Newbie Questions on Macross

[Valkyrie addict]

hmm,...just noticed there are two VF-17 in that chart, is the larger one the two seater kai version that Ray and Veffidas used in Macross 7??

[sketchley]

Yes.

[lala59]

Hi I'm just getting started out with the original macross and I've been checking out the time line also I've only seen Plus and DYRL, how was it possible for the humans to build new macross ships if the surface of the earth was obliterated according to what i saw in DYRL and according to the time line the bombing of the earth in the original macross series.

[sketchley]

After the Earth was blown up real good, the survivors joined with the Zentraedi, and they went on a raiding mission to capture the Factory Satellite from other Zentraedi.

The Factory Satellite has been used to both build new things (ships, VFs, cities, colonies) as well as clone virtually the entire human race, or their parents, that are seen in the later Macross productions.

[lala59]

@sketchley what do you mean by parents?

Also I know that max has a bunch of kids do any of them other than Mylene have stories in the macross universe?

[sketchley]

Children come from somewhere: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parent

For example, characters like Isamu and Guld, whom as far as I know are not clones themselves, are most likely the children of clones.

the other Genius kids are mentioned. I believe one other sister appears in the M7 movie, and one or two others appear in some of the games released.

[briscojr84]

Children come from somewhere: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parent

For example, characters like Isamu and Guld, whom as far as I know are not clones themselves, are most likely the children of clones.

the other Genius kids are mentioned. I believe one other sister appears in the M7 movie, and one or two others appear in some of the games released.

Emillia is in M7 Movie, Komillia shows up in either Eternal love song or one of the other games, of course you could probably add in Moa Ramia from M3 since she's an "adopted" daughter.

[briscojr84]

A quick question about armament in MZero, did they ever show what missiles were carried in the grey underwing pods on the VF-0.

[azrael]

A quick question about armament in MZero, did they ever show what missiles were carried in the grey underwing pods on the VF-0.

Nope. We only know that they are:

two HAIM-95A medium-range maneuverability missile launcher pods originally used in attack craft equipment

[briscojr84]

Does anybody know how many Cheyenne were deployed from the Asuka II.

[azrael]

Does anybody know how many Cheyenne were deployed from the Asuka II.

This was never mentioned.

[briscojr84]

This was never mentioned.

I realize that from the Compendium, but I meant how many were seen on Maya and were seen defending the Asuka II.

[ver CO]

Are there any significant differences between VF-11B and VF-11C?

I've read their specs and compared images; aside from the paint job and the series they appeared under (ie Plus & 7 respectively), I cant find any other difference.

Thanks!

[azrael]

Are there any significant differences between VF-11B and VF-11C?

I've read their specs and compared images; aside from the paint job and the series they appeared under (ie Plus & 7 respectively), I cant find any other difference.

Visually, no, there are no differences. The differences between the B and C-versions are with the electronic navigational equipment.

http://macross.anime.net/mecha/united_nati...vf11/index.html

[Valkyrie addict]

I think the gunpod is different too, the VF-11B is slighty bigger and carries that stabbing knife on the tip

[Zinjo]

I think the gunpod is different too, the VF-11B is slighty bigger and carries that stabbing knife on the tip

You mean the bayonette???

Edited November 28, 2007 by Zinjo

[azrael]

I think the gunpod is different too, the VF-11B is slighty bigger and carries that stabbing knife on the tip

Technically, you can swap the gunpods and I focused specifically on the fighter. But yes, you can count the gunpod as a difference.

[Mr March]

Welcome to Macross World, ver CO!

As azrael has mentioned, there are few mechanical differences between the B and C. However, there are a few small visual differences beyond just colors. See the picture below (VF-11B on the left, VF-11C on the right)

Edited November 28, 2007 by Mr March

[azrael]

Welcome to Macross World, ver CO!

As azrael has mentioned, there are few mechanical differences between the B and C. However, there are a few small visual differences beyond just colors. See the picture below (VF-11B on the left, VF-11C on the right)

I would not compare the M7 lineart with the M+ lineart. The M7 lineart is "dumb-down" for the animators and there is no detailed lineart for the VF-11C in M7. The marks you pointed out do exist on the M7 1/144 VF-11C model.

[ver CO]

Thanks for the replies!

