The MW Automotive Thread

[Stamen0083]

Nah, I like the Elise.  27mpg, thats like a hybrid, but it does 0-60 in 4.7 and runs cones faster than ANY Ferrari.  Just awesome.

That's because that thing weighs about 2000 pounds. Compare that to a hefty 3415 pounds of the BMW M3, for example, and you can see how just 190 horsepower can let it run circles around the fastest supercars, literally.

Can't say I like the styling though, but I do love those numbers.

reddsuns: I think it's a matter of "look how much money I have invested in this car" kind of thing. Besides, their bling selection is rather limited to ugly, really ugly, and extremely ugly wheels.

Edited October 18, 2005 by Stamen0083

[reddsun1]

Yup, the Elise is pretty much credited with bringing that company back from the brink, isn't it? It's the car that sort of "returned to its roots" in regards to design philosophy, i.e. the Colin Chapman school of thought: make it as light as possible; then, remove some more weight. That's pretty much in keeping with the English "character" of car design though, wouldn't you say? If you had to sum up the "national character" of [sports] car designs amongst the major player nations in a phrase or less, how about:

America: There's no substitute for cubic inches; shoe-horn a big ol' V8 in that sumbitch an watch 'er run like a scalded cat!

Britain: It's got to be light, light, light; small displacement is fine when there's a high power/weight ratio.

Germany: Precision engineering; like a surgeon's scalpel, the driver utilizes the car as a fine tool.

Italy: Passion in design; it must be beautiful, evokative--move the soul of driver and bystander alike.

What about Japan? How could one describe their automotive "character"?

Edited October 18, 2005 by reddsun1

[Agent ONE]

Yup, the Elise is pretty much credited with bringing that company back from the brink, isn't it?  It's the car that sort of "returned to its roots" in regards to design philosophy, i.e. the Colin Chapman school of thought: make it as light as possible; then, remove some more weight.  That's pretty much in keeping with the English "character" of car design though, wouldn't you say?  If you had to sum up the "national character" of [sports] car designs amongst the major player nations in a phrase or less, how about:

America: There's no substitute for cubic inches; shoe-horn a big ol' V8 in that sumbitch an watch 'er run like a scalded cat!

Britain:    It's got to be light, light, light; small displacement is fine when there's a high power/weight ratio.

Germany: Precision engineering; like a surgeon's scalpel, the driver utilizes the car as a fine tool.

Italy:  Passion in design; it must be beautiful, evokative--move the soul of driver and bystander alike. 

What about Japan?  How could one describe their automotive "character"?

337656[/snapback]

Japan Equal to all of the above AND cheaper.

[Agent ONE]

Nah, I like the Elise.  27mpg, thats like a hybrid, but it does 0-60 in 4.7 and runs cones faster than ANY Ferrari.  Just awesome.

That's because that thing weighs about 2000 pounds. Compare that to a hefty 3415 pounds of the BMW M3, for example, and you can see how just 190 horsepower can let it run circles around the fastest supercars, literally.

Can't say I like the styling though, but I do love those numbers.

reddsuns: I think it's a matter of "look how much money I have invested in this car" kind of thing. Besides, their bling selection is rather limited to ugly, really ugly, and extremely ugly wheels.

337635[/snapback]

I currently have an M3 and last weekend I went and looked at the Lotus... The Lotus makes the M3 feel like tug boat.

[yellowlightman]

Nah, I like the Elise.  27mpg, thats like a hybrid, but it does 0-60 in 4.7 and runs cones faster than ANY Ferrari.  Just awesome.

337628[/snapback]

Yeah, the Elise is an awesome car. The combination of the reliable Toyota motor and performance just makes a lot of sense. I've been seeing a lot of them around lately, a house a block or two away from me has one parked in the dirveway all the time.

From what I understood the Espirits were absolute garbage. That new design looks atrocious .

[Agent ONE]

Nah, I like the Elise.  27mpg, thats like a hybrid, but it does 0-60 in 4.7 and runs cones faster than ANY Ferrari.  Just awesome.

337628[/snapback]

Yeah, the Elise is an awesome car. The combination of the reliable Toyota motor and performance just makes a lot of sense. I've been seeing a lot of them around lately, a house a block or two away from me has one parked in the dirveway all the time.

From what I understood the Espirits were absolute garbage. That new design looks atrocious .

