The MW Automotive Thread

[emajnthis]

BTW, A1's M3 should have somthing like 240hp and a little less torque, but it depends what year it is because the E36 went from a 3.0 liter with two stage valve timing to the 3.2 liter with continuous VVT (VANOS) with better performance (though HP stayed the same). The European versions that were actually released in 92 to replace the E90's had 286hp (with continuous VVT, not that two stage crap we got) and by 94 when America was just getting the better 3.0liter S50 motor (without continous VVT) they were already getting a 321hp S52 motor linked to a six speed. America really gets jewed on a lot of our Japanese/European car releases.

Edited February 15, 2006 by emajnthis

[pfunk]

nice ride A1, i allways thought you had the newer body, I like the older versions, they say BMW more then the new, The new ones are fast though, raced a guy 4 times in a row and it was the only car I raced (becides viper GTSr that killed me) that even kept up to the GS the only thing I noticed was he was short shifting or so it seemed (i dont know the redline of that motor is nor the final drive ratio) but he was shifing 1.5 : 1 with me running a zf 6speed and 355 gears and a 6400 redline. I was told his wqas a heavier car then mine too.

Emaj, I do like the caddy motors too, when I worked in flint, they were turbo'ing and supercharging the crap out of them and getting really amazing results, the only motor design I didnt care for was the HUGE timing chain run by plastic guides, but it did hold up in lemans (basically stock motor)

[Agent ONE]

BTW, A1's M3 should have somthing like 240hp and a little less torque, but it depends what year it is because the E36 went from a 3.0 liter with two stage valve timing to the 3.2 liter with continuous VVT (VANOS) with better performance (though HP stayed the same).  The European versions that were actually released in 92 to replace the E90's had 286hp (with continuous VVT, not that two stage crap we got) and by 94 when America was just getting the better 3.0liter S50 motor (without continous VVT) they were already getting a 321hp S52 motor linked to a six speed.  America really gets jewed on a lot of our Japanese/European car releases.

370478[/snapback]

Yep, but BMW has taken an "American" approach to performance. Mine is 240hp but weighs a little over 3k, the new one which is 321hp weighs 400lbs more than that. So yes more HP but the car is kind of a pig. I think BMW realizes that for most casual drivers who just like to brag about HP numbers but don't really know anything about cars. So in other words, HP numbers sell cars, but it doesn't mean its a better car.

That being said however the new M3 (and 2006 M5 which I actually drove yesterday) are awesome cars and both DO outperform mine (not by that much though), but they are just porky feeling and I don't want one anymore. I WAS planning on trading my M in for the new one, but I just don't like the direction the company is going.

When some tard comes up to me and tries to tell me that my weak ass 240hp car isn't nearly as awesome as his IROC I tell him he should get a semi... They have 1000hp.

[Phyrox]

When some tard comes up to me and tries to tell me that my weak ass 240hp car isn't nearly as awesome as his IROC I tell him he should get a semi... They have 1000hp.

While you are right, there are just as many people who think just because they have a car from europe with a flashy image they are kings of performance.

I used to eat those guys for lunch myself. My old beast wouldn't beat them around nurmburgring, but I could embarrass them on any road in our neighborhood. Sometimes, just sometimes, gobs of torque and horses really do matter.

oh yeah, and emajn:

America really gets jewed on a lot of our Japanese/European car releases.

this is a sorta racist comment. I don't think you were using it that way, but "jewed" is considered by most people to be a slur, particularly when used in this context. I myself didn't realize this until a few years ago when a friend pointed it out. You hear it so often you don't think about it. I mean, no one has a right not to be offended...but, well, I think we all know what I'm saying here.

Edited February 15, 2006 by Phyrox

[Agent ONE]

When some tard comes up to me and tries to tell me that my weak ass 240hp car isn't nearly as awesome as his IROC I tell him he should get a semi... They have 1000hp.

While you are right, there are just as many people who think just because they have a car from europe with a flashy image they are kings of performance...

370591[/snapback]

Boxster owners. There is a myth going around that for some reason that car is fast... Its a lie.

