Star Wars Episode 3 Spoilers Thread

[HWR MKII]

I have to agree with Magnus these movies seem to boil down to the new badguy every movie syndrome instead of keeping a solid character base throughout. Its hard to hate or feel apprehension toward a bad guy when you know he will be dead by the end of the film or he was just introed and dies in the same film. Aside from Lord Tyranus no bad guy has lived for more than one movie in the prequels even then they hardly got any screen time. Darth Maul only got a total of about 5 to 7 minutes so how much is Grevious really going to get in the end? We shouldnt have to rely on comics and games to build the knowledge base of how we have to accept a new character.

sorry for the rant guys i do look forward to seeing the film its just difficult to attach to a character that isnt going to be around long.

[lt.actionjackson]

Well, it could be argued that the real bad guy Palps/Sidious has been the only bad guy present since episode 1.

And I do agree that the flow of the prequals has been less than pleasant. I think Jake Lloyd's involvement could have been cut to half an hour in episode 1 and we could have just jumped to Christensen and further along in Anakin's story. Instead, we're saddled with a loooong pod race and clunky lines. This would have left episode 2 to tell some stories from the clone wars instead of getting the animated series. Then Ep3 could have been what we have now.

[Dobber]

I remember watching the making of doc. on the Ep. I DVD. When it came too casting it seemed like everyone else like this other kid who was a little older than Jake and IMO much better in audition then Jake too. Then king George steps in and says something like Jake just has something about him that he liked. I swear everyone looked like they couldn't believe he was picking Jake over this other kid, it was hilarious! Then later on during filming Jake couldn't say Couruscant correctly.....the look on ol' George's face was priceless.....kinda like it dawned on him that he made a big mistake with this kid!! If you have it you should check it out!

Chris

[lt.actionjackson]

Wasn't the kid from the 6th sense up for that part too? At least that kid can act. He does creepy pretty well too. Instead of creepy, we get saddled with GLs poor decision making. Oh well, hopefully he'll make it up to us in two months.

[DARTHTODD]

Come on people, let's not rip on Jake Lloyd's acting. Any kid actor would sound/look dumb reading that script. Some great actors (Liam Neeson, Ewan McGregor, Sam Jackson) were in that movie and they sounded dumb!

[lt.actionjackson]

Well, I agree the writing hasn't been oscar winning. I'm still mystified that good actors still couldn't deliver a competent performance though (Neeson, Jackson, McGregor). I have to wonder how much of that is a fault in the director's chair. However, when I originally saw Ep1, I realized that Lloyd had atttended the Mark Hamill school of acting.

[Max Jenius]

Lloyd was a little kid in a movie made for kids. They typically don't have much range.

Yeah, Palps is the one bad guy throughout. Everyone else was just his pawn. Hell, the OT had Boba Fett and Jabba the Hutt as extra bad guys. OMGZ!

[Roy Focker]

Okay explain this too me!

In the first three movies IV,V & V they didn't have CGI to make Jedi do all bunch of crazy super ninja poo. Alec Guiness fought like and old man and Vader fought like a very tall guy in a stiff suit. Thanks to CGI the Jedi can do all sort of stuff in the new movies. Even Luke looks weak compared to the jedi in the new films.

Now my point will go off to this. The farting Emperor gets killed by being thrown down a shaft? Yoda bounces of the farting walks. You'd think Palps could have done some kung Fu and float up right back in his thrown room.

[wolfx]

Okay explain this too me!

In the first three movies IV,V & V they didn't have CGI to make Jedi do all bunch of crazy super ninja poo. Alec Guiness fought like and old man and Vader fought like a very tall guy in a stiff suit. Thanks to CGI the Jedi can do all sort of stuff in the new movies. Even Luke looks weak compared to the jedi in the new films.

Now my point will go off to this. The farting Emperor gets killed by being thrown down a shaft? Yoda bounces of the farting walks. You'd think Palps could have done some kung Fu and float up right back in his thrown room.