337704[/snapback]

From the old timer car guys I talk to, the Esprit was a total Ferrari killer 20 years ago. They just kept adding luxury features, increasing the weight of the car, and not updating the technology... Therefore it became a lame ass car. I mean it was just 20 year old technology. It would be like if Ferrari was still making the 308.

[trueblueeyes]

Yup, the Elise is pretty much credited with bringing that company back from the brink, isn't it?  It's the car that sort of "returned to its roots" in regards to design philosophy, i.e. the Colin Chapman school of thought: make it as light as possible; then, remove some more weight.  That's pretty much in keeping with the English "character" of car design though, wouldn't you say?  If you had to sum up the "national character" of [sports] car designs amongst the major player nations in a phrase or less, how about:

America: There's no substitute for cubic inches; shoe-horn a big ol' V8 in that sumbitch an watch 'er run like a scalded cat!

Britain:    It's got to be light, light, light; small displacement is fine when there's a high power/weight ratio.

Germany: Precision engineering; like a surgeon's scalpel, the driver utilizes the car as a fine tool.

Italy:  Passion in design; it must be beautiful, evokative--move the soul of driver and bystander alike. 

What about Japan?  How could one describe their automotive "character"?

337656[/snapback]

Japan Equal to all of the above AND cheaper.

337698[/snapback]

HAHAHAHA! You are kidding right? I'll give you cheaper, but better? Japanese car makers have earned their due but the majority of their vehicles are still econo boxes. Econo boxes that far outperform their American counterparts, but Econo boxes still. Let's take this one at a time.

America: Which RWD V8 Japanese muscle car would you like to compare to the Corvette, Viper, GTO, or Mustang? As far as just about everything else on the market though, sadly you are right.

Britain: Like it or not, the aforementioned Elise wins this category with no competition from the Japanese market. (I don't know how heavy the Integra is, but it certainly doesn't have anything to compare to the Elise's powerplant)

Germany: McLaren SLR, Porsche, Maybach, Audi, BMW. Those names alone will draw respect from a crowd. Try doing that with Honda, Toyota, or Mitsubishi.

Italy: Ferrari, Lamborghini, Maserati, Alfa Romeo, Bizzarini, Iso, Italdesign, Pagani Fiat. The (very overrated) Skyline may be nice, but its no Italian Stallion.

And no, I'm not getting paid by the Big 3. Even as much as I love my Mustangs, my favorite car makers are still German. I don't even dislike Japanese cars, I just have a general apathy toward them. I don't want to drive any kind of an econo box, whether it's of American or Japanese design. (I still think the Impala and the Taurus are tied for ugliest car in the world...although the Charger with its goofy grill may usurp the title...why Dodge why?). So while I will agree that Japanese car makers have a well deserved leg up on American car makers, they don't come even close to European car makers. In a few years maybe, but certainly not now.

[Poonman]

I currently have an M3 and last weekend I went and looked at the Lotus... The Lotus makes the M3 feel like tug boat.

what year is your m3? in another nine months or so I'm going to be in the market for a new car and was thinking of getting an '01 or '02 M3. private party sellers in socal are selling them as low as $30k now w/ 40-50k miles on them.

[Poonman]

this is pretty hot

[trueblueeyes]

Here are a few questions for everybody; How important is your car to you? It it an extension of you, a status symbol, your own amusement ride, or just a way from Point A to Point B? Why do you choose the cars you buy?

I've always driven RWD V8's. That is what I grew up with, it is what I learned to drive in, it is what I learned to work on. My real enjoyment from my vehicle(s) comes from racing them every weekend. Strangely, I can't imagine owning a vehicle I couldn't race. Even my tow rig is a Lightning...too portly to be a real performer but I don't mind hearing the supercharger screaming at full throttle. I would buy something that was not rear wheel drive, but only if it was a solid performer. I can't imagine owning a Ford Taurus or a Honda Civic, not even with high gas prices.

My next purchase just might be a black GTO that has been sitting at the Chevrolet dealership near us for a while (she was driven by the dealer's wife, and is still a very low mileage beauty, at a much better price than sticker was). For those considering buying a new or used car, what is on your list?

