Robotech and HG license debates

[Gui]

At least, he put in spaces and punctuations

[The Shade]

MEMO1DOMINION, you can turn the caps lock off....

354395[/snapback]

My ears are still ringing.

[JB0]

He did it almost 2 decades ago. And it made him very wealthy(that wealth is what made his current political power possible). He didn't know he was gonna become el presidente.

ACTUALLY, HE FELT THE HEAT COMING..WHAT BETTER WAY TO PARDON YOURSELF THAN BEING PRESIDENT.

HE HA SBEEN UNDER ATTACK FROM OTHER PARTY'S AGAINST HIM. SO THIS ATTACK IS NOTHING NEW FOR HIM, OR HIS "FRIENDS". NOTHING NEW THAN POLITICAL ALIGATIONS.

SAME THAT GOES HERE IN U.S WITH CURRENT PRESIDENT......

EX:

MEMOGATE, SKIPPING SERVICE, LEFTIS NEWS AND SO ON.

354390[/snapback]

Whoa, US politics cropped up. I can feel the flames already.

[Duke Togo]

Only morons and pedophiles argue about politics on anime message boards.

[JB0]

Only morons and pedophiles argue about politics on anime message boards.

354752[/snapback]

Most of the people on the internet ARE morons though.

Hell, most of the peopel in the world are.

We DO seem to have a relatively low percentage here, though.

[Noriko Takaya]

I'm too lazy to search through this thread, but has anyone heard about Takara's takeover of Tatsunoko Productions?

[azrael]

I'm too lazy to search through this thread, but has anyone heard about Takara's takeover of Tatsunoko Productions?

359319[/snapback]

Yeah, what about it? There isn't much to say about it. (Here's the article BTW, for the rest of you: http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/article.php?id=6985). Studio Nue still owns the lineart and creators' rights. Takara now owns the animation and merchandising rights. The original ruling still holds on who owns what, just that it looks like Takara now owns what Tatsunoko owned.

Edited January 12, 2006 by azrael

[Pat Payne]

I'm too lazy to search through this thread, but has anyone heard about Takara's takeover of Tatsunoko Productions?

359319[/snapback]

Yeah, what about it? There isn't much to say about it. (Here's the article BTW, for the rest of you: http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/article.php?id=6985). Studio Nue still owns the lineart and creators' rights. Takara now owns the animation and merchandising rights. The original ruling still holds on who owns what, just that it looks like Takara now owns what Tatsunoko owned.

359456[/snapback]

Although, as I asked earlier in the thread, it'll be interesting to see how Takara's going to handle the license. Will they either deem it worth fighting over, or let the matter drop and settle with Big West, feeling that (In Japan, at least, where IINM, Takara is focusing all of their energies in raiding the old Tatsunoko licences for toy merchandising) Macross just isn't that big of a draw compared with Gatchaman or Time Bokan or other fully-owned and not-litigious Tat properties?

[1st Border Red Devil]

Big West's Southern Cross entry.....

[azrael]

Big West's Southern Cross entry.....

360136[/snapback]

And?

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encycloped...nime.php?id=450

Production:

Big West

Tatsunoko

Edited January 13, 2006 by azrael

[waters7]

IIRC The Super Dimension banner was something that Big West came out with. Tatsunoko obtained the rights to develop a new series (Southern Cross) with the Super Dimension banner from scratch, where as the other two Super Dimension series (Macross & Orguss) were developed by Studio Nue & Artland.

All Super Dimension series were produced by Big West

Regards...

[me3]

MEMO1DOMINION, you can turn the caps lock off....

354395[/snapback]

That idiot does that at rt.com as well. Very annoying. He should be banned...

[SpacyAce2012]

I heard a few days ago that Harmony Gold U.S.A. has stated,some time back, that it is through with using Macross imagery in Robotech. HG will concentrate on Mospeada designs from now on (assuming that the Shadow Chronicles works out).

Is there any truth to this? And does it somehow relate to the Japanese court decision that Studio Nue is the owners of the imagery/artwork in the original Macross?

If so, this is a tacit admission on HG's part that their Macross licence doesn't cover all the bases that they claim. Even in regards to the original series.

It would also give more credience to those who feel that FASA had some legal ground to stand on in the suit with HG, hence the conspiracy theories of the real reason for an out of court settlement and non-disclosure deal.

