Rand Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 I don't know if this has been discussed before, but if DYRL is suppose to be a movie within the Macross world, wouldn't the Zentraedis be offended at how they were portrayed in the movie? Vrlitwhai became a prominent UN Commander after the war, yet they made him look like a monster in the film. I understand Bodolza's weird look since he's the bad dude, but Vrlitwhai's a hero!
Tekkaman Blade Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Is this because I said that the DYRL movie was a UN Propoganda machine?
Zentrandude Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 hmm ya boycot DYRL. They protray us as cold heartless giants, but we realy wanted to say hello but your macross attacked us first with your main cannon. do we not cry if we get hurt. or we do not bleed when your 55mm shell rips threw our bodies? charge max with warcrimes for killing one of our soldiers in a unnecessary way as exposing him to the deadly touch of space in his face. just your friendly giant green machine that cries as machines get exploited by humans.
Mechamaniac Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Yeah, he really scared the hell out of me when he turned his ship around to face his commander, and encited his entire fleet to mutiny in order to protect the Macross. Scary guy....
Radd Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 If you're talking about the character designs, well, the DYRL? designs have become the official designs. Also, Kawamori has stated that both the tv series and DYRL? are acceptable tellings of Space War I, leading most to believe that if the original series was remade, it would use the designs from the movie and it would probably use a lot of story elements from both. There's also been some debate was to whether the DYRL? that exists within the Macross universe is actually the DYRL? that we all know and love.
Agent ONE Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Well, when it was first made in 1984 DYRL WASN"T a movie within the Macross fictional universe. That fact was added in 10 years later to be a focus point for some episodes of Macross 7. Therefore the Zjentohlauedy's opinion of the movie would be irrelivant. However in the present scenario, I don't think the Zjentohlauedy would have been offended... in DYRL they seemed like warriors to be feared. They like that.
Mechamaniac Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 However in the present scenario, I don't think the Zjentohlauedy would have been offended... in DYRL they seemed like warriors to be feared. They like that. Right, it's not like they were all orphaned children who deep down inside really just wanted to be loved and understood.
Zentrandude Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 However in the present scenario, I don't think the Zjentohlauedy would have been offended... in DYRL they seemed like warriors to be feared. They like that. Right, it's not like they were all orphaned children who deep down inside really just wanted to be loved and understood. heh correct all i wanted is some love.... *flashback when hes was a single cell in a vial* "daddy? where are you? no daddy dont leave me!!!!! nooooooooo"
bsu legato Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 I heard that Kamjin's family wanted to sue the producers over his portrayal in DYRL. Their lawsuit claims that he is portrayed solely as a heartless, sadistic killing machine, while they claim he was in fact a kindhearted soul who loved puppies. Ain't political correctness fun?
Agent ONE Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 ...Ain't political correctness fun? Nuke a gay whale for Jesus!
Mechamaniac Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 ...Ain't political correctness fun? Nuke a gay whale for Jesus! Gay Black Nazis for Christ.
Zentrandude Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 pfft just ask that this tread be locked. its faster.
bsu legato Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Nuke a gay whale for Jesus! LOL! I can just imagine some fictional message board in the mid 2040's, where our fanboy descendants would pick apart the "historical inaccuracies" of DYRL. Fanboy #1 - "The real Max flew a VF-1A-16, but in frame 34826, you can clearly see a closeup of his battroid's eyepiece where the FLIR pod is 3mm to the right, making it a VF-1A-25. I can't believe the producers let that glaring mistake get through editing." Fanboy #2 - "Yeah, and whoever did the sound FX should be shot. In the scene where Hikaru locks his RMS missiles onto the pods, the "lockon" tone is totally the wrong pitch."
Mechamaniac Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 (edited) LOL!I can just imagine some fictional message board in the mid 2040's, where our fanboy descendants would pick apart the "historical inaccuracies" of DYRL. Fanboy #1 - "The real Max flew a VF-1A-16, but in frame 34826, you can clearly see a closeup of his battroid's eyepiece where the FLIR pod is 3mm to the right, making it a VF-1A-25. I can't believe the producers let that glaring mistake get through editing." Fanboy #2 - "Yeah, and whoever did the sound FX should be shot. In the scene where Hikaru locks his RMS missiles onto the pods, the "lockon" tone is totally the wrong pitch." When Admiral Global is in his quarters after debriefing Misa and Hikaru, he reaches up to light his pipe, what kind of lighter is he using?. Is it a Zippo? Does the UN Spacy have a regulation issue lighter? If so, does it use overtechnology, or butane? Edited September 24, 2003 by Mechamaniac
Druna Skass Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Nuke a gay whale for Jesus! LOL! I can just imagine some fictional message board in the mid 2040's, where our fanboy descendants would pick apart the "historical inaccuracies" of DYRL. Fanboy #1 - "The real Max flew a VF-1A-16, but in frame 34826, you can clearly see a closeup of his battroid's eyepiece where the FLIR pod is 3mm to the right, making it a VF-1A-25. I can't believe the producers let that glaring mistake get through editing." Fanboy #2 - "Yeah, and whoever did the sound FX should be shot. In the scene where Hikaru locks his RMS missiles onto the pods, the "lockon" tone is totally the wrong pitch." Why is it that I can just hear the nerds from The Simpsons talking?