[Poonman]

My next purchase just might be a black GTO that has been sitting at the Chevrolet dealership near us for a while (she was driven by the dealer's wife, and is still a very low mileage beauty, at a much better price than sticker was).  For those considering buying a new or used car, what is on your list?

everytime I see a GTO for a few seconds I think I'm looking at a bloated Cavalier.. and I'd wait for Pontiac to release the next gen on those cuz that car is actually 6-7 years old.

but to answer you question theres so many used cars on my list I don't even know where to start. I only have about $25k so that means theres nothing I could buy brand new that would really be worth a crap.

used on the other hand.. I can afford an '01 Audi S4 or if I save a few more grand I can buy an '01 M3.

I also really like the G35 coupe although they are a little too common for me. the Sti and Evo are both fast as hell and also sell used for around $30k but I hate how those looks and I hate japanese interiors.

or I might just get a pick up and forget trying to keep with the fast cars. I surf a lot and ladies love 'em so I might just give up the race and go w/ an '05 F-150 just because it would be practical. however, gas prices are terrible in socal so.. i don't know what the heck to do.

[Stamen0083]

America:  Which RWD V8 Japanese muscle car would you like to compare to the Corvette, Viper, GTO, or Mustang? As far as just about everything else on the market though, sadly you are right. 

There are no V-8 Japanese car that I'm aware of. Nothing popular or famous enough for me to know of anyway, but the Honda NSX, the Nissan Skyline R34, and possibly the Mazda RX-7 and Toyota Supra are big contenders. The NSX is at least priced comparatively to Porsches.

Britain:  Like it or not, the aforementioned Elise wins this category with no competition from the Japanese market.  (I don't know how heavy the Integra is, but it certainly doesn't have anything to compare to the Elise's powerplant)

My Integra sedan weighs 2600 pounds and has a 140HP powerplant. The Type R has 197HP and also weighs 2600 pounds (why the hell does a sports coupe weigh the same as a four-door sedan??). It's almost comparable. 2002 Civic Type R has 200HP, weighs almost 2700 pounds.

Italy:  Ferrari, Lamborghini, Maserati, Alfa Romeo, Bizzarini, Iso, Italdesign, Pagani Fiat.  The (very overrated) Skyline may be nice, but its no Italian Stallion.

Indeed. But which Japanese car costs six figures?

Personally, I drive for fun, so naturally I like a car that is fun to drive. For me, that means something maneuverable. I favor small, light cars that are nimble, and so Honda cars are just great for me. As impressive as American cars are, something about them just seem crude, almost... unrefined to me. No offense meant, of course. German cars are just a touch too expensive for me at the moment, but I can see myself driving a BMW of some sort when I graduate and have a stable job.

But my car is important to me. It's an extension of myself, so to speak, and since for the first time I'm actually driving a car I really love, the drive is just that much more fun.

Poonman: Know if that is the official GT-R replacement? They were running a GT-R replacement test mule at Nurburgring (?) wearing a Skyline 350GT (Infinity G35) skin. Says the suspension was being tested by Lotus.

Edited October 19, 2005 by Stamen0083

[trueblueeyes]

everytime I see a GTO for a few seconds I think I'm looking at a bloated Cavalier.. and I'd wait for Pontiac to release the next gen on those cuz that car is actually 6-7 years old.

At first, I really didn't like the GTO. My main complaint was a perceived blandness. But there is actually something about seeing that car in person (especially in black) that made me fall in love with it. And yes, it is a few years old, but it has very low mileage and is super clean. And I really love the interior in those cars. I probably won't get it though. I would imagine the next car in the garage will be the Shelby Cobra. Might as well add a fourth SVT to the collection.

As impressive as American cars are, something about them just seem crude, almost... unrefined to me. No offense meant, of course.

How dare you? My 1997 Cobra is perfect...except for the excessive squeaks and rattles in the interior, the whining tensioner pulley that Ford wouldn't fix even though it recommends a '99 up Cobra tensioner pulley swap to fix it. Or we could talk about the recall that I *just* got on my '95 Lightning to fix a problem that has burned hundreds of Ford trucks and SUVs over the years. You'll get no argument from me there. What can I say though? I love my big V8's. And despite the problems, I love my Mustangs and Lightnings. Lots of *oomph* for not a lot of cash.