[Pat Payne]

I heard a few days ago that Harmony Gold U.S.A. has stated,some time back, that it is through with using Macross imagery in Robotech. HG will concentrate on Mospeada designs from now on (assuming that the Shadow Chronicles works out).

Is there any truth to this? And does it somehow relate to the Japanese court decision that Studio Nue is the owners of the imagery/artwork in the original Macross?

If so, this is a tacit admission on HG's part that their Macross licence doesn't cover all the bases that they claim. Even in regards to the original series.

It would also give more credience to those who feel that FASA had some legal ground to stand on in the suit with HG, hence the conspiracy theories of the real reason for an out of court settlement and non-disclosure deal.

370126[/snapback]

None of that would surprise me greatly, Spacy. IMHO, it seems that outside of the original RT series, most of the animated efforts (leaving out all of the subsidiary merchandising/tie-in comics and what not) every RT effort seemed to capitaliuze more on the Mospeada property (which was Tatsunoko's) and Southern Cross (which none of the warring parties seems to give a hoot about). Now, you'd have to get out the rubber hose and put Room 101 on standby to get anyone from HG to explicitly admit that it may have to do something with the BW/Tat legal mess. I'd say "maybe," as, OTHO, most of their attempts from Sentinels on have also been intended to be re-imported into Japan as well, where Tat would then re-dub them to make them direct or indirect sequels to Mospeada, necessitating an almost total excision of any Macross imagery. perhaps, if they did make the statement, it was to say, in effect: We're not going to go back and do a "prequel" about the "SDF-1," since we'd also like to sell this shite in Nippon.

As for FASA vs. HG, maybe there was a legal conspiracy. But Occam's razor could still hold: Nobody in a legal battle wants their dirty laundry aired (even if it isn't particularly damaging) and HG had some legal power behid them (they had PlayMates and, tacitly, Tat on their side) and so to prevent trade secrets that may have been part of discovery from leaking, they asked for the records to be sealed. It's not, IIRC, an uncommon part of a settlement deal in corporate litigation.

[me3]

I heard a few days ago that Harmony Gold U.S.A. has stated,some time back, that it is through with using Macross imagery in Robotech. HG will concentrate on Mospeada designs from now on (assuming that the Shadow Chronicles works out).

Is there any truth to this? And does it somehow relate to the Japanese court decision that Studio Nue is the owners of the imagery/artwork in the original Macross?

If so, this is a tacit admission on HG's part that their Macross licence doesn't cover all the bases that they claim. Even in regards to the original series.

It would also give more credience to those who feel that FASA had some legal ground to stand on in the suit with HG, hence the conspiracy theories of the real reason for an out of court settlement and non-disclosure deal.

370126[/snapback]

None of that would surprise me greatly, Spacy. IMHO, it seems that outside of the original RT series, most of the animated efforts (leaving out all of the subsidiary merchandising/tie-in comics and what not) every RT effort seemed to capitaliuze more on the Mospeada property (which was Tatsunoko's) and Southern Cross (which none of the warring parties seems to give a hoot about). Now, you'd have to get out the rubber hose and put Room 101 on standby to get anyone from HG to explicitly admit that it may have to do something with the BW/Tat legal mess. I'd say "maybe," as, OTHO, most of their attempts from Sentinels on have also been intended to be re-imported into Japan as well, where Tat would then re-dub them to make them direct or indirect sequels to Mospeada, necessitating an almost total excision of any Macross imagery. perhaps, if they did make the statement, it was to say, in effect: We're not going to go back and do a "prequel" about the "SDF-1," since we'd also like to sell this shite in Nippon.

As for FASA vs. HG, maybe there was a legal conspiracy. But Occam's razor could still hold: Nobody in a legal battle wants their dirty laundry aired (even if it isn't particularly damaging) and HG had some legal power behid them (they had PlayMates and, tacitly, Tat on their side) and so to prevent trade secrets that may have been part of discovery from leaking, they asked for the records to be sealed. It's not, IIRC, an uncommon part of a settlement deal in corporate litigation.

370308[/snapback]

Perhaps this is why HG avoids the big questions. Sentinels was stripped of everything macross. The recent comic series is almost unrecognizable as robotech, except for the alphas. The macross characters are also unrecognizable. But why then did they have to change the sdf-3? It looks like two tokugawa cruisers strapped together now. Was this just the artists' decision, or part of the legal battle as well? Could this be part of the reason that they cannot find a distributor for the Shadow Chronicles? Nobody wants to touch it until this mess clears up?