Like Yoda....in the span of 20 years after episode III, palp has become too old for ninja skillz....thus like the immobile yoda on luke's back...he was immobile when carried by Vader.

Simple.

[Chuey]

Okay explain this too me!

In the first three movies IV,V & V they didn't have CGI to make Jedi do all bunch of crazy super ninja poo.  Alec Guiness fought like and old man and Vader fought like a very tall guy in a stiff suit.  Thanks to CGI the Jedi can do all sort of stuff in the new movies.  Even Luke looks weak compared to the jedi in the new films.

Now my point will go off to this.  The farting Emperor gets killed by being thrown down a shaft?  Yoda bounces of the farting walks.  You'd think Palps could have done some kung Fu and float up right back in his thrown room.

I would view the movie scenes as instances where someone painted themselves into a corner. One might say that Palpatine either simply got over confident in his abilities to not use it on Vader and Luke or even get himself out. The other explanation is that while he is very old, he may have simply used a lot of his dark force powers i nthrowing lighting bolts. May be he was simply to surprised and shocked to have acted. I view it this way. There are a ton of stuff that is never explained. Why do Qui-gon and Vader have to be burned while Yoda and Obi-wan just disappear? We will have to see if the final film ties up loose ends. Personally, I think a lot of stuff will still confuse audiences.

[azrael]

Now my point will go off to this. The farting Emperor gets killed by being thrown down a shaft? Yoda bounces of the farting walks. You'd think Palps could have done some kung Fu and float up right back in his thrown room.

Yeah, but Yoda doesn't bounce often. Only in times of need does Yoda pull out the Jedi viagra...like when he's fighting people who are near 7 ft in height or when lots and lots and lots of large seats are being thrown at him.

I'm sure age does influence things. Even at the ripe age of 800-something-coming-up-on-900, Yoda is already using a cane. For Palp, the old geezer sat on his ass for most of those 20 years between III and IV. Why should he do anything when he could send a cripple to do an old man's job (let's face it, minus the artificial limbs and portable life support, Vader is a cripple).

There are a ton of stuff that is never explained. Why do Qui-gon and Vader have to be burned while Yoda and Obi-wan just disappear? We will have to see if the final film ties up loose ends.

Standard funeral prye perhaps??? Do we even know if there was any organic material left in what Luke brought down with him? Also the disappearing act has something to do with the "Living Force" (think Qui Gon). It was the one thing they learned during those 20 years of solitude.

[Max Jenius]

They explain why only the three of them do it in the next movie.

[Uxi]

If the Jedi had stuck to their guns, they would have trusted their instincts and never trained Anakin at all. Anakin's training played right into Sidious' plans.

As far as the prequel Jedi versus the original trilogy Jedi... in the OT, it was only old men, half machine cripples, and a half trained boy. The prequel Jedi need CG because they're Jedi in their prime, as are their enemies.

Considering the prequels in general... I kinda wish Maul had lived the whole time. I like the variety of enemies from Maul to Tyranus to Grevious... I think they could have still had that variety. Imagine if Obi-wan realizes he's beaten, so lets himself drop (kind of a homage to Luke in Empire Strikes Back). Maul realizes battle is lost, returns to his Master doing the ginsu to some hapless Naboo or Gungans on the way out.

Maul would have been the recurring enemy, again beating Obi-Wan and this time Anakin in AOTC before coming to a draw with Yoda and starting the war.

Nothing against Christopher Lee... and I like the idea of the grizzled old Jedi turning to the Sith for whatever reasons... but I like the idea of Maul being the symbol of the prequels Vader and only giving way to the symbol of the OT... Vader.

[Max Jenius]

Maul would have been the recurring enemy, again beating Obi-Wan and this time Anakin in AOTC before coming to a draw with Yoda and starting the war.

Nothing against Christopher Lee... and I like the idea of the grizzled old Jedi turning to the Sith for whatever reasons... but I like the idea of Maul being the symbol of the prequels Vader and only giving way to the symbol of the OT... Vader.