[yellowlightman]

HAHAHAHA!  You are kidding right?  I'll give you cheaper, but better?  Japanese car makers have earned their due but the majority of their vehicles are still econo boxes.  Econo boxes that far outperform their American counterparts, but Econo boxes still.  Let's take this one at a time.

America:  Which RWD V8 Japanese muscle car would you like to compare to the Corvette, Viper, GTO, or Mustang? As far as just about everything else on the market though, sadly you are right.

Leaving the Z06 Corvette out of it (which is the one redeeming performance car the American's have made in the last 30 years) and the GTO which is AUSTRAILIAN not American, I have an easy answer for you: Used twin-turbo Supra. Performance wise a 10-yar old Supra will destroy a Mustang (Supra's can actually turn). The shoddy build quality of American cars doesn't need to be discussed, and the reliability of the 10 year old Supra still eclipses previous generation Mustangs. Who knows how the '05 Mustangs will fair, but it is still a Ford...

Viper's are really stupid. They're for dumb people with too much money that want to show off and don't have the sense to pick up a better performing and cheaper Corvette.

Britain:  Like it or not, the aforementioned Elise wins this category with no competition from the Japanese market.  (I don't know how heavy the Integra is, but it certainly doesn't have anything to compare to the Elise's powerplant)

Funny thing about British cars... They're all owned by American companies. Land Rover, Aston Martin, Jaguar... all American owned nowadays. And comparing ANY car to the Elise is unfair because it's unlike any other street-legal car in the U.S. It is a track car designed to also be driven on the road, not a road car. Also, the engine is Japanese.

Germany:  McLaren SLR, Porsche,  Maybach, Audi, BMW.  Those names alone will draw respect from a crowd.  Try doing that with Honda, Toyota, or Mitsubishi.

Lexus gets better reliability and customer satisfaction than any European luxury cars. Not to mention you realize the SLR and Maybach are so ridiculously different from regular cars they have no reason being in this comparison, right?

Italy:  Ferrari, Lamborghini, Maserati, Alfa Romeo, Bizzarini, Iso, Italdesign, Pagani Fiat.  The (very overrated) Skyline may be nice, but its no Italian Stallion.

There's a big difference between an "exotic" car manufacturer like Ferrari or Maserati and companies liek Toyota and Honda. Good job missing the point though. Tell you what though, the Mistubishi Lancer Evolution MR released in Europe is just as fast around a track as a Murcielago. You might call the Lancer an econo box, but it's still an econo box that will poo over cars that cost many times what it does and carry four adults comfortably...

I'm not sure what the point of your post is. You're comparing cars that are designed for specifically different purposes. There's no way Toyota will compare with a Ferrari (well, at least until the new Lexus supercar comes out). The truth is, the Japanese have superior engineering, reliability and build quality than other other nation's car manufacturers. Will a Maybach have a better interior than a Lexus? Hell yes, but a Lexus will cost a fraction of the cost.

Edited October 19, 2005 by yellowlightman

[Poonman]

everytime I see a GTO for a few seconds I think I'm looking at a bloated Cavalier.. and I'd wait for Pontiac to release the next gen on those cuz that car is actually 6-7 years old.

At first, I really didn't like the GTO. My main complaint was a perceived blandness. But there is actually something about seeing that car in person (especially in black) that made me fall in love with it. And yes, it is a few years old, but it has very low mileage and is super clean. And I really love the interior in those cars. I probably won't get it though. I would imagine the next car in the garage will be the Shelby Cobra. Might as well add a fourth SVT to the collection.

337832[/snapback]

actually what I meant was the cars been out in Austrailia for many years now under the Holden brand (as you probably already know) so to ME it doesn't scream "new car". even though its new to our US market it doesn't look "new" to me because, well, it isn't. just my 2 cents.

i heard they are fast as hell tho.

[Stamen0083]

Will a Maybach have a better interior than a Lexus? Hell yes, but a Lexus will cost a fraction of the cost.

337840[/snapback]

Maybachs are specifically geared towards those with way too much money anyway, and thus the price was made to match that. Honestly, there's no reason Toyota or anyone else can't make the same interior and sell it for much less. Maybachs are expensive simply because the price buys the brand, not the product.

[Poonman]

HAHAHAHA!  You are kidding right?  I'll give you cheaper, but better?  Japanese car makers have earned their due but the majority of their vehicles are still econo boxes.  Econo boxes that far outperform their American counterparts, but Econo boxes still.  Let's take this one at a time.

