ewilen Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 And if a settlement was reached.... what about the person/company that holds the rights to DYRL in the US? Well, whoever they are, they probably only have video distribution rights, not merchandising rights.
EXO Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 I'm glad this happened. Maybe now BW will get off their asses and do something about it.
Effect Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 I was just about to type that. Think about it. If the person original got the rights from Big West, during that time other companies in Japan has to be releasing items, why would they give the rights over to someone else as well. Also wasn't the purpose of it being dubbed before was to help with learning english and then was released to the public? There would be no need to include product rights with something like that.
Roy Focker Posted February 11, 2004 Author Posted February 11, 2004 Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate?
Mechafan Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 (edited) Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate? I did not think about it for awhile untill today with this issue. Edited February 11, 2004 by Mechafan
Effect Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Honestly never gave this thread and the issue a second thought. I can get imports from other sites and download the macross shows. Life was good. Or at least decent.
Abombz!! Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate? *raises hand*
Duke Togo Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Me too. I wasn't used to seeing activity in this thread, that is why I looked.
azrael Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate? God dammit, who ruined the silence in this thread?
Cyclone Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 I did sorta, bumping it via the Madman "HG own Animeigo's masters" posts, but that was a or so week before the DYRL SP thing. Of course can anyone really bump a pinned thread? Cyc
Anubis Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 (edited) I haven't paid that much attention to this thread outside of the Animeigo masters discussion,and the VFX-4 before that then I noticed this little surprize. Someone should keep an eye on the Robotech comic, see if the "YF-4" has transformed yet. Edited February 11, 2004 by Anubis
Pat Payne Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 (edited) I'd been staying out of the thread for a while, hoping that the cease-fire was going to be permanent. Oh, well... [Radar O'Reilly] Choppers!!! [/Radar O'Reilly] Now it's just a matter of time until BoK rears his head again... Edited February 11, 2004 by Pat Payne
Cyclone Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Someone should keep an eye on the Robotech comic, see if the "YF-4" has transformed yet. New Gen story at the moment, so apart from the Conbat looking like one... Of course a Macross Saga backup on what happened to Mars Base Sera in the RT universe might pull some magical mecha out there... Cyc
Druna Skass Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 (edited) Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate? **raises hand** As far as this topic goes, all I want is to not have to get crap off the internet and deal with shipping and sit here wondering when my crap's going to get here. That's what makes me mad about this whole mess, that I can't get the good stuff without sitting here wondering when it'll come in. I'd rather drive my ass to the store and get it that day. Edited February 11, 2004 by Druna Skass
Nightbat Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 *hand in the air For some odd reason I clicked it when I saw MEMO1DOMINION as last poster I must have felt it or something To the mods: -sorry about clicking the "report" function instead of the "quote"
EXO Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate? hmmm... I never really ventured much into this thread but something called me over towards it... hence my SW quote... weird. A great disturbance in the force indeed, I don't have a good feeling about this. Hopefully these negotiations will be short.... ...and all those other quotes.
91WhiskeyM6 Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 (edited) I hate those moderators at Ro-bo-crap.com What's HG's address anyway? Oh yeah... Harmony Gold USA, Inc. Attn: Alan Letz 7655 Sunset Boulevard Los Angeles, CA 90046-2700 Phone: (323) 851-4900 Fax: (323) 851-5599 Edited February 11, 2004 by 91WhiskeyM6
Anubis Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 I hate those moderators at Ro-bo-crap.comWhat's HG's address anyway? Oh yeah... Harmony Gold USA, Inc. Attn: Alan Letz 7655 Sunset Boulevard Los Angeles, CA 90046-2700 Phone: (323) 851-4900 Fax: (323) 851-5599 DO NOT go sending hate mail to HG considering we do not know the real workings of what's going on. We don't know yet wether it's HG being brazen or wether a deal has been struck regarding DYRL. Give it time.
bandit29 Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 Show of hands. Who here like me had pretty much forgotten about HG and this whole debate?and 91WhiskeyM6, grow up. No one needs to be sending anyone at HG hate mail over a 20 year old cartoon. Me. Except for a few ramblings about the recently released RT remastered and who owned what footage etc.. I can't stand this stuff. and 91WhiskeyM6, grow up. No one needs to be sending anyone at HG hate mail over a 20 year old cartoon. Maybe finally something has been solved.
bsu legato Posted February 11, 2004 Posted February 11, 2004 and 91WhiskeyM6, grow up. No one needs to be sending anyone at HG hate mail over a 20 year old cartoon. Isn't that like that Simpsons episode where Homer was writing letters to movies? "Dear Die Hard. That was really cool when you were up on the roof."
