Transformers Thread 2

[Tico0001]

Looks like the place to post this: http://www.darkhorizons.com/news05/050526d.php

Does not sound good at all.

*remains silen about the taxi thing*

What doesnt sound good about it? You wanted it to be more violent, ie not so family??

"family movie" definitely does NOT sound good... It better be at least PG!

~Tico

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

What doesnt sound good about it? You wanted it to be more violent, ie not so family??

When you think about it robots killing robots isn't violence. (no blood or gore)

Remember how violent wolverines attack's were against the sentinels in the x-men cartoon? But you never saw him rip a fleshy character to shreds did you? And even though the robots in transformers are not mass produced (they seem coser to people - like when one dies its gone for good) they can repair themselves.

That kind of thing can still be in a transformers movie and still be family friendly.

Plus no hint of sex and no drugs in the TF universe so really nothing to complain about here.

Maybe like the BattleStar Galctica series they can even invent new swear words and still be ok with parents bringing thier kids to see the movie.

Face it transformers (a kids robot show) should be marketed towards that audience. The movie should be at the least an entertaining popcorn flick.

I hope it stays at around the level of the old live action Teenage mutant ninja turtles movie. Just give us a dark mood (I would like to see movie autobots as being grim and serious and at least conflicting in ideas) with effictive lighting(play with light, don't stick to bright colours like the toys or anime), some humor that doesn't take the thing too seriously,(eg starscreams sarcastic comments) decent action scenes (interesting car stunts with robot transforms in mid air) and an epic story like the animated transformers movie. I'm thinking something like star wars, that does not pay attention to technical detail but goes all out in action and interesting characters. I will watch a movie when I see characters with some level of depth.

And it shouldn't be afriad to ignore the canon. What I want to see at least 3 major things that are new and different about the movie version of transformers from the 80s version. I will still go to see it if it is family friendly but if it screws up that's another thing.

I'm hoping it will be at least PG too though and avoid aiming specifically to kids rather than to both adults AND kids if you know what I mean. The Macross Plus OVA were PG and still family friendly. Violence, blood and gore isn't always necessary to make something watchable you know..

Edited May 29, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[al0324]

ugh family movie? that's more on the lines of Spy Kids.

what was the rating on the old transformers movie? they had a lot of death in that one.

[JELEINEN]

I don't mind it being family friendly. I enjoy taking my young nephews to movies. I just don't like the plot premise. It sounds like Herbie the Love Bug.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

what was the rating on the old transformers movie? they had a lot of death in that one.

PG. I got the dvd here. But those deaths only occured to sell new toys.

As long as they don't stuff it up, I'll be happy. If it does end up sucking it can't necessarily be blamed on the rating though since this can't be used as an excuse from the examples: macross plus, transformers the movie are both "family friendly" but not necessarily "kiddy-only" which can satisfy a broad range of ages.

Edited May 29, 2005 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Myriad]

A Herbie movie is already coming out........

[mikeszekely]

Every young male can relate to owning their first car - typically a clunker. Well, imagine a kid who gets his first clunker car, but it happens to be a Transformer.

I just don't like the plot premise. It sounds like Herbie the Love Bug.

Sounds a little lame to me, too... but also kind of similar to the first issues of the Marvel run from back in the 80's, when Buster first drives Bumblebee back to the garage.

If we can get off the toys for awhile, is anyone watching any of the newer TF shows? I loved G1 (comics and show), but I hated Beast Wars/Beast Metals and Robots in Disguise (Car Robots). As a result, I'd pretty much given up on new TF shows, and I wound up not catching any of Armada save the PS2 game.

I started watching Super Link (aka Energon), though, and I'm actually getting pretty into it.

Edited June 1, 2005 by mikeszekely

[Renato]

Don't like any of the newer shows, sorry. Watched a couple of RiD (Optimus catches on fire... But can't he just transform into a fire engine and put it out?), and watched a couple of Superlink (Orange Shockwave is Galvatron's little brother? WTF?)... Don't even remember if I ever saw any Armada. Still haven't seen any Galaxy Force, but I have no desire to do so in a hurry.

However, I would like to hear what the deal was with Unicron coming back and everything in Armada and Superlink. Can anyone be bothered to sum it all up in a couple of paragraphs?

[mikeszekely]

Well, remember first that Armada is like an alternate universe and not really a sequel to the G1 stuff... kinda like the relationship between SEED and original Gundam.