[waters7]

Perhaps this is why HG avoids the big questions. Sentinels was stripped of everything macross. The recent comic series is almost unrecognizable as robotech, except for the alphas. The macross characters are also unrecognizable. But why then did they have to change the sdf-3? It looks like two tokugawa cruisers strapped together now. Was this just the artists' decision, or part of the legal battle as well? Could this be part of the reason that they cannot find a distributor for the Shadow Chronicles? Nobody wants to touch it until this mess clears up?

According to Tommy Yune, one of the main reasons why the Macross saga characters look different is because they do not want the new fans to get confuse with what is Robotech and what is Macross. The new administration is trying to get away from the similaraties between characters between the Macross saga and SDF Macross.

If you ask me, this is a good thing because the last thing you want (as a fan of either universe) is that confussion about what is Robotech and what is Macross.

Finally, stupid hardheaded purists for both sides have something less to argue about.

[Alpha1]

Finally, stupid hardheaded purists for both sides have something less to argue about.

Amen to that! One thing that I'd like to add is that if there is room in the world for both Coke and Pepsi, certainly there is enough room for Robotech and Macross?

[the white drew carey]

Perhaps this is why HG avoids the big questions. Sentinels was stripped of everything macross. The recent comic series is almost unrecognizable as robotech, except for the alphas. The macross characters are also unrecognizable. But why then did they have to change the sdf-3? It looks like two tokugawa cruisers strapped together now. Was this just the artists' decision, or part of the legal battle as well? Could this be part of the reason that they cannot find a distributor for the Shadow Chronicles? Nobody wants to touch it until this mess clears up?

According to Tommy Yune, one of the main reasons why the Macross saga characters look different is because they do not want the new fans to get confuse with what is Robotech and what is Macross. The new administration is trying to get away from the similaraties between characters between the Macross saga and SDF Macross.

If you ask me, this is a good thing because the last thing you want (as a fan of either universe) is that confussion about what is Robotech and what is Macross.

Finally, stupid hardheaded purists for both sides have something less to argue about.

370544[/snapback]

While that is a plausible explanation, I have been up and down this debate more times than you can shake a stick at, including transcribing many of Tummy Yune's statements in the beginning of the whole debacle. For all that I have been through I can tell you this, Tommy Yune is a business man first and foremost. While it is my personal opinion that he is one of the worst, and uncreative, comic artists ever to get paid for what he does- It is the honest truth that this man will always spout his party's line, even in the face of facts which prove differently, and that his word is never to be trusted.

Edited February 16, 2006 by the white drew carey

[Macross73]

"Amen to that! One thing that I'd like to add is that if there is room in the world for both Coke and Pepsi, certainly there is enough room for Robotech and Macross?"

There may be enough for coke and pepsi but for

years we had the cola-wars and it was one

mishap after mishap after mishap.

Shadow chronicles is the new flavor of the month.

lets see how this turns out

Edited February 16, 2006 by Macross73

[capt.actionjackson]

I think potraying Robotech as either Coke or Pepsi would actually quite a compliment to Robotech. To me that analogy would be more approporiate if likened to RT to Tab or one of those generic brands they sell at Wal Mart.

Watered down and not quite the same.

Well, since HG is so heck bent on distancing itself from Macross, why not raise the white flag and try to bring Big West to the table again? Or is this some elaborate, and annoying, no way "to save face" situation? Does neither company have the ability or the finances to settle the matter?

Could Big West buy HG out of their interest in Macross? If RT was almost 25 years ago now, when is the Tat/HG contract supposed to run out? Surely it wasn't into perpetuity...

[vf1a]

Could Big West buy HG out of their interest in Macross?  If RT was almost 25 years ago now, when is the Tat/HG contract supposed to run out?  Surely it wasn't into perpetuity...

Maybe they could have, back in the days of Macross Plus when HG was struggling to stay afloat. With the box set sales and upcoming shadow whatchamacallit, they've got too much invested to give it up for any amount short of outrageously high.

[Alpha1]

There may be enough for coke and pepsi but for

years we had the cola-wars and it was one

mishap after mishap after mishap.