America:  Which RWD V8 Japanese muscle car would you like to compare to the Corvette, Viper, GTO, or Mustang? As far as just about everything else on the market though, sadly you are right.

Leaving the Z06 Corvette out of it (which is the one redeeming performance car the American's have made in the last 30 years) and the GTO which is AUSTRAILIAN not American, I have an easy answer for you: Used twin-turbo Supra. Performance wise a 10-yar old Supra will destroy a Mustang (Supra's can actually turn). The shoddy build quality of American cars doesn't need to be discussed, and the reliability of the 10 year old Supra still eclipses previous generation Mustangs. Who knows how the '05 Mustangs will fair, but it is still a Ford...

the thing w/ the Supra tho is that the ricers have really messed w/ the used retail value of them. a '96 six-speed twin turbo is still worth $20k or more if its a rare color. I was looking to buy one about 5 years ago and the prices haven't changed. thats just crazy.

[myk]

Here are a few questions for everybody;  How important is your car to you?  It it an extension of you, a status symbol, your own amusement ride, or just a way from Point A to Point B?  Why do you choose the cars you buy?

337800[/snapback]

1. My cars are VERY important to me. So important that my toy collecting has suffered immensely; I still don't even have the VB-6! I haven't bought a new pair of shoes since 2001...

2. My cars, a '69 Charger, '97 Z28 'Vert and '98 Mustang GT are hardly status symbols-in 'So-Cal they're seen as outdated, out of touch and hogging the roads. Personally, they are my only means of true enjoyment, and they make going from point A to point B something I can definitely, truly smile about.

3. Like anything else I buy or become involved in, I couldn't care less about what other people thought about my machines. 13 years ago, when I had to make the decision about what my first car would be, I decided that it had to be one of my own personal "dream cars," the Dodge Charger (2nd gen only!), Ford Mustang or Chevrolet Camaro. Well, I never was able to pick just one, so I bought all of them. I love the way they look, ride, smell, taste, etc, etc, etc; I love them and there isn't a thing about them I would change, except for more power and refinement, obviously.

-I just wish that I could have one damn week where one of them wasn't broken...LOL

[VF-17]

You want fast and not rediculously expensive?

Atom

It's a deathtrap on four wheels, but with a theoretical 0-60 in 2 sec. and 0-100-0 in 10.88 seconds? At least you're dying with a smile on your face.

[Poonman]

Will a Maybach have a better interior than a Lexus? Hell yes, but a Lexus will cost a fraction of the cost.

337840[/snapback]

Maybachs are specifically geared towards those with way too much money anyway, and thus the price was made to match that. Honestly, there's no reason Toyota or anyone else can't make the same interior and sell it for much less. Maybachs are expensive simply because the price buys the brand, not the product.

337844[/snapback]

but don't forget although you pay extra for a german car you also get soul.

I've never owned a japanese car that came w/ all the stuff they packed into my A4 like road hazard thingys in the trunk, first-aid kit in the back seat, Audi Sport three point steering wheel that could spank a Momo, full size spare, actually usefull tool kit and thats jsut the stock stuff. my sport package came stock w/ Koni shocks, 17" Audi Sport alloys and exhaust and the list goes on and on..

Edited October 19, 2005 by Poonman

[Stamen0083]

Oh yeah, and how much did all that stuff cost you?

The Acura RSX Type S has an A-spec sports package, and it comes with sports spring and agressive suspension setup or whatever you want to call it, and it costs an additional $3400.

In anycase, a lot of good all that junk is going to be for the average rap star, wouldn't you say?

EDIT: Holy crap, the Atom weighs barely a thousand pounds and it's propelled by a 220HP powerplant??

Edited October 19, 2005 by Stamen0083

[myk]

Soul is something that a human being ascribes and projects onto an inanimate object. Inanimate objects don't have soul unless they're Evangelions........or '69 Dodge Chargers...

[trueblueeyes]

Yellowlightman:

I'm not sure what the point of your post is. You're comparing cars that are designed for specifically different purposes.

Psst! Hey genius, here is a clue: I'm not the one who originally made the comparison. You actually helped proved my point. And you are right of course. The 5.7 litre V8 hasn't been used in the U.S. at all. It is a pity they never used that engine in the Corvette.