Yeah, but then it would be pretty much just like the old ones in terms of plot. I hate when creators plagiarize themselves... if there really is such a thing. But you do know what I mean, right? Making things in sequels or prequels that are just like their previous films? If its done right, I guess it works... but I can't think of an example that I like.

[lt.actionjackson]

To me the roll call change up has more to do with the setup leading to Anakin/Vader. It could be argued that each 2nd to Sidious/Palps had elements of Vader in them.

[glane21]

I'm confused, wasn't Darth Tyranus what Palpatine was calling himseilf in the first movie? Or is that Christopher Lee's character?

If it was Palpatine, why the name change to Sidious?

[lt.actionjackson]

I'm pretty sure that Darth Tyranus is Count Dooku's Sith name.

[glane21]

They also need to explain why 3PO doesn't remember anything from the first two movies in Star Wars and why OB1 doesn't recognize the droids.

[Ladic]

They also need to explain why 3PO doesn't remember anything from the first two movies in Star Wars and why OB1 doesn't recognize the droids.

Lucas already said, that both C3PO and R2D2, both get their memories erased at the end of ep3.

[zeo-mare]

They also need to explain why 3PO doesn't remember anything from the first two movies in Star Wars and why OB1 doesn't recognize the droids.

Lucas already said, that both C3PO and R2D2, both get their memories erased at the end of ep3.

not just the droids but also Obi-wan, in a New Hope he did not recognize them either what happened to his memory?

Edited March 18, 2005 by zeo-mare

[lt.actionjackson]

I'm pretty sure Obi is just doing the "certain point of view" angle. He never did own a droid, except maybe R4. Luke asked him if they were his and Ben just says"I don't remember ever owning a droid."

[CoryHolmes]

Plus, what are the chances of recognizing one specific astromech droid when they all have the same design?

[zeo-mare]

Plus, what are the chances of recognizing one specific astromech droid when they all have the same design?

good point

[lt.actionjackson]

This speaks for itself:

[Chronocidal]

omg... it's Darth Potato-Head!!

actually kinda reminds me of one of my first gif experiments in high school..

Edited March 18, 2005 by Chronocidal

[Chronocidal]

ACK! again... *smacks internet upside the hub*

Eh, but anyway, I'll try and turn it into something useful...

Somehow I kinda doubt that Obi-wan could possibly forget the droids.. he probably was just covering up the relationship for Luke's sake, so he didn't confuse the heck out of him. I mean, what are the odds of a blue R-2 unit pairing up with a gold 3PO, and landing in his lap? That had to set of something in his memory. He may not have been sure at first, but I'm pretty sure he knew who they really were by the time he viewed the message. The connection to Leia's adopted father probably should've made it clear who they were.

What's kind of funny is the chain of events as they probably should have happened... if it hadn't been for the jawas, R-2 would've probably found Obi-wan, and alerted him to what was going on, in which case, Obi-wan would've probably had to pick up Luke on the way anyway... the implied reason for him staying on Tattooine in the first place was to watch over Luke, and let him in on the story at the right time (or shovel it off onto Yoda )

Edited March 18, 2005 by Chronocidal

[Otaku-Smeghead]

http://www.darkhorizons.com/news05/050318a.php

3D?? hmmmm

[Ladic]

Titanic in SPace!

[Max Jenius]

ACK! again... *smacks internet upside the hub*

Eh, but anyway, I'll try and turn it into something useful...

Somehow I kinda doubt that Obi-wan could possibly forget the droids.. he probably was just covering up the relationship for Luke's sake, so he didn't confuse the heck out of him. I mean, what are the odds of a blue R-2 unit pairing up with a gold 3PO, and landing in his lap? That had to set of something in his memory. He may not have been sure at first, but I'm pretty sure he knew who they really were by the time he viewed the message. The connection to Leia's adopted father probably should've made it clear who they were.