How so? And since when did the consumers of either Coke or Pepsi start insulting each other’s products and each other’s consumers? Someone who for example prefers Coke over Pepsi is not going to be gleefully waiting for the day when Pepsi goes out of business and vice versa for the Pepsi Drinkers.

I think potraying Robotech as either Coke or Pepsi would actually quite a compliment to Robotech. To me that analogy would be more approporiate if likened to RT to Tab or one of those generic brands they sell at Wal Mart.

Watered down and not quite the same.

You can portray Robotech and Macross in both lights depending on which fan you are. A Robotech fan may say the same about Macross

Well, since HG is so heck bent on distancing itself from Macross, why not raise the white flag and try to bring Big West to the table again? Or is this some elaborate, and annoying, no way "to save face" situation? Does neither company have the ability or the finances to settle the matter?

Who cares? And what does it matter to you what HG does and does not do? How is your life negativley affected by HG not brining Big West "to the table?"

You purists out there on both sides of the fence are going to have to learn to live with the fact that both genres exist and they aren't going away. Just because you may be a fan of one genre does not mean that your fandom means more to the world than another persons fandom. Nor does it mean that your belief in one product being your favorite mean that the genre that you do not like must not exist.

Edited February 16, 2006 by Alpha1

[Radd]

Well, actually, having legitimate Region 1 Macross 7 and Macross Zero DVDs would be nice. As would easier access to the better Macross toys. There is also the potential for the series to do well enough internationally that it could promote more Macross series.

Edited February 16, 2006 by Radd

[me3]

There may be enough for coke and pepsi but for

years we had the cola-wars and it was one

mishap after mishap after mishap.

How so? And since when did the consumers of either Coke or Pepsi start insulting each other’s products and each other’s consumers? Someone who for example prefers Coke over Pepsi is not going to be gleefully waiting for the day when Pepsi goes out of business and vice versa for the Pepsi Drinkers.

I think potraying Robotech as either Coke or Pepsi would actually quite a compliment to Robotech. To me that analogy would be more approporiate if likened to RT to Tab or one of those generic brands they sell at Wal Mart.

Watered down and not quite the same.

You can portray Robotech and Macross in both lights depending on which fan you are. A Robotech fan may say the same about Macross

Well, since HG is so heck bent on distancing itself from Macross, why not raise the white flag and try to bring Big West to the table again? Or is this some elaborate, and annoying, no way "to save face" situation? Does neither company have the ability or the finances to settle the matter?

Who cares? And what does it matter to you what HG does and does not do? How is your life negativley affected by HG not brining Big West "to the table?"

You purists out there on both sides of the fence are going to have to learn to live with the fact that both genres exist and they aren't going away. Just because you may be a fan of one genre does not mean that your fandom means more to the world than another persons fandom. Nor does it mean that your belief in one product being your favorite mean that the genre that you do not like must not exist.

370729[/snapback]

Ladies and gentleman, I believe we just heard from Tommy Yune...

[me3]

Well, actually, having legitimate Region 1 Macross 7 and Macross Zero DVDs would be nice. As would easier access to the better Macross toys. There is also the potential for the series to do well enough internationally that it could promote more Macross series.

370812[/snapback]

Exactly. If I recall, the old robotech toys said UN Spacy on them anyway. I just have a hard time seeing why we aren't allowed those products in the US if robotech is not even using any macross images in the shadow chronicles. The characters in the new comics aren't recognizable as macross, and even the SDF-3 looks like a mospeada ship now. They both would only stand to gain by generating interest again. Instead, they continue bashing shields while macross and robotech collect dust.

[pfunk]

coke isnt pepsi, but pepsi is coke, think about it

[JB0]

There may be enough for coke and pepsi but for

years we had the cola-wars and it was one

mishap after mishap after mishap.

How so? And since when did the consumers of either Coke or Pepsi start insulting each other’s products and each other’s consumers? Someone who for example prefers Coke over Pepsi is not going to be gleefully waiting for the day when Pepsi goes out of business and vice versa for the Pepsi Drinkers.

Some of them do, actually.

I've got no idea how they can be so passionate about a freaking drink, but some people have elevated Coca-Cola to a religion, and placed it on the altar alongside pro football.