And while the TT Supra may be a great performing car, I find it extraordinarily ugly with all those lights on the front. And will it destroy a stock Mustang? Yes. But with the money one costs, you could easily buy a Mustang of the same year and enough mods to leave the Supra in the dust. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. I just don't understand why you have to be such an asshat and constantly blast the cars that many of us like. I don't know if it is envy or stupidity, but I am done with you.

_______

Stamen: You mentioned the NSX earlier. That is one Honda I'd love to own! What is currently in your garage? (I'm going to be jealous if it is the NSX... )

Edited October 19, 2005 by trueblueeyes

[Stamen0083]

Stamen:  You mentioned the NSX earlier.  That is one Honda I'd love to own!  What is currently in your garage?  (I'm going to be jealous if it is the NSX...  )

337856[/snapback]

Good lord. If I owned the NSX, I would never leave the garage. I'd always be hugging it.

No, I own a 1996 Acura Integra sedan. It's nothing close to an NSX (hell, it's nothing close to the Type R Integra), but I still love it to death. My dream car is the NSX, naturally, and I will own one someday. :-)

EDIT: I think Peter on here owns an NSX. I'm very jealous of him.

Edited October 19, 2005 by Stamen0083

[Poonman]

Oh yeah, and how much did all that stuff cost you?

The Acura RSX Type S has an A-spec sports package, and it comes with sports spring and agressive suspension setup or whatever you want to call it, and it costs an additional $3400.

337854[/snapback]

AWD quattro turbo charged A4 >> FWD Honda

and the sports package costs about the same as the Acura's. but the sticker price for the car is obviously a lot more.

Edited October 19, 2005 by Poonman

[trueblueeyes]

Stamen:  You mentioned the NSX earlier.  That is one Honda I'd love to own!  What is currently in your garage?  (I'm going to be jealous if it is the NSX...  )

337856[/snapback]

Good lord. If I owned the NSX, I would never leave the garage. I'd always be hugging it.

No, I own a 1996 Acura Integra sedan. It's nothing close to an NSX (hell, it's nothing close to the Type R Integra), but I still love it to death. My dream car is the NSX, naturally, and I will own one someday. :-)

EDIT: I think Peter on here owns an NSX. I'm very jealous of him.

337857[/snapback]

That's right! He posted pictures of it and an older Honda he had worked on. Beautiful cars, both of them.

There is a silver NSX going up for auction at a lot here with flood damage from Katrina. Should go relatively cheap, but I'd be afraid of electrical problems. Still would be a nice deal for someone who had the time and knowledge to repair it.

And as for your ride, a '96 Integra is a nice car as well. Stock? We always need good pictures on this thread!

[trueblueeyes]

Oh yeah, and how much did all that stuff cost you?

The Acura RSX Type S has an A-spec sports package, and it comes with sports spring and agressive suspension setup or whatever you want to call it, and it costs an additional $3400.

337854[/snapback]

AWD quattro turbo charged A4 >> FWD Honda

and the sports package costs about the same as the Acura's. but the sticker price for the car is obviously a lot more.

337858[/snapback]

Come on. They are both nice cars. We all have in common that we love vehicles. We don't need another "Mines bigger than yours is!" type argument.

[trueblueeyes]

Last post tonight, I promise. Any other car modeler's here at MW? I'd love to see pics. I'm tempted to pick up a can of spray paint from Paintscratch.com to paint a model the exact color of my car. Never painted with anything but an airbrush though, so I am not sure. Any recommendations?

[peter]

Hey boys and girls, long time no see. Seems like it's been forever since I was here. As for the NSX, it's not for sale....not bored of it yet, even though it's killing me financially to keep it. If you're like me and don't make much money, you can still get an NSX.....just be willing to throw away your future and any hope of getting out of debt. On a lighter note, I just got a brand-new set of Advan A032Rs for it....lovely tire....so sticky.

My first gen Civic is what I drive everyday now. Gas prices are a nightmare but my Civic happily does not guzzle as much gas as the NSX.

I have to admit, I have a sick addiction to cars. The other day, I was at this new shop that started importing R32 Skylines into Canada and I must say, I was tempted to buy a third car (with what money, I have no idea). They go for about $10,000 - 25,000 CAD, depending on condition. Yeah, I need another car like hole in the head....but not overly expensive.