Welcome to Macross World, ver CO!

Thanks! Been lurking for quite some time now so I thought I might as well join the fray.

I think the gunpod is different too, the VF-11B is slighty bigger and carries that stabbing knife on the tip

Yep I noticed that as well, but didnt consider it because they're swappable. Unless of course I misunderstood it and that one gunpod is officially assigned to one version of the VF-11.

As azrael has mentioned, there are few mechanical differences between the B and C. However, there are a few small visual differences beyond just colors. See the picture below (VF-11B on the left, VF-11C on the right)

http://www.un-spacy-qmtdb.com/Macross%20DY...arebattroid.gif

I would not compare the M7 lineart with the M+ lineart. The M7 lineart is "dumb-down" for the animators and there is no detailed lineart for the VF-11C in M7. The marks you pointed out do exist on the M7 1/144 VF-11C model.

http://steelfalcon.com/Macross/Images/VF11colors.gif

I have the second image from the kit. But Im curious as to where did the lineart come from? And does this mean the kit isnt accurate?

[Mr March]

I would not compare the M7 lineart with the M+ lineart. The M7 lineart is "dumb-down" for the animators and there is no detailed lineart for the VF-11C in M7. The marks you pointed out do exist on the M7 1/144 VF-11C model.

Well, I'm not sure what to follow in that situation. I know the reason for simplifying the line art for television versus OVA/film. But given that the line art is canon with respect to the series itself, I think I have to stick with the line art. Regardless, I guess one could go either way, detailed VF-11C or simplified VF-11C.

[sketchley]

Go with the books.

The Macross 7 TV Animation Series, Shoji Kawamori Macross Design Works, and TIAS: Macross 7 have the VF-11C lineart that Mr.March highlighted earlier in this thread.

Bandai is also know as being less than accurate (one could say sloppy) with the details on there Macross 7 kits. It's pretty apparent that they did a "1 size fits all" approach to the 1/144 VF-11C. Case in point: the difference between the 11B and 11 C FAST packs in the kit are only a change in nozzle. Missile ports are only 4, wheras they should be 8 on the VF-11B.

Therefore, my guess is that Big West supplied Bandai with line art for both the 11B and 11C, but the modelers mixed up the sheets, and based the kit on the 11B design.

[Mr March]

Sounds reasonable. As I said, I'm pretty much constrained by the canon appearance of the VF-11C within the anime itself. So I have to keep the VF-11C line art the same.

I'm starting to like these little comparison diagrams. I'm going to have to find a space for them on my website. They're very useful and everyone seems to like them.

[geecie30]

Is there such thing as a fan dub as opposed to a fan sub? I wanted to buy or aquire a fan dub of dyrl?, that is reasonably mixed .If I get the audio I can sync it to my video just for home use .Thanks.

[briscojr84]

Is there such thing as a fan dub as opposed to a fan sub? I wanted to buy or aquire a fan dub of dyrl?, that is reasonably mixed .If I get the audio I can sync it to my video just for home use .Thanks.

As far as I know the only dub ever made was the Class Of The Bionoids variant.

[ver CO]

Well, I'm not sure what to follow in that situation. I know the reason for simplifying the line art for television versus OVA/film. But given that the line art is canon with respect to the series itself, I think I have to stick with the line art. Regardless, I guess one could go either way, detailed VF-11C or simplified VF-11C.

Go with the books.

The Macross 7 TV Animation Series, Shoji Kawamori Macross Design Works, and TIAS: Macross 7 have the VF-11C lineart that Mr.March highlighted earlier in this thread.

Bandai is also know as being less than accurate (one could say sloppy) with the details on there Macross 7 kits. It's pretty apparent that they did a "1 size fits all" approach to the 1/144 VF-11C. Case in point: the difference between the 11B and 11 C FAST packs in the kit are only a change in nozzle. Missile ports are only 4, wheras they should be 8 on the VF-11B.

Therefore, my guess is that Big West supplied Bandai with line art for both the 11B and 11C, but the modelers mixed up the sheets, and based the kit on the 11B design.

Hmm... Noted. Unfortunately, the books are a bit out of my reach.

Thanks for the feedback! I'll try to research more on this now that I know what I'm looking for.

[s001]

Please someone explain the reflex weaponry/technology thing to me. I'm totally confused with macross and robotech theories.