Roy Focker Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 This sounded like a possible semi normal topic at first. Anyone want to try turning it back?
Nightbat Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Well, when it was first made in 1984 DYRL WASN"T a movie within the Macross fictional universe.That fact was added in 10 years later to be a focus point for some episodes of Macross 7. I'm with Agent One on this one all the "Fitting-it-into-the-timeline" stuff pulled didn't make things clearer for fans and created only more nitpicking babble without any point (no offence to the topic-starter btw - this is just my opinion)
Rand Posted September 24, 2003 Author Posted September 24, 2003 I don't know why some of you guys get uptight when I aked this question. In one thread, someone commented that the VF1s they used in DYRL wasn't really an original VF1 but a VF-1X, and no one told that poster he's a nerd for nitpicking a cartoon. One of the best thing about the Macross franchise that it has a sense of continuity. I was hit with nostalgia when I first saw Max and Millia in Macross 7, that's why I embraced the "movie within a movie" scenario. It makes sense that the people of Macross world would make a movie commemorating mankind's greatest victory. Hence the question of why they would potray Zentraedis as monster when there's probably thouands of them living in peace or marrying with humans. I wasn't nitpicking. I don't know why you guys would think that. I'm still unsure what's wrong with the topic.
Mechamaniac Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 It makes sense that the people of Macross world would make a movie commemorating mankind's greatest victory. Mankind's greatest victory while simultaneously being Mankind's greatest defeat.
Agent ONE Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 ...In one thread, someone commented that the VF1s they used in DYRL wasn't really an original VF1 but a VF-1X, and no one told that poster he's a nerd for nitpicking a cartoon. ... First of all, the concept of what "they used" in DYRL is just retarted because, as I am mentioning again: in 1984, when it was first made. DYRL WASN"T a movie within the Macross fictional universe. That was just made up 10 years later. ... and as it looks like I was asleep when the thread you are referencing was going down, because who ever told you that WAS an nerd, and even worse, a nerd that was WRONG.
UN Spacy Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Maybe it's an emotional film like Schindlers List was for the Jewish people. The Zentradi's Schindlers List IS DYRL.
ewilen Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 (edited) ... and as it looks like I was asleep when the thread you are referencing was going down, because who ever told you that WAS an nerd, and even worse, a nerd that was WRONG. People in glass houses... I was just asking about something I'd read here or in the old forums. And since the "VF-1X program" has at least some legitimacy (regardless of whether 1X's were "used as props in DYRL"), my main concern was figuring out what a VF-1X looks like. Back to the original topic...I think it all depends on what we would like to think DYRL is. Is it the same as the movie made in the Macross universe, just with some missing scenes? Is it a representation of that (presumably live-action) movie in cartoon form, with some missing scenes, but otherwise unchanged? Is it a completely different movie, albeit with the same topic as the one released on 2031? Probably, whatever DYRL is, the movie released in 2031 didn't make the Zentradi look any uglier than they were. If you think DYRL is basically the same as the movie in the Macross universe, then Britai probably looked more or less like he does in DYRL, so why should he be offended? And the non-command Zentradi don't look bad at all. Edited September 24, 2003 by ewilen
JsARCLIGHT Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 I think the real question at hand is why would someone who now has culture be upset of what they once were? My opinion is no, it would be like someone who couldn't read acknowledging they once could not read but now they can. They now have culture, songs, happiness, peace, fruit pies and sex. Who cares about being insulted by your previous self? Is someone in the audience going to blurt out "Hey Zorg, you where a real tool back then"... This argument is akin to someone asking why children don't sue their parents for showing movies of them before they grew up... or the Germans suing for people making movies about the Nazis. It's not like DYRL is portraying the Zentradi as being that way now (to the people in the future) but it is showing what they once where and how they became what they are now.