Model cars? Yeah, I build some. I posted this picture about a million times...I think most people here probably get sick of seeing it, but here's one of them:

[yellowlightman]

the thing w/ the Supra tho is that the ricers have really messed w/ the used retail value of them. a '96 six-speed twin turbo is still worth $20k or more if its a rare color. I was looking to buy one about 5 years ago and the prices haven't changed. thats just crazy.

337845[/snapback]

The retail is still extraordinarily high, but in all honesty... they're worth it. The performance combined with Toyota reliability and build quality? The 2JZGTE motors are bullet proof and the rest of the car is just overbuilt. Would I buy one? Doubtful, but all things considered it's probably one of the greatest performance cars of all time... if not the greatest.

And while the TT Supra may be a great performing car, I find it extraordinarily ugly with all those lights on the front. And will it destroy a stock Mustang? Yes. But with the money one costs, you could easily buy a Mustang of the same year and enough mods to leave the Supra in the dust. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. I just don't understand why you have to be such an asshat and constantly blast the cars that many of us like. I don't know if it is envy or stupidity, but I am done with you.

No matter how much money you pump into a Mustang it's still going to handle like garbage, and have the grotesque Ford design, build quality and reliability. The Supra is a superior car made to a higher standard than the Mustang and that's not something you can fix by just putting "mod" money into it.

I don't have a problem with people liking different cars but some cars are superior; that's a fact. The Japanese make better cars and their superiors; that is a fact. As as much as you might accuse me of sounding like the import loving 'Merican-hater stereotype, you sound just as much like a V8-loving, technology-hating redneck 'Merican car enthusiast.

If anything, I'm probably one of the most open-minded car enthusiasts you'll meet... I just don't like crap and I voice that. A few months ago I was drooling over of the new Z06, so my tastes have nothing to do with one country being better than the other.

And the only cars I envy are Alfa's, so don't flatter yourself.

[Splash]

In fact, there's a good deal of modern styling that I don't like. What's with the thick doors, for example? Used to be that windows were big enough for me to see through, and I rather liked my seat near the floor, and I liked my cars small.

Is that weird?

337511[/snapback]

Again, it's psychology being used against the unenlightened buyer. Thick doors, short windows, tall profiles all give the illusion of strength and security, as if your vehicle is the equivalent of the alpha fe/male in the pack.

My wife says she doesn't like the looks of the new Saturn Vue, she prefers her old one but I know why they redesigned it; blind spots 4-5 and 7-8 o'clock and everything lower than 40" between 4-8. I always felt anxious driving the Vue with those blind spots, this from a guy who drives commercial trucks for a living!

Visibility from SUV's suck. Like a fighter pilot I need to see as much as possible, to control the space around me I have to know what's going on, who's moving where, spot the idiots before they get close, etc...

[reddsun1]

Yellowlightman:

I'm not sure what the point of your post is. You're comparing cars that are designed for specifically different purposes.

Psst! Hey genius, here is a clue: I'm not the one who originally made the comparison. You actually helped proved my point. And you are right of course. The 5.7 litre V8 hasn't been used in the U.S. at all. It is a pity they never used that engine in the Corvette.

Didn't use the 5.7 litre V8? Do you mean a specific model/type of that motor? That's just the 350c.i. small block. My raggedy ol' Ford has a 351C, and they called that a "5.8L V8". Only a difference of 1 cubic inch displacement, but they decided to round up with their figure, while Chevy on the other hand, rounded down. They've always been kinda skewed with their conversion figures.

In regards to German cars: if the magazine pundits are to be believed, a general summary of the quality of German autos could be "keep this past the warranty period, if you dare." Of course, we know that's not always the case; Porsche after all built their reputation on the dead-bolts reliability of thier sports cars. It's largely why so much of production-based sports car racing [at least in the US] usually turns out to be a Porsche parade, with only a smattering of other makes here and there.

[trueblueeyes]

Yellowlightman:

I'm not sure what the point of your post is. You're comparing cars that are designed for specifically different purposes.

Psst! Hey genius, here is a clue: I'm not the one who originally made the comparison. You actually helped proved my point. And you are right of course. The 5.7 litre V8 hasn't been used in the U.S. at all. It is a pity they never used that engine in the Corvette.