I think potraying Robotech as either Coke or Pepsi would actually quite a compliment to Robotech. To me that analogy would be more approporiate if likened to RT to Tab or one of those generic brands they sell at Wal Mart.

Watered down and not quite the same.

You can portray Robotech and Macross in both lights depending on which fan you are. A Robotech fan may say the same about Macross

Yup. I've met him.

That fan ALSO thinks that Robotech was first and that they removed Southern Cross and MOSPEADA for the Japanese version.

Well, since HG is so heck bent on distancing itself from Macross, why not raise the white flag and try to bring Big West to the table again? Or is this some elaborate, and annoying, no way "to save face" situation? Does neither company have the ability or the finances to settle the matter?

Who cares? And what does it matter to you what HG does and does not do? How is your life negativley affected by HG not brining Big West "to the table?"

As others have said, it makes the products we actually WANT rather difficult to acquire.

HG and Big West fighting means WE don't get Mac Seven, Mac Zero, or DYRL(though this one has other potential issues, the HG/BW issue is the primary one) DVD releases.

It also means WE don't get certain pieces of japanese merchandise.

There's two major points here.

Point one is games. No one REALLY believes Bandai didn't wait until AFTER translating and advertizing to see if there was a market for VF-X2.

The market is there, and the fact that they were so far into the planned release that they were running ads and had demo disk space pretty much proves it.

I'd bet good money that HG was making threats, and Bandai didn't want to deal with the legal bickering. Without concrete proof it would be a major blockbuster(which would've REQUIRED a release), it's easier to just drop the release, take the tax writeoff, and find something else to recoup the losses. They knew there was enough market to justify a localization, but not that there was enough market to commit an unknown but signifigant quantity of resources to courtroom brawls with no guarantee of victory, or a known and signifigant amount to an HG license(which might result in a pulled Big West license).

This is, to me, the bigger issue. There's no real way to fully enjoy the recent games without a translation, and the fan translation scene hasn't stepped up. That, of course, assumes either a modded system or emulator to render a fan translation playable(even if you actually own the disk, you'll have to rip an image to patch, and then burn a new disk that the system's copy protection won't like).

Point two is Yamato's VFs. Yes, you can import them, but the price premium is quite large. No, Masterpiece Veritechs are NOT similar(especially for products like the YF-19/21, which HG blocked and has no equivalent RT product for). This is the bigger issue to the Macross community at large, as well as part of the Robotech community.

You purists out there on both sides of the fence are going to have to learn to live with the fact that both genres exist and they aren't going away. Just because you may be a fan of one genre does not mean that your fandom means more to the world than another persons fandom. Nor does it mean that your belief in one product being your favorite mean that the genre that you do not like must not exist.

Since when is "rewritten and spliced-together" a genre?

Macross and Robotech are the same genre. One's just a poor hackjob while the other is the original product.

[myk]

It also means WE don't get certain pieces of japanese merchandise.

There's two major points here.

Point one is games.

Point two is Yamato's VFs.

Bingo. HG has railroaded our ability to enjoy these products at a reasonably available manner and cost and that definitely affects us negatively.

[capt.actionjackson]

Who cares? And what does it matter to you what HG does and does not do? How is your life negativley affected by HG not brining Big West "to the table?"

Well, actually, its obvious to me the fans of Macross on this board care. And I'd say the big negative it has affected us through our wallets. We could have had already had (hopefully) nicely done subtitled, R1 releases for DYRL and Mac Zero. The could have potentially struck up a deal with Yamato and BW to release their far superior valk here saving the fans some money, and making HG, BW, and Yamato money as well.

HG has singlehandedly prevented the release of these products and the games as well. And, my question still isn't answered. It's been 25 years now. Is there so much animosity that neither side can come to a financial agreement at this point?

I'm still wondering about the length of the contract itself. Manga is losing licenses lately, and will probably lose Mac Plus and II soon. Does the HG/TAT license last until we're celebrating the 50th anniversary of Macross? Is it simply a matter of Tatsunoko saying they don't want to renew it?

[JB0]

I'm still wondering about the length of the contract itself.  Manga is losing licenses lately, and will probably lose Mac Plus and II soon.  Does the HG/TAT license last until we're celebrating the 50th anniversary of Macross?  Is it simply a matter of Tatsunoko saying they don't want to renew it?

370948[/snapback]

No one really knows. HG refuses to show it to anybody.