Rand Posted September 24, 2003 Author Posted September 24, 2003 While the fact that DYRL was never intended as a "movie within a movie," I think the creators of Macross was right to make it so. If you really think about it, it fits. Do you remember the old cowboy movies where the Indians were often potrayed as savage people that kills indiscriminately? That was du to the prejudice attitude towards Native Americans back in those days. I think the same could be the same in the Macross Universe. Despite the fact that Zentraedis hold high position in the U.N., or the fact that there are plenty of interracial Zentraedi-Human relationships, I believe that there is a hint of prejudice towards the Zentraedi in the Macross Universe. Hey, It could be a great plot for the next Macross saga. That could be an alternate explanation to the monster-looking Vrlithwai and Exsedol. If the creators of Macross tells me that DYRL is a movie-within-a-movie, who the heck am I to question them? If you read my original post, I didn't ask why the creator of Macross made Vrilthwai look like a monster. I was asking why the people who made the movie "IN" the macross world made him look that way. It's just a hypothetical question, which you probably didn't get. PS: I have nothing against the poster that made the VF-1-VF-1X comparisons. That would have fit in the Macross timeline. Like in Saving Private Ryan, they used a fake Tiger on a T-34 hull because there's no working Tiger available. It's a nice idea that the "director" of DYRL probably used a VF1-X because there's no more original VF1s in working order.
bsu legato Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 or the Germans suing for people making movies about the Nazis. Nah....they have uber lefty/PC westerners to get mad at WW2 movies for them. So that raises another question. Would there be Zentraedi apologists in 2031? "Bodolza wasn't all bad. He was just following orders."
Mr March Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Well, when it was first made in 1984 DYRL WASN"T a movie within the Macross fictional universe. That fact was added in 10 years later to be a focus point for some episodes of Macross 7. Therefore the Zjentohlauedy's opinion of the movie would be irrelivant.However in the present scenario, I don't think the Zjentohlauedy would have been offended... in DYRL they seemed like warriors to be feared. They like that. Thank you. I was hoping to see that fact brought to everyones attention. Cheers!
ewilen Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 uber lefty/PC westerners to get mad at WW2 movies for them. I'm not going to comment on this other than to say that, surely, contemporary politics are off-topic on MW.
Agent ONE Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 uber lefty/PC westerners to get mad at WW2 movies for them. I'm not going to comment on this other than to say that, surely, contemporary politics are off-topic on MW. True but there is a correlation.
bsu legato Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 Â I'm not going to comment on this other than to say that, surely, contemporary politics are off-topic on MW. True but there is a correlation. Agent One's right. I didn't just throw that out there for the hell of it.
ewilen Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 There isn't a correlation, but I'm not going to go beyond that since it is off topic.
Agent ONE Posted September 24, 2003 Posted September 24, 2003 There isn't a correlation, but I'm not going to go beyond that since it is off topic. Well if it was just dumb, why didn't you just ignore it... Now you have made it the talk of the town. B)
ewilen Posted September 25, 2003 Posted September 25, 2003 Let me preface this by saying I think both you guys are great. However, I could ignore a public political jibe...and if everyone continues to do so, that effectively surrenders the field to those who choose to bring politics into the discussions. Very likely just one side, since if the other side starts, it's going to spiral.
Keith Posted September 25, 2003 Posted September 25, 2003 DYRL was officially acknowledged as a movie within the continuity by Studio Nue in 1987 when Flash Back 2012 came out (3 years later, not 10), though there was no official continuity released until 1993-4. Besides which, who are you or anyone else to say what was specifically intended for the film? As for the Zentradi taking offense, why would they? They did kill the almost entire population of Earth, they would have attacked irregardless of whether the Macross fired first or not, and they're actually portrayed a little more innocently in the movie than they were in the TV series.
Agent ONE Posted September 25, 2003 Posted September 25, 2003 DYRL was officially acknowledged as a movie within the continuity by Studio Nue in 1987 when Flash Back 2012 came out (3 years later, not 10), though there was no official continuity released until 1993-4. Besides which, who are you or anyone else to say what was specifically intended for the film? ... Who am I!? A fan who was paying attention. After 2012 came out Kawamori said 'Macross... Never again, its over.' There was no reason, or logic behind any potential idea of a "movie within a fictional universe." He only came back around after Studio Nue pooch-screwed Macross 2. I don't have a problem with the fact that DYRL is now a fictional movie that is shown in the Macross universe, what I have a problem with is the thought that people assume that it was intended to be a "movie within a fictional universe" from the begining. BTW: show me the exact date that Studio Nue officially acknowledged DYRL as a movie within the fictional continuity. I don't believe it was in 87.
JB0 Posted September 25, 2003 Posted September 25, 2003 As for the Zentradi taking offense, why would they? They did kill the almost entire population of Earth, they would have attacked irregardless of whether the Macross fired first or not, and they're actually portrayed a little more innocently in the movie than they were in the TV series. Yes, but they weren't all infected with leprosy when they did so.
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