Armada starts with a war on Cybertron between the Autobots and Decepticons, but they're not the only factions on Cybertron. It turns out that another faction, the Minicons, can be used to increase the powers of the others. The Minicons flee Cybertron to get away from the war, and end up on Earth, where they send a distress call. The Decepticons wind up following the distress call, and the Autobots follow after the Decepticons.

Okay, now for the BIG SPOILERS!!!

It turns out that the Minicons are actually little parts of Unicron, and their initial distress call winds up waking Unicron or something (I didn't see Armada, I just read some summaries). The Autobots, Minicons, and Decepticons wind up going back to Cybertron, but so does Unicron. Only by teaming together do the Autobots and Decepticons manage to defeat Unicron.

Now it's hard to say for sure, since I'm only about 20 episodes into Energon, but Energon takes place 10 years later. The Autobots, Decepticons, and the people of Earth are working together to mine energon from various points on Earth, the moon, and Mars for the betterment of everyone. Alpha Quintesson creates Terrorcons to steal the energon to use to ressurect Unicron. In the process, he accidentally ressurrects Megatron, who has sort of bonded with Unicron's spark. Megatron takes Unicron's body, while Alpha Q takes Unicron's head, and while Megatron re-enlists the Decepticons, Alpha Q and Scorpinok are allied with a group of Autobots led by Rodimus, and we're left with three competing factions... the Decepticons, led by Megatron, who want to ressurrect Unicron for power, Alpha Q's group, who seem to want to ressurect Unicron to use him to restore Alpha Q's homeword (which was eaten by Unicron), and the Autobots led by Optimus, who are against any ressurrection of Unicron at all.

[Renato]

I see...

So it's all just an alternate universe thing..? Hmm. Well, let's have an opinion poll. What's been the best show up to now? Original? Headmasters? Victory? GF?

[Fit For Natalie]

Don't like any of the newer shows, sorry. Watched a couple of RiD (Optimus catches on fire... But can't he just transform into a fire engine and put it out?), and watched a couple of Superlink (Orange Shockwave is Galvatron's little brother? WTF?)... Don't even remember if I ever saw any Armada. Still haven't seen any Galaxy Force, but I have no desire to do so in a hurry.

The yellow-orange Shockwave, named SixShot, is Laserwave's younger brother. Galvatron tricks him by claiming Grand Convoy killed his brother.

Hands down, the best Transformers series ever made was Beast Wars, due to its superb treatment as a serious scifi programme, powerful material, excellent performances by a cast that enjoyed their work and wonderful character development.

Armada suffered from bad animation and poor early episodes that focused far too much on the kids - this I wouldn't mind in itself but the kids were written very badly in the dub. Apparently when the japanese redubed the show into Micron Densetsu, they went to pains to fix alot of things.

Around episode 14, it gradually got better, with nice episodes focusing on Hot Shot's growth as a character, and Starscream's continuing development from Megatron's second in command into an honourable warrior in the mold of Beast Wars' Dinobot.

Superlink started off with a bang, with lots of nice development and characterisations, particularly Demolishor's. But then it lost its way after episode 25 or so when they went to the other side of the universe and began to do nothing. The combiner teams, because they were developed late in the line, were kind of shoved in at the last minute, so Studio A-CAT never had time to do a proper combining sequence until the Special one-off episode. And the series had a terrible ending with Galvatron and Grand Convoy growing big and fighting each other. Really bad animation by the end, too.

Energon's dub was a clusterfark. Most of the actors are very good on other dubs, but are terrible on this show due to the speed of which the shows were made, no doubt at the behest of the Cartoon Network and Hasbro.

Galaxy Force is shaping up to be one of the best modern Transformers series. Gonzo's animation is excellent, and the writing, while not superb (the Speedia races were drawn out far too long), is the closest we've ever gotten to an american-style series from Japanese writers, in that its relatively serious, the humans are not the stars but actually helpful, developed characters who don't get in the way. And there's some great character development in certain characters that show there are shades of grey.

[VF-19]

Finally got my hands on a silverstreak yesterday. Local Walmart was selling Alternators for $10 Canadian. Saw it as a good reason to pick him up!

[mikeszekely]

Hands down, the best Transformers series ever made was Beast Wars, due to its superb treatment as a serious scifi programme, powerful material, excellent performances by a cast that enjoyed their work and wonderful character development.