[azrael]

Please someone explain the reflex weaponry/technology thing to me. I'm totally confused with macross and robotech theories.

In Robotech,

Reflex weapons are Protoculture-based weapons. i.e. Part of the explosive component is based off the stuff on a wacky flower that's used as a fuel source. Anything that uses Protoculture as an energy source is considered "Reflex".

In Macross:

http://macross.anime.net/story/encyclopedi...apon/index.html

Very powerful nukes.

[Duke Togo]

"Reaction Weaponry" in Macross.

[BEAST]

Have any copies of the actual legal contracts regarding Macross/Robotech ever been made publicly available? Rather than being dragged into the whole long sordid history of the legal battles, could I have a simple answer to that question first? Thanks.

We've all heard about the ongoing legal battles in vague terms, and that various companies lay claim to this or that, and even that there have been court rulings in the matter. But can actual original legal contracts be seen that back up these claims?

It would seem to me that without a contract from Big West authorizing Tatsunoku to make outside deals, then there should be no grounds to Harmony Gold's claims to have acquired Macross rights--much less exclusive rights.

And without a contract from Big West or Tatsunoku to HG clearly granting exclusive rights to all-things-Macross outside of Nippon, then HG should be summarily laughed at by any judge.

So how could this legal battle have raged on, if copies of the contracts either are--or even if they are not--available? It should be simple.

Contract = closed case. Yes?

No contract = no grounds for subsidiary claims of exclusive rights. Right?

[azrael]

Have any copies of the actual legal contracts regarding Macross/Robotech ever been made publicly available? Rather than being dragged into the whole long sordid history of the legal battles, could I have a simple answer to that question first? Thanks.

None are publicly available. Sorry.

[JB0]

Have any copies of the actual legal contracts regarding Macross/Robotech ever been made publicly available? Rather than being dragged into the whole long sordid history of the legal battles, could I have a simple answer to that question first? Thanks.

We've all heard about the ongoing legal battles in vague terms, and that various companies lay claim to this or that, and even that there have been court rulings in the matter. But can actual original legal contracts be seen that back up these claims?

It would seem to me that without a contract from Big West authorizing Tatsunoku to make outside deals, then there should be no grounds to Harmony Gold's claims to have acquired Macross rights--much less exclusive rights.

And without a contract from Big West or Tatsunoku to HG clearly granting exclusive rights to all-things-Macross outside of Nippon, then HG should be summarily laughed at by any judge.

So how could this legal battle have raged on, if copies of the contracts either are--or even if they are not--available? It should be simple.

Contract = closed case. Yes?

No contract = no grounds for subsidiary claims of exclusive rights. Right?

As I understand things, Japan has a nasty habit of not getting all their business deals in writing. It seems verbal agreements are "good enough" for many companies.

You can see where this might cause problems down the line.

So while a written contract WOULD make it an open-and-shut case, no contract DOESN'T make it equally clear-cut.

Given Tatsunoko and Big West wound up in court over who owned the Macross franchise, I think it's safe to assume there's not a clearly-written document outlining who has what rights.

[BEAST]

Thanks, guys. BW dove into a great big pool of grayness, and it seems like the others have taken advantage of it.

Theoretically, a decent judge would use the "reasonable person" standard to decide such cases in gray areas like this.

Would a reasonable person think that Studio New/BW would have signed over all of its distribution rights to another company like Tatsunoku? Probably not.

Would a reasonable person think that SN/BW would have signed over all its rights to merchandising outside Nippon exclusively to another company like Harmony Gold? Probably not.

That the courts would contemplate upholding such unreasonable claims smacks of corruption to me. It's like they're saying, "Never mind how unreasonable it sounds; SN/BW might have made just such a screwy deal anyway, so we should hear the other companies out."

I blame the judges as much as HG.

[azrael]

*snip too long to quote*

I blame the judges as much as HG.

Well, if BW didn't sign some rights over, Macross would never have existed.

[sketchley]

Do a search on it in google. You may be surprised while reading the results. Surprised specifically how Japanese law works in regards to enshrining the worker's right when it comes to copyright.

Blaming the judges is wrong, as they are interpreting and enforcing the law as it is written. If you don't like the law, then elect new politicians and have the law changed.