What's kind of funny is the chain of events as they probably should have happened... if it hadn't been for the jawas, R-2 would've probably found Obi-wan, and alerted him to what was going on, in which case, Obi-wan would've probably had to pick up Luke on the way anyway... the implied reason for him staying on Tattooine in the first place was to watch over Luke, and let him in on the story at the right time (or shovel it off onto Yoda )

Or maybe he just didn't care? All Astromech droids look the same, and after 20 years its probably a footnote in his memory. Plus, R2 and Obiwan never really hung out. I think the Vader not remembering is more suspect.

[lt.actionjackson]

I think the Vader not remembering is more suspect

This will probably be written off as soon as Vader awakens in the suit.

Palps: Arise Lord Vader...

Vader: (poo pahh) Who???

Palps: You, you pile of bolts@

Vader: Oh, okay....

[MrDisco]

http://www.darkhorizons.com/news05/050318a.php

3D?? hmmmm

let the milking continue! mooooooo.

[Dobber]

ACK! again... *smacks internet upside the hub*

Eh, but anyway, I'll try and turn it into something useful...

Somehow I kinda doubt that Obi-wan could possibly forget the droids.. he probably was just covering up the relationship for Luke's sake, so he didn't confuse the heck out of him.  I mean, what are the odds of a blue R-2 unit pairing up with a gold 3PO, and landing in his lap?  That had to set of something in his memory.  He may not have been sure at first, but I'm pretty sure he knew who they really were by the time he viewed the message.  The connection to Leia's adopted father probably should've made it clear who they were.

What's kind of funny is the chain of events as they probably should have happened... if it hadn't been for the jawas, R-2 would've probably found Obi-wan, and alerted him to what was going on, in which case, Obi-wan would've probably had to pick up Luke on the way anyway... the implied reason for him staying on Tattooine in the first place was to watch over Luke, and let him in on the story at the right time (or shovel it off onto Yoda )

Or maybe he just didn't care? All Astromech droids look the same, and after 20 years its probably a footnote in his memory. Plus, R2 and Obiwan never really hung out. I think the Vader not remembering is more suspect.

3PO even more so since he built him. I like to think that Vader DID recognize 3PO when he finally see's him in Empire. The scene when Han is going to be frozen in Carbonite, Chewie freaks out and starts tossing storm troopers, Fett raises his blaster to shot the wookie( who happens to have 3PO on his back) and Vader stops him.? Why? After all he's only a Wookie right. I like to think he recognized 3PO and didn't want to risk him getting even more damaged or even destroyed. Food for thought.

Chris

[azrael]

Luke asked him if they were his and Ben just says"I don't remember ever owning a droid."

I don't think it's his "certain point of view". He never owned R4 either. R4 was just the droid assigned to his fighter. Obi-wan answered exactly what Luke asked him. Did those droids belong to Obi-wan? No. And that's all he answered.

The scene when Han is going to be frozen in Carbonite, Chewie freaks out and starts tossing storm troopers, Fett raises his blaster to shot the wookie( who happens to have 3PO on his back) and Vader stops him.? Why? After all he's only a Wookie right.

Or because he wanted them alive and it wasn't necessary to shoot. And an angry Wookie is a nasty Wookie. Judging by what we've seen in the trailer and for those of use who've played Republic Commando, Wookies are can handle themselves in a close quarter situation.

[CoryHolmes]

And an angry Wookie is a nasty Wookie.

I'd go a few steps farther and say that an angry Wookie is a SCARY Wookie. I don't know about you, but I'm rather fond of having my arms still in their sockets, thank you very much.

[Dobber]

True, but he's already got the Princess who could yeild much more important info, he's freezing Han without questioning him, plus the whole air of the Empire not liking non-humans ( at least that's how the OT portrayed it to me).

It very well could have been Vader wanting one more prisoner alive, it's just after learining that Anakin built C-3PO, that scene can have a whole new meaning.

Chris