I have to say that I haven't seen Headmasters, Masterforce, Victory, or any of the other Japanese shows between G1 and RiD. So I can't judge them fairly.

Of the ones I've seen... G1, Beast Wars, Beast Machines, RiD, and about half of Super Link/Energon, the best is easily G1. Yes, there were some very cheesy episodes (Kremzeek, anyone?), but between it, the movie, and the Marvel comics, it set the standard. Sure, nostalgia might factor in, but it's what we grew up on. Nothing has, and nothing will ever come close again.

I have to disagree with FfN, I HATED Beast Wars. The CGI was dull, the planet it was set on was a barren rock, and while it seemed to have decent character development, to someone who grew up on G1, it just wasn't Transformers if it didn't have Autobots and Decepticons who turned into damn near anything BUT animals. Not to mention that the writers weren't even familiar with Transformers when they started the series. After they did watch it, though, BW did start to pick up in Season 2 as they started to tie it in with the original.

But then they ruined it all anyway with Beast Machines.

RiD was like a breath of fresh air after the Beast series... I mean, it had robots that turned into cars again! But the writing seemed overly juvenile.

I haven't finished it yet, but Super Link/Energon is shaping up to be an excellent series.

[promethuem5]

I have to agree with Mike.... too many aminals, not enough good stuff...got interesting towards the end, but then they butt-raped their own series into the godaweful Beast Machines... I STILL dont get the plotline behind that one...

[Hoptimus]

Don't like any of the newer shows, sorry.  Watched a couple of RiD (Optimus catches on fire... But can't he just transform into a fire engine and put it out?), and watched a couple of Superlink (Orange Shockwave is Galvatron's little brother?  WTF?)... Don't even remember if I ever saw any Armada.  Still haven't seen any Galaxy Force, but I have no desire to do so in a hurry.

The yellow-orange Shockwave, named SixShot, is Laserwave's younger brother. Galvatron tricks him by claiming Grand Convoy killed his brother.

Hands down, the best Transformers series ever made was Beast Wars, due to its superb treatment as a serious scifi programme, powerful material, excellent performances by a cast that enjoyed their work and wonderful character development.

Armada suffered from bad animation and poor early episodes that focused far too much on the kids - this I wouldn't mind in itself but the kids were written very badly in the dub. Apparently when the japanese redubed the show into Micron Densetsu, they went to pains to fix alot of things.

Around episode 14, it gradually got better, with nice episodes focusing on Hot Shot's growth as a character, and Starscream's continuing development from Megatron's second in command into an honourable warrior in the mold of Beast Wars' Dinobot.

Superlink started off with a bang, with lots of nice development and characterisations, particularly Demolishor's. But then it lost its way after episode 25 or so when they went to the other side of the universe and began to do nothing. The combiner teams, because they were developed late in the line, were kind of shoved in at the last minute, so Studio A-CAT never had time to do a proper combining sequence until the Special one-off episode. And the series had a terrible ending with Galvatron and Grand Convoy growing big and fighting each other. Really bad animation by the end, too.

Energon's dub was a clusterfark. Most of the actors are very good on other dubs, but are terrible on this show due to the speed of which the shows were made, no doubt at the behest of the Cartoon Network and Hasbro.

Galaxy Force is shaping up to be one of the best modern Transformers series. Gonzo's animation is excellent, and the writing, while not superb (the Speedia races were drawn out far too long), is the closest we've ever gotten to an american-style series from Japanese writers, in that its relatively serious, the humans are not the stars but actually helpful, developed characters who don't get in the way. And there's some great character development in certain characters that show there are shades of grey.

Yes.

Beast Wars is the best. It is the peak and I dont see any show getting better. If you have the DVDs you can watch interviews with the writers/directors of the show. They were really set out to make a great well written sci-fi show that just happened to be in the Transformers mythos. Not some half assed too many charicter toy mongering show that Armada and Energon have been.

[wolfx]

Yes.

Beast Wars is the best. It is the peak and I dont see any show getting better. If you have the DVDs you can watch interviews with the writers/directors of the show. They were really set out to make a great well written sci-fi show that just happened to be in the Transformers mythos. Not some half assed too many charicter toy mongering show that Armada and Energon have been.

