at least remembers the robomutt (the Season 2 teaser trailer has him exclaiming "K-9!!!" in a very delighted-sounding tone of voice as it rolls into view...)

[JELEINEN]

I'm kind of curious to see how Rose and Sarah Jane will interact. There's so many ways they can go with this.

[Doktor Gonzo]

I'm kind of curious to see how Rose and Sarah Jane will interact.  There's so many ways they can go with this.

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Is it just me, or does Old Sarah Jane somehow now look exactly like the President from BSG...?

[Noriko Takaya]

Sarah Jane rules as does K-9! I can't wait to see them again, but for now I have to wait and get through the first series on Sci Fi.