Akilae Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 I figured we got all sorts of anime and gun nuts here, so I thought I might ask this here =) Does anybody know what caliber shells the labors in Patlabor shoot off from their hand cannons? Mainly their revolvers and their shotguns. Quote
F-ZeroOne Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 (edited) The revolver cannon are 37mm - although I personally feel the animators don't always strictly stick to that... (an interesting choice of calibre as well - many grenade launchers and the like are a similar calibre, which fits in with the "police" styling... ) I haven't seen a calibre for the shotguns, though. Edited February 7, 2005 by F-ZeroOne Quote
Nightbat Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 The revolver cannon are 37mm - although I personally feel the animators don't always strictly stick to that... Didn't I see Noa holding a huge-a** bullit in her arms to load into the revolver? Been a while since I've seen Patlabor, but if memory serves me right that shell was at least twice the size you mentioned Quote
drifand Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 From the tech specs on my old 1/60 Ingram toy: 37mm Revolver Cannon, 90mm Shotgun BTW, if you own the Patlabor WXIII special edition DVDs, the extra Mini-Pato feature has one episode with Goto explaining EVERYTHING about the Patlabor firearms. Very otaku (scripted by Oshii), pretty funny. Quote
Warmaker Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 In Mini-Pato, from what I recall, Capt.Goto also explains into great detail on how the anime-robot business functions with great humor. Quote
Jolly Rogers Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 I don't remember if it was in Mini-Pato or a magazine article, but the validity of the (size of) firearms used by the Ingrams were questioned and refuted using the laws of physics. Quote
Godzilla Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 37mm Revolver Cannon, 90mm Shotgun. I just saw the DVD 1 of the Part 1 set of the Patlabor TV series after Superbowl. On a similar note, I have all the Patlabor DVDs. I see this supposed Season 1 with is just 9 episodes. Then we have the 2 part DVD sets of 4 DVDs each which is the "2nd Season" but technically to me it isnt because it seems that it reintroduce the characters. I mean, I see no continuity from the "1st season". So I am lost why they (the Japanese production team) do this. Quote
Britai 7018 Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 Yeah, I highly recommend watching the Mini-Pato series as they go over the physics of Patlabor. You can find it in the Patlabor 3 movie box set. And it is HILARIOUS. Quote
F-ZeroOne Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 The revolver cannon are 37mm - although I personally feel the animators don't always strictly stick to that... Didn't I see Noa holding a huge-a** bullit in her arms to load into the revolver? Been a while since I've seen Patlabor, but if memory serves me right that shell was at least twice the size you mentioned I've also remembered that in the Griffon story arc, Ota and Hiromi manhandle the revolver cannon, and it is huge - yet 37mm is commonly used by security forces for grenade launchers and the like. However, the Bandai MG model kits have a fairly skinny revolver that seems more in scale. Like I said, I think its not one of the more consistent elements... Quote
F-ZeroOne Posted February 7, 2005 Posted February 7, 2005 On a similar note, I have all the Patlabor DVDs. I see this supposed Season 1 with is just 9 episodes. Then we have the 2 part DVD sets of 4 DVDs each which is the "2nd Season" but technically to me it isnt because it seems that it reintroduce the characters. I mean, I see no continuity from the "1st season". So I am lost why they (the Japanese production team) do this. I think whats happened here is this: Patlabor was originally an OAV series. It was so successful that a TV series was produced, but existing in a seperate continuity to the original OAVs (thus needing to re-introduce the characters). After the TV series another OAV series was made, this one actually following on from the TV series. A similar thing occurred with Tenchi Muyo!. Possibly the "1st Season" and "2nd Season" are the US distros labelling? Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 The common misconception I'm seeing most people have here is that the 37mm round used by police and sportsman is not an actual round but rather is a special low-pressue grenade. These grenades do not use powder propellant like a normal bullet or artillery round but rather use gas pressure to propel the grenade. These 37mm grenade rounds are known as "blooper" rounds because when fired they make a distinctive "PHUNT!" noise, like someone kicking a football really hard rather than a loud CRACK that you would associate with a powder propelled bullet or shell. These 37mm police canister rounds are mainly used to shoot flares and gas, not lethal grenade rounds like their deadly military 40mm brothers. Shown here for context are two military 40mm grenades: Each of these can fit in a man's hand and are slightly smaller than a can of soda, imagine a can of soda missing about an inch from the top and about half an inch in diameter. They are quite light but very deadly to soft