I think the only peopel outside HG and Tatsunoko that have ever seen it are the people involved in the Battletech fuss, and they can't legally tell anyone what it said due to the settlement terms.

[Gui]

Well, actually, having legitimate Region 1 Macross 7 and Macross Zero DVDs would be nice. As would easier access to the better Macross toys. There is also the potential for the series to do well enough internationally that it could promote more Macross series.

370812[/snapback]

I agree: the Macross franchise is rather popular in my country (the french version of the Animeigo set did rather well in terms of sales, although it's a 20+ years old series ; 10 years ago, M2 and M+ were rather well received by anime communities which, at this moment, were far less developped than they are now...) and I know that a lot of people would be interested into seeing more Macross stuff if it was available, which is not the case because of all this license BS

We all love Macross in there, and we all think its creators deserve some recognition and, yes, some money for their hard, high-quality work: instead of rewarding them, we have to open the wallet for illegal, bad quality bootlegs and costly imports of games and toys

All this mess becomes to be a real pain in the ass for everyone IMO: for the original creators because of the reasons mentioned above and even for HG because of the reputation, well deserved /me thinks, they got...

Edited February 17, 2006 by Gui

[Skullsixx]

"Since when is "rewritten and spliced-together" a genre?

Macross and Robotech are the same genre. One's just a poor hackjob while the other is the original product."

DAMN RIGHT!!! I don't like being sold an inferior product!

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I'd bet good money that HG was making threats, and Bandai didn't want to deal with the legal bickering. Without concrete proof it would be a major blockbuster(which would've REQUIRED a release), it's easier to just drop the release, take the tax writeoff, and find something else to recoup the losses. They knew there was enough market to justify a localization, but not that there was enough market to commit an unknown but signifigant quantity of resources to courtroom brawls with no guarantee of victory, or a known and signifigant amount to an HG license(which might result in a pulled Big West license).

This is, to me, the bigger issue. There's no real way to fully enjoy the recent games without a translation, and the fan translation scene hasn't stepped up. That, of course, assumes either a modded system or emulator to render a fan translation playable(even if you actually own the disk, you'll have to rip an image to patch, and then burn a new disk that the system's copy protection won't like).

I wish the two worlds would seperate. Robotech fans got thier versions of macross valks, while at the same time macross fans could buy macross valks and games. Everyone getting what they wanted and leaving the fanbase to decide with thier wallet. I mean in macross we don't have Jack Archer!

If you are a fan of both robotech and macross you got to take sides due to the legal probs. They really need to sort this out lest the very macross franchise gets old and worthless for the sake of the fans who have the money and don't want to waste it importing.

[cwbrown]

I'm still wondering about the length of the contract itself.  Manga is losing licenses lately, and will probably lose Mac Plus and II soon.  Does the HG/TAT license last until we're celebrating the 50th anniversary of Macross?  Is it simply a matter of Tatsunoko saying they don't want to renew it?

370948[/snapback]

Ask and ye shall receive:

On January 15, 1984, Tatsunoko granted plaintiff Harmony Gold U.S.A., Inc. ("Harmony Gold") a license to market all products in the United States based on the Macross designs except for Japanese plastic model kits. Harmony Gold subsequently acquired co-ownership of the copyrights in both the original Macross designs and any derivative works. Harmony Gold has incorporated the Macross designs into an animated television series entitled "Robotech." Additionally, Harmony Gold has marketed, through its sublicensees, a broad array of "Robotech" products including publications, actions figures and toys.

Harmony Gold, U.S.A., Inc. v. FASA Corp., 1996 WL 332689 (N.D. Ill. 1996). It's not a formal finding of fact, but should answer your question.

And I still say, for the record, that we still don't know if it's Big West causing the problems. It could be HG wants $5 per item and its name on the box, and that's it. Big West could simply be balking at giving HG anything. We don't know and nobody should jump to any conclusions.

[Radd]

There was that court dispute between Tatsunoko and Big West that concluded that Tatsunoko didn't actually own any copyrights on the designs in Macross, or any stake in derivative works.

Big West's stance seems to be that HG only has international merchandising and distribution rights to the original SDF Macross, and nothing else. The conclusions of the Tokyo circuit court would seem to support that.

Additionally, if I recall correctly, HG and FASA settled out of court on a condition that FASA not disclose information on the matter to the public.