Didn't use the 5.7 litre V8? Do you mean a specific model/type of that motor? That's just the 350c.i. small block. My raggedy ol' Ford has a 351C, and they called that a "5.8L V8". Only a difference of 1 cubic inch displacement, but they decided to round up with their figure, while Chevy on the other hand, rounded down. They've always been kinda skewed with their conversion figures.

In regards to German cars: if the magazine pundits are to be believed, a general summary of the quality of German autos could be "keep this past the warranty period, if you dare." Of course, we know that's not always the case; Porsche after all built their reputation on the dead-bolts reliability of thier sports cars. It's largely why so much of production-based sports car racing [at least in the US] usually turns out to be a Porsche parade, with only a smattering of other makes here and there.

337906[/snapback]

D'oh...sorry! I was referring to the LS1 that the Monaro shares with the Corvette (one it shared before the Monaro was brought over as the GTO). There are some minor differences, including camshaft but for all intents and purposes the GTO's powerplant is all American, not an Australian design.

A question: Why have RWD V8 cars remained so popular in Australia for so long?

[pfunk]

Yellowlightman:

I'm not sure what the point of your post is. You're comparing cars that are designed for specifically different purposes.

Psst! Hey genius, here is a clue: I'm not the one who originally made the comparison. You actually helped proved my point. And you are right of course. The 5.7 litre V8 hasn't been used in the U.S. at all. It is a pity they never used that engine in the Corvette.

Didn't use the 5.7 litre V8? Do you mean a specific model/type of that motor? That's just the 350c.i. small block. My raggedy ol' Ford has a 351C, and they called that a "5.8L V8". Only a difference of 1 cubic inch displacement, but they decided to round up with their figure, while Chevy on the other hand, rounded down. They've always been kinda skewed with their conversion figures.

In regards to German cars: if the magazine pundits are to be believed, a general summary of the quality of German autos could be "keep this past the warranty period, if you dare." Of course, we know that's not always the case; Porsche after all built their reputation on the dead-bolts reliability of thier sports cars. It's largely why so much of production-based sports car racing [at least in the US] usually turns out to be a Porsche parade, with only a smattering of other makes here and there.

337906[/snapback]

D'oh...sorry! I was referring to the LS1 that the Monaro shares with the Corvette (one it shared before the Monaro was brought over as the GTO). There are some minor differences, including camshaft but for all intents and purposes the GTO's powerplant is all American, not an Australian design.

A question: Why have RWD V8 cars remained so popular in Australia for so long?

337929[/snapback]

the big GM has been building the same engine since 55, just different bore, stroke, head design (reason for dif intakes and exhausts),,,,you can put a LS/LT/2nd Gen in any car from 1955-2007, the bolt pattern for the motor mounts and the transmission bellhousing patern is the same,,, you may need to use an 15MM socket instead of a 9/16ths though, oh, and GM powertrain has ALLWAYS benn developed here in Detroit Michigan) FYI 5.7 in the LS1 is actually a 348cu inch, the lt/2nd gen versions are 350cubes,,,8.1 is a 502, 7.4 is the 454,ect

[Stamen0083]

Hey boys and girls, long time no see.  Seems like it's been forever since I was here.  As for the NSX, it's not for sale....not bored of it yet, even though it's killing me financially to keep it.  If you're like me and don't make much money, you can still get an NSX.....just be willing to throw away your future and any hope of getting out of debt.

337883[/snapback]

I'm already prepared to discard my future for a nice car. What year is your NSX? I want to eventually own the newest NSX that still has the pop-up headlights and comes with hard top, which is... what? 2001?

Trueblueeyes: My Integra is mostly stock, yes. It's lowered by the previous owner and he also got a muffler with a slightly bigger tip. I think it looks stunning. Just got some clear corners for it the other day from eBay for cheap, waiting for it to arrive. It used to have clear corners until someone tried to steal them. He got one of them off but couldn't get at the other one or something... I would love to do some basic mods to it, like headers, intake, etc... but being a poor college student means I'm stuck with stock for a little while at least, until I get my NSX. :-D

And I build car models. Here are some shots for you to peruse, if you so wish:

http://www.uweb.ucsb.edu/~stamen0083/progs/050727/

http://www.uweb.ucsb.edu/~stamen0083/progs/050812/

http://www.uweb.ucsb.edu/~stamen0083/progs/050917/