91WhiskeyM6 Posted February 12, 2004 Posted February 12, 2004 I hate those moderators at Ro-bo-crap.comWhat's HG's address anyway? Oh yeah... Harmony Gold USA, Inc. Attn: Alan Letz 7655 Sunset Boulevard Los Angeles, CA 90046-2700 Phone: (323) 851-4900 Fax: (323) 851-5599 DO NOT go sending hate mail to HG considering we do not know the real workings of what's going on. We don't know yet wether it's HG being brazen or wether a deal has been struck regarding DYRL. Give it time. Wha? little ol' me?
91WhiskeyM6 Posted February 12, 2004 Posted February 12, 2004 and 91WhiskeyM6, grow up. No one needs to be sending anyone at HG hate mail over a 20 year old cartoon. Isn't that like that Simpsons episode where Homer was writing letters to movies? "Dear Die Hard. That was really cool when you were up on the roof." Me like Homer
Ghadrack Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Although they were astoundingly vague about any details, on the RT.com site they have stated that these are officially licensed products. So for whatever it is worth, it sounds like HG or Toynami have obtained the U.S. right sot produce toys based on Macross DYRL? . This makes me think that a U.S. region 1 DVD of Macross DYRL? Might not be as far a stretch as I had believed a few weeks ago. If they obtained the rights, but not Exclusive rights in the United States, this could actually open the door for international officially licensed Macross DYRL toys to be retailed in the U.S. If they obtained exclusive rights, I think this could potentially be another major major screw-job for U.S. fans. I don't know the rules on importation of copyrighted materials but theoretically if HG got the U.S. rights for DYRL? would that make it illegal to import products not licensed in this country for resale?
Anubis Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 Just the Bateman guy saying "I assure you they are legitimately lisenced" after saying "without getting into details" doesn't quite solidify that they are in fact legit. Especialy when there are no details available from anyone.
ewilen Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 I don't know the rules on importation of copyrighted materials but theoretically if HG got the U.S. rights for DYRL? would that make it illegal to import products not licensed in this country for resale? (Regarding the rest of the post: what Anubis said.) You're correct that if HG had a legitimate exclusive right to DYRL in the US, it would be illegal to import and distribute DYRL stuff that wasn't licensed by HG. However, there would one major loophole: you could still import stuff for personal use. So if you ordered directly from overseas via Hobbylink Japan, Toy Wave, etc., you shouldn't have any problem. Places like Valkyrie Exchange, TMPAnime, etc., might have more difficulty, since they import stuff for resale. However, HG would have to furnish proof of its rights, something they've refused thus far to do. I'm not a lawyer, so please don't take the above as legal advice. It's just speculation based on my reading of the law. Relevant portions of US copyright law are US Code Title 17, Chapter 5, and Chapter 6. The loophole is Section 602 (a) (2).
the white drew carey Posted February 18, 2004 Posted February 18, 2004 (edited) Keep in mind that Tom Bateman's statement is technically "unofficial", and therefore most probably hasn't been sent through the legal-wringer to assure complete accuracy. I know this is going far, but he never said who had "officially licensed" it to whom. For all we know, he could've meant that HG had officially licensed it to Toynami, based on HG's assertion of Macross ownership. Edited February 18, 2004 by the white drew carey
Abombz!! Posted February 19, 2004 Posted February 19, 2004 I don't know the rules on importation of copyrighted materials but theoretically if HG got the U.S. rights for DYRL? would that make it illegal to import products not licensed in this country for resale? (Regarding the rest of the post: what Anubis said.) You're correct that if HG had a legitimate exclusive right to DYRL in the US, it would be illegal to import and distribute DYRL stuff that wasn't licensed by HG. However, there would one major loophole: you could still import stuff for personal use. So if you ordered directly from overseas via Hobbylink Japan, Toy Wave, etc., you shouldn't have any problem. Places like Valkyrie Exchange, TMPAnime, etc., might have more difficulty, since they import stuff for resale. However, HG would have to furnish proof of its rights, something they've refused thus far to do. I'm not a lawyer, so please don't take the above as legal advice. It's just speculation based on my reading of the law. Relevant portions of US copyright law are US Code Title 17, Chapter 5, and Chapter 6. The loophole is Section 602 (a) (2). Explain me something... how is importing illegal? If its trully illegal... why haven't I seen Nintendo, Sony, MS and many other companies run after retailers who sell import games? WHy haven't I seen Habro run after retailers who sell japanese versions of TF toys that are also available in the US? In Hasbros case.... they lose a pretty big part of their sales to ppl who by the Takara TF toys simply because they might be better or somethhing. Sounds extremely fishy to me, but then again... it might be illegal... and they just don't care enough to go through the hassle of running after those retailers.