Do you think this is probably due to the fact that the japs are the ones who wrote energon and armada that seemed to be marketed more to kids and Beast Wars was the last TF series written by the US?

[eugimon]

Yes.

Beast Wars is the best. It is the peak and I dont see any show getting better. If you have the DVDs you can watch interviews with the writers/directors of the show. They were really set out to make a great well written sci-fi show that just happened to be in the Transformers mythos. Not some half assed too many charicter toy mongering show that Armada and Energon have been.

Do you think this is probably due to the fact that the japs are the ones who wrote energon and armada that seemed to be marketed more to kids and Beast Wars was the last TF series written by the US?

japs?

[GobotFool]

Yes.

Beast Wars is the best. It is the peak and I dont see any show getting better. If you have the DVDs you can watch interviews with the writers/directors of the show. They were really set out to make a great well written sci-fi show that just happened to be in the Transformers mythos. Not some half assed too many charicter toy mongering show that Armada and Energon have been.

not to jump all over you with political correctness and all, but you may want to avoid using "Japs" as many consider that a rather derogatory way of refering to japanese people. Just an offer of friendly advice. I know you probably didn't mean anything by it, but I've seen a few people get in trouble for using it.

Edited June 8, 2005 by GobotFool

[wolfx]

Noted.....though i doubt the Japanese themselves care. Its usually the "gaijins" who make a fuss over PC incorrectness.

I for one don't care if someone called me a chink though others actually do mind.

Ok..back to the topic at hand!

[mikeszekely]

Yes.

Beast Wars is the best. It is the peak and I dont see any show getting better. If you have the DVDs you can watch interviews with the writers/directors of the show. They were really set out to make a great well written sci-fi show that just happened to be in the Transformers mythos. Not some half assed too many charicter toy mongering show that Armada and Energon have been.

Do you think this is probably due to the fact that the japs are the ones who wrote energon and armada that seemed to be marketed more to kids and Beast Wars was the last TF series written by the US?

No, because I'm up to about episode 30 so far of Energon, and I'm loving it. And to call Beast Wars a "great well written sci-fi show" is to be overly generous. It starts off very similar to G1 Transformers, then is filled with the "Look, it's CGI!" fluff that was the trend for it's time... and sold a lot of toys anyway. Beast Wars wasn't even remotely entertaining until the writers boned up on their Transformers mythos and began to tie Beast Wars to G1. And, whatever potential they were starting to dig up, they threw out the window when they did the remarkably crappy Beast Machines.

Bottom line: If Optimus doesn't turn into a big rig, it just isn't Transformers in my book. (Fire engines don't count, RiD!)

[promethuem5]

Bottom line: If Optimus doesn't turn into a big rig, it just isn't Transformers in my book. (Fire engines don't count, RiD!)

Amen! (Altho, the RID Prime was a really nice toy....)

Side note- Does anyone know wtf actually HAPPENED in, about, around, or related to Beast Machines? That had to be one of the msot confusing 'plots' ever....way to kill a franchise

[NSJ23]

Bottom line: If Optimus doesn't turn into a big rig, it just isn't Transformers in my book. (Fire engines don't count, RiD!)

Everyone hates on RID, but IMO it was still better than Armada or Energon. It was weird, fun and just plain more enjoyable than the two most recent shows.

And anyone who thinks that G1 TV is good has really been kicked in the ass by nostalgia. Except for a precious few eps IMO it sucked too.

[BoBe-Patt]

Bottom line: If Optimus doesn't turn into a big rig, it just isn't Transformers in my book.  (Fire engines don't count, RiD!)

Everyone hates on RID, but IMO it was still better than Armada or Energon. It was weird, fun and just plain more enjoyable than the two most recent shows.

And anyone who thinks that G1 TV is good has really been kicked in the ass by nostalgia. Except for a precious few eps IMO it sucked too.

yes, I second that RID is waaaay much better than energon or armada. Only thing armada offered me that was never made was Unicron. That's it.

[eugimon]

Bottom line: If Optimus doesn't turn into a big rig, it just isn't Transformers in my book.  (Fire engines don't count, RiD!)

Everyone hates on RID, but IMO it was still better than Armada or Energon. It was weird, fun and just plain more enjoyable than the two most recent shows.

And anyone who thinks that G1 TV is good has really been kicked in the ass by nostalgia. Except for a precious few eps IMO it sucked too.

gotta agree with you.. the original show was ass... my friend picked up the DVDs and I try to watch a few.. just for memories but it was just so cheese.