targets. They also come in "shotgun" rounds that let the user fire a shotgun style flechette round. But the main point is these are rifle grenades and not suited for armor piercing. Most likely what the patlabor folks had in mind were the original 37mm artillery shells These babies are large shells used in antiaircraft cannons and in a few armored vehicle mounted anti-vehicle cannons. These suckers weigh about 6 to 8 pounds each, are slightly more than a foot long and can easly penetrate most vehicle armor, outside of the heaviest tank plating. In a very large robot-sized revolver these shells would go through walls or vehicle metal, doing a nice amount of damage. If I remember the shot correctly, there is a shot in Patlabor 1 (the first movie) when Noa is on a frieght elevator headed to the Ark' command tower and she gets out and reloads her labor's revolver. The shells she holds she cradles in her arms and for all accounts they appear to be about the size shown in the second photo... keeping in mind Noa is a japanese woman of slight stature the shells she holds appear larger than they might actually be. Quote
Akilae Posted February 8, 2005 Author Posted February 8, 2005 My main problem is that exact scene with Nao handling the shell... I was beginning to think if they used 105 or 120 mm tank shells or something similar. Speaking of which, why not use tank shells anyway? More abudant (supposedly), proven capabilities, etc.. or given the Japanese anime communitie's infatuation with all things German, why not the 88? Ech, never felt like getting WXIII... never felt the whole mutated genetic engineered monster was quite in line with the rest of the Patlabor story. But there's the Mini-Pato series... so conflicted... Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Because an 88mm artillery shell would cause massive collateral damage. After all, these are police and not military or special forces. They only need weapons capable of subduing or incapacitating the offending labors... not blow them into pieces. Almost all of the labors Special Vehicle Section 1 and 2 encounter are rogue construction units and the like... nothing armored or specially modified for combat. Moat labors are akin to today's cars, meaning their coverings are made of thin metal or plastic and the weapons the SVT units have are more than enough to take down those sort of units. If you do some looking you'd see that the military units in Patlabor have all those big guns... just not the cops. The biggest thing the police would need is the 90mm riot gun (shotgun) which is for labor "riot" interdiction. (sort of like a real riot gun the Patlabor one shoots massive "buckshot" intended to damage multiple aggressive targets while not being too powerfully damaging to the surrounding elements) Also the SVT units adhere to the same "rules" that most foot officers do... namely they are not supposed to shoot a labor that is not immediately threatening them with harm. Ota is just a bit triggerhappy. Quote
JELEINEN Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 On a similar note, I have all the Patlabor DVDs. I see this supposed Season 1 with is just 9 episodes. Then we have the 2 part DVD sets of 4 DVDs each which is the "2nd Season" but technically to me it isnt because it seems that it reintroduce the characters. I mean, I see no continuity from the "1st season". So I am lost why they (the Japanese production team) do this. I think whats happened here is this: Patlabor was originally an OAV series. It was so successful that a TV series was produced, but existing in a seperate continuity to the original OAVs (thus needing to re-introduce the characters). After the TV series another OAV series was made, this one actually following on from the TV series. A similar thing occurred with Tenchi Muyo!. Possibly the "1st Season" and "2nd Season" are the US distros labelling? There's also a third separate introduction in the manga, which was released concurrently with the original OVA. Quote
Lynx7725 Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Ota is just a bit triggerhappy. Just a BIT? Quote
azrael Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Most the the equipment stats can be found here: http://www.mahq.net/mecha/patlabor/patlabor.htm Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Ota is just a bit triggerhappy. Just a BIT? Well... there is triggerhappy and then there is uncontrollable. At least his accuracy with a labor weapon makes up for his brash willingness to use them to solve all of life's problems. If you had a pilot with Noa's piloting skills and Ota's marksmanship with the Captain's cool head you'd have one fine labor driver. Quote
GRAND CANNON Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Ech, never felt like getting WXIII... never felt the whole mutated genetic engineered monster was quite in line with the rest of the Patlabor story. But there's the Mini-Pato series... so conflicted... Hmmmmmm, and I was planning on picking up a cheap box set today. Is the movie that bad? Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 To sum it up in a nutshell, WXIII focuses on the cast of Patlabor about as much as Macross 7 focuses on DYRL... meaning the movie is very light on actual Patlabor and very heavy on things that are not Patlabor. IMHO WXIII is a story "from the Patlabor world", not necessarily a movie about the Special Vehicle Section 2 or it's characters. Sure they make a brief cameo in the movie but the focus of the third movie are the detectives and their case. Imagine the first two Patlabor movies with almost all of the SVS2 stuff cut out. Quote