pfunk Posted February 19, 2004 Posted February 19, 2004 I don't know the rules on importation of copyrighted materials but theoretically if HG got the U.S. rights for DYRL? would that make it illegal to import products not licensed in this country for resale? (Regarding the rest of the post: what Anubis said.) You're correct that if HG had a legitimate exclusive right to DYRL in the US, it would be illegal to import and distribute DYRL stuff that wasn't licensed by HG. However, there would one major loophole: you could still import stuff for personal use. So if you ordered directly from overseas via Hobbylink Japan, Toy Wave, etc., you shouldn't have any problem. Places like Valkyrie Exchange, TMPAnime, etc., might have more difficulty, since they import stuff for resale. However, HG would have to furnish proof of its rights, something they've refused thus far to do. I'm not a lawyer, so please don't take the above as legal advice. It's just speculation based on my reading of the law. Relevant portions of US copyright law are US Code Title 17, Chapter 5, and Chapter 6. The loophole is Section 602 (a) (2). Explain me something... how is importing illegal? If its trully illegal... why haven't I seen Nintendo, Sony, MS and many other companies run after retailers who sell import games? WHy haven't I seen Habro run after retailers who sell japanese versions of TF toys that are also available in the US? In Hasbros case.... they lose a pretty big part of their sales to ppl who by the Takara TF toys simply because they might be better or somethhing. Sounds extremely fishy to me, but then again... it might be illegal... and they just don't care enough to go through the hassle of running after those retailers. they think its too little to invest the legal staff?????
the white drew carey Posted February 19, 2004 Posted February 19, 2004 Abombz!!- Technically, there are laws governing all types of importing. The term "grey area" actually refers to the literal enforcement of those laws. It's legal to import single items for personal use. It is illegal to import them for the purpose of reselling them. Here's the grey area: How enforceable is the law when someone is importing and reselling products which are otherwise not available?
the white drew carey Posted February 19, 2004 Posted February 19, 2004 Explain me something... how is importing illegal? If its trully illegal... why haven't I seen Nintendo, Sony, MS and many other companies run after retailers who sell import games? WHy haven't I seen Habro run after retailers who sell japanese versions of TF toys that are also available in the US? In Hasbros case.... they lose a pretty big part of their sales to ppl who by the Takara TF toys simply because they might be better or somethhing. I forgot to respond to this part: Nintendo, Sony and the others actually lose a tiny fraction of their business to importers. In reality, much too small to expend the resources to combat. Smaller companies, like HG, who effectively re-started their toy licensing business, has a lot to fear from importers, since for the past 15-20 years, the importers have been (and still remain, IMHO) the sole source for quality Macross merchandise- A large and direct source of competition for HG's sudden aspirations. The risk to HG is much greater than the risk is for much larger companies.
Pat Payne Posted February 20, 2004 Posted February 20, 2004 (edited) I don't know the rules on importation of copyrighted materials but theoretically if HG got the U.S. rights for DYRL? would that make it illegal to import products not licensed in this country for resale? (Regarding the rest of the post: what Anubis said.) You're correct that if HG had a legitimate exclusive right to DYRL in the US, it would be illegal to import and distribute DYRL stuff that wasn't licensed by HG. However, there would one major loophole: you could still import stuff for personal use. So if you ordered directly from overseas via Hobbylink Japan, Toy Wave, etc., you shouldn't have any problem. Places like Valkyrie Exchange, TMPAnime, etc., might have more difficulty, since they import stuff for resale. However, HG would have to furnish proof of its rights, something they've refused thus far to do. I'm not a lawyer, so please don't take the above as legal advice. It's just speculation based on my reading of the law. Relevant portions of US copyright law are US Code Title 17, Chapter 5, and Chapter 6. The loophole is Section 602 (a) (2). Explain me something... how is importing illegal? If its trully illegal... why haven't I seen Nintendo, Sony, MS and many other companies run after retailers who sell import games? WHy haven't I seen Habro run after retailers who sell japanese versions of TF toys that are also available in the US? In Hasbros case.... they lose a pretty big part of their sales to ppl who by the Takara TF toys simply because they might be better or somethhing. Sounds extremely fishy to me, but then again... it might be illegal... and they just don't care enough to go through the hassle of running after those retailers. It is, but it isn't... in most cases, the retailers don't make a stink because it's so small scale. Kevin at Valk Excahnge and Spidey at Blasto import such small amounts that nobody cares -- except for HG, of course. Now, if Toys R Us was to import wholesale the TF reissues, then Hasbro might sue for restraint of trade or ask US Customs to step in (Customs would probably get involved anyway, just to make sure that the toys met safety requirements and to be sure that the gummint gets its cut of the tariffs). The same with Nintendo. Most of the imports are going to Little Tokyo, for Japanese expats who still have their Japanese systems and can't (for obvious reasons) get the latest Doraemon game here in the states. Nintendo probably doesn't feel it has to worry because of: a) the language barrier b) the price barrier c) the "doesn't have the right hardware" barrier. (although with fans, none of those three things mean a whole lot ) Edited February 20, 2004 by Pat Payne
Abombz!! Posted February 20, 2004 Posted February 20, 2004 Thats explains it then. Doesn't make much sense.... but I guess I get it. I guess in HGs case every sale matters.... specially when, in case of the MPC, there are better alternatives available, not cost effective, but better.