[Hoptimus]

I still consider Beast Wars the best.

Yeah it starts out without much connection to G1 but by the end of season 1 you are hooked.

I have all of Gen1 on DVD. Cept for a scant few episodes its pretty bad and quite funny.

I would rate the shows I have seen like this.

1.)Beast Wars

2.)RID(plots were stupid but I liked the hand drawn anime look)

3.)Gen1

4.)Energon

5.)Armada(the worst show by far IMO)

I never got to see Beast Machines so I cant comment on that.

[Metal_Massacre_79]

the original show was ass... my friend picked up the DVDs and I try to watch a few.. just for memories but it was just so cheese.

I had a friend that bought those too. The wife was away for the weekend so we watched a few episodes. I couldn't imagine why I was so interested in such a cheesy cartoon as a kid. Back in the day, G1 was awesome. I can even remember running home after school to watch it.

Now the cycle is repeating, because I let my kid watch the first episode of G1, and now he's hooked on it.

[mikeszekely]

The thing with G1 is, while it had some lame, cheesy episodes, it did have some good ones. Not to mention that the movie kicked ass. But the important thing is, those were the characters that we grew to love to this very day. The characters in every other series since are just pale imitiations.

Beast Wars, in my opinion, had some of the worst characters. And the only reason it DOES get interesting in the end is because it ties to G1.

[promethuem5]

Only thing armada offered me that was never made was Unicron. That's it.

Good enough for me!

[trueblueeyes]

Best news since Predaking...According to BBTS, Star Convoy will be reissued. Can't wait for this one. Now we need Star Saber and Victory Leo reissues, plus all the G1 gestalts.

Star Convoy

[BoBe-Patt]

Best news since Predaking...According to BBTS, Star Convoy will be reissued. Can't wait for this one. Now we need Star Saber and Victory Leo reissues, plus all the G1 gestalts.

Star Convoy

I might pick that up if the price was a little cheaper. I definitly want a Victory Saber giftset reissue. I'd be all over that!

[bigkid24]

Best news since Predaking...According to BBTS, Star Convoy will be reissued.    Can't wait for this one.  Now we need Star Saber and Victory Leo reissues, plus all the G1 gestalts.

Star Convoy

I might pick that up if the price was a little cheaper. I definitly want a Victory Saber giftset reissue. I'd be all over that!

Pat, who are you kidding. You're gonna pick that up and you're going to like it!

[promethuem5]

I almost pre-ordered the Star Convoy... I almost pissed myself in shock when I read the newsletter too, but I decided to pre_order a 1/48 CF and get Star Convoy when it comes out.....

[wolfx]

Best news since Predaking...According to BBTS, Star Convoy will be reissued. Can't wait for this one. Now we need Star Saber and Victory Leo reissues, plus all the G1 gestalts.

Star Convoy

I don't really know what star convoy is but its transformation looks almost exactly like the Power Master Optimus Prime ...and i forgot his Japanese name, but it wasn't Convoy. (hence he wasn't included in the History of Convoy section of the MP-01 Convoy)

[Renato]

Best news since Predaking...According to BBTS, Star Convoy will be reissued.    Can't wait for this one.  Now we need Star Saber and Victory Leo reissues, plus all the G1 gestalts.

Star Convoy

I don't really know what star convoy is but its transformation looks almost exactly like the Power Master Optimus Prime ...and i forgot his Japanese name, but it wasn't Convoy. (hence he wasn't included in the History of Convoy section of the MP-01 Convoy)

It was Gin Rai.

[Renato]

Interesting news about the Star Convoy reissue. I believe that one was motorised, no?

As for G1: Yeah, I was also shocked at how crappy I found the show to be after seeing a bit of my friend's original series DVDs shortly after they came out. I couldn't even sit still and watch it. The animation was good for its day, but everything else was pure cheese.

The movie kicks ass to this day, though, and the live action one has its work cut out for it if it wants to topple the original.

This is how great the original show was:

http://homepage.mac.com/thansson/reviews/TFDVD1/tfdvd1.htm

http://homepage.mac.com/thansson/reviews/TFDVD2/tfdvd2.htm

And the 80s follow-ups were not much better:

http://homepage.mac.com/thansson/headmasters/