GRAND CANNON Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 So, is it safe to assume there's not a lot of Labor-goodness? Then again, the set is only $10....and it appears that the secondary DVDs may be worth that alone. We'll see. Quote
Warmaker Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 The animation in WXIII is great but I'm still very disappointed in seeing practically nothing of the original characters. Even Det.Matsui doesn't get as much attention as his partner. No Patlabor goodness there, folks. Move along! Quote
drifand Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 I enjoyed WXIII for the drama and atmosphere. It was a very interesting "excursion" into the world of Patlabor! The animation (by Madhouse) and music (Kenji Kawaii of course) were very well done, close to anything Oshii could've produced with Production IG, yet DIFFERENT, because the director focused on telling a human story instead of harping on all kinds of deep philosophies. If all you're hoping for is more mecha labor action, this is not it. Come to think of it, the first 2 Patlabor movies weren't too action packed either, except in spurts. To me, Patlabor as a whole will always be about characters first. Quote
Akilae Posted February 8, 2005 Author Posted February 8, 2005 If it's cheap, grab it. Personally, they could have it named it Whatchamacallit WXIII, and it wouldn't have made a difference. Like ARCLIGHT said, just imagine a Patlabor movie with almost no connections to the Patlabor you know and love. The first two I could imagine happening in the Patlabor world... WXIII... I dunno... it's like Patlabor vs. Godzilla... Thx on all the shell info btw pplz! Quote
GRAND CANNON Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 I'm going to give a look. Thanks for all of the input. Quote
Godzilla Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Wasted WXIII Is the project the military/scientist called the experiment. I liked the movie because it was refreshing look at the Patlabor world other than focusing on Special Vehicles Division 2. Ota is too trigger happy. Noa is too much of a tomboy. Quote
Jolly Rogers Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 Like ARCLIGHT said, just imagine a Patlabor movie with almost no connections to the Patlabor you know and love. The first two I could imagine happening in the Patlabor world... WXIII... I dunno... it's like Patlabor vs. Godzilla... Actually, the third movie's plot came directly from the manga, except it focuses on different characters instead of the SV2. Quote
JELEINEN Posted February 8, 2005 Posted February 8, 2005 WXIII has a predictable plot centered around a cheesey giant monster. I recomend tossing it and just keeping the Mini Pat shorts (which should have been sold separately). Quote
GRAND CANNON Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 If it's cheap, grab it. DONE. Good, bad, or indifferent......for $10...who cares!!! But seriously, can't wait to check it out - just have to finish Last Exile and Ace Combat 5. Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 IMHO they bundled WXIII with MiniPato for just that reason... a prize in the box of nasty tasting cereal to get people to buy it. I had no clue that plotline was from the manga... I guess then it makes more sense now, as if it was just a one-off standalone movie it is a little deceptive. Quote
Jolly Rogers Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 IMHO they bundled WXIII with MiniPato for just that reason... a prize in the box of nasty tasting cereal to get people to buy it. My understanding was that they showed Mini-Pato in theaters before the WXIII movie. Kind of like how the recent Pixar features always kickstarted with a short. Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 That is what I meant, MiniPato was bundled with WXIII to get people to watch the movie/buy the movie/rent the movie. WXIII by itself is not worth the ticket/DVD/rental price. Quote
GRAND CANNON Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 JsARCLIGHT, just noticed your siggy.......good song. Quote
Jolly Rogers Posted February 9, 2005 Posted February 9, 2005 That is what I meant, MiniPato was bundled with WXIII to get people to watch the movie/buy the movie/rent the movie. WXIII by itself is not worth the ticket/DVD/rental price. The MiniPato DVD was available independently from the WXIII movie in Japan, you didn't have to buy WXIII to get MiniPato, at least in Japan. Pioneer is the one that makes people buy the whole schpiel... and I paid full MSRP, not $10, for the stupid box!!! Quote
JsARCLIGHT Posted February 10, 2005 Posted February 10, 2005 Oh well that is different then... I have only seen WXIII alone or with MiniPato on DVD. Quote
JELEINEN Posted February 11, 2005 Posted February 11, 2005 Just saw these in CD Japan's clearance section: http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=BCBA-1847 http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/detailview.html?KEY=BCBA-1848 Anyone know much about them? Quote
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