the white drew carey Posted February 20, 2004 Posted February 20, 2004 I guess in HGs case every sale matters.... specially when, in case of the MPC, there are better alternatives available, not cost effective, but better. Exactly.
ewilen Posted February 20, 2004 Posted February 20, 2004 (edited) Looks like there has been a minor development on the legal front in Japan: http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20040214-00002076-mai-soci http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20040213...00181-kyodo-ent The first reads: ＜テレビアニメ＞マクロスの著作権、竜の子プロ側に確定 人気テレビアニメーション「超時空要塞マクロス」の著作権を巡り、制作会社「竜の子プロダクション」と企画会社「スタジオぬえ」が争った訴訟で、最高裁第２小法廷（福田博裁判長）は１３日、スタジオぬえ側の上告を棄却する決定をした。竜の子側に著作権を認めた東京高裁判決（昨年９月）が確定した。（毎日新聞） [2月13日22時26分更新] Translation via excite.co.jpg: It decides to the copyright [ of <television animation> MACROSS ], and child pro side of a dragon.The 2nd petit bench (Fukuda 博裁判長) of the Supreme Court made the decision which rejects 上告 by the side of studio ぬえ on the 13th involving the copyright of popular television animation "super-space-time fort MACROSS" by the lawsuit for which the work company "the child production of a dragon" and the plan company "studio ぬえ" fought. The Tokyo High Court judgment (September, last year) which accepted copyright in the child side of a dragon was decided. (Mainichi Newspapers) [Renewal of 22:26 on February 13] The second reads: 竜の子プロの勝訴が確定 「マクロス」作品の著作権 テレビアニメ「超時空要塞（ようさい）マクロス」をめぐり、アニメ制作会社「竜の子プロダクション」（東京）が、企画会社「スタジオぬえ」（同）などに著作権の確認を求めた訴訟で、最高裁第２小法廷（福田博裁判長）は１３日、ぬえ側の上告を退ける決定をした。竜の子プロに作品の著作権があることを認めた１、２審判決が確定した。 作品の基礎になるキャラクターの図柄については、別の訴訟でぬえ側に著作権を認める東京高裁判決が確定している。 「マクロス」は、巨大宇宙艦マクロスと宇宙人の戦闘を描いたアニメ。１９８２年１０月から８３年６月まで放映された。（共同通信） [2月13日17時30分更新] Translation: Winning the case of the child pro of a dragon is decided. Copyright of the "MACROSS" workThe 2nd petit bench (Fukuda 博裁判長) of the Supreme Court made the decision which can sew and will turn down near 上告 for 13 days involving television animation "super-space-time fort (when like) MACROSS" by the lawsuit to which the animation work company "the child production of a dragon" (Tokyo) asked the plan company "studio ぬえ" (同) etc. for the check of copyright. 1 and 2 referee decision which permitted the child pro of a dragon for there to be copyright of a work were decided. About the pattern of a character which becomes the foundation of a work, the Tokyo High Court judgment which can sew by another lawsuit and accepts copyright in a side is decided. "MACROSS" is the animation describing the battle of huge space warship MACROSS and an alien. It was broadcast from October, 1982 to June, 83. (Kyodo News) [Renewal of 17:30 on February 13] What I believe this means is that Studio Nue appealed the judgment over the SDF Macross animation, which was originally decided in Tokyo District Court in favor of Tatsunoko Productions and subsequently upheld by the Tokyo High Court. The "2nd petit bench" of the Supreme Court rejected the appeal, however. I have a hunch the appeal may have been related to "problems with the judgment" raised in IP/Cyberlaw Watch. In any case, it's unlikely that the appeal affects ownership of the Macross franchise as a whole. I'm going to see if I can find the actual text from the Supreme Court. If I do, I'll post a link. Edited February 20, 2004 by ewilen
Roy Focker Posted February 21, 2004 Author Posted February 21, 2004 Now who can translate Japanese? Those automated ones give me head aches.
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