[Phyrox]

When some tard comes up to me and tries to tell me that my weak ass 240hp car isn't nearly as awesome as his IROC I tell him he should get a semi... They have 1000hp.

While you are right, there are just as many people who think just because they have a car from europe with a flashy image they are kings of performance...

370591[/snapback]

Boxster owners. There is a myth going around that for some reason that car is fast... Its a lie.

370614[/snapback]

hahaha. yeah. they are the prime culprits. and the low end bimmers and benzes.

[Agent ONE]

When some tard comes up to me and tries to tell me that my weak ass 240hp car isn't nearly as awesome as his IROC I tell him he should get a semi... They have 1000hp.

While you are right, there are just as many people who think just because they have a car from europe with a flashy image they are kings of performance...

370591[/snapback]

Boxster owners. There is a myth going around that for some reason that car is fast... Its a lie.

370614[/snapback]

hahaha. yeah. they are the prime culprits. and the low end bimmers and benzes.

370620[/snapback]

Never come accross a benz guy that was a wanker, but plenty of BMW 3XX owners who think their car is just faster than anything.

[emajnthis]

yeh maybe you're right, i was using "jewed" in the context of them being very frugle and thus is how the european and japanese auto industry is with releasing models in America (and if not models, then the proper motors).

There are so many cars (mostly Japanese) and motors (mostly European) that America was skipped out on, but it looks like the auto industry is finally starting to level everything out.

[Agent ONE]

yeh maybe you're right, i was using "jewed" in the context of them being very frugle and thus is how the european and japanese auto industry is with releasing models in America (and if not models, then the proper motors).

There are so many cars (mostly Japanese) and motors (mostly European) that America was skipped out on, but it looks like the auto industry is finally starting to level everything out.

370641[/snapback]

I am in favor of offending people, so "jewed" is fine with me, but I would prefer it with other racial slurs... Example: "I got jewed by those wetbacks in that crack deal, next time I will just buy some opium from a Chinamen."

[Lightning]

When some tard comes up to me and tries to tell me that my weak ass 240hp car isn't nearly as awesome as his IROC I tell him he should get a semi... They have 1000hp.

While you are right, there are just as many people who think just because they have a car from europe with a flashy image they are kings of performance...

370591[/snapback]

Boxster owners. There is a myth going around that for some reason that car is fast... Its a lie.

370614[/snapback]

hahaha. yeah. they are the prime culprits. and the low end bimmers and benzes.

370620[/snapback]

Never come accross a benz guy that was a wanker, but plenty of BMW 3XX owners who think their car is just faster than anything.

370625[/snapback]

that's all the Civic owners around here are that way too, it's sad that I beat them easily in my tired 120hp '77 Chrysler!

[myk]

I'm certain that the car I went up against was either an '04 or '05 M3, as those years appear to be identical.

-Nice car, and he would've won if he hadn't gotten cold feet in the big curve and backed off...

[emajnthis]

That's typical of most drivers, they feel confident in a straight line but not in the corners... wussy.

[Agent ONE]

That's typical of most drivers, they feel confident in a straight line but not in the corners... wussy.

370829[/snapback]

Well, most cars can't turn... Handling is really where I feel the value of the car shows through. I drove the new Mustang for example, now the style of it makes up for this (as it does look awesome), but the thing turns like my old radio flyer.

[Axelay]

Huh. I feel like my new Mustang GT handles much better in the turns than any of my previous ones ever did. I tend to be extremely agressive in corners (to the dismay of my tires), and I feel like it really doesn't lean as much as many other cars I've driven. It also has a significantly tighter turn radius than any of the other Mustangs I've had. It is very heavy, though! Bar none the heaviest "feeling" of all of them.

[emajnthis]

you're not kidding, that car got REALLY FAT, the convertible GT500 weighs in at close to 4000lbs (the hard top weighs a LOT less, but still), and the GT weighs in at 3400lbs. As awesome as the car looks and even performs, it's a porker.

[Dangard Ace]

Watch the racial slurs.

anything else like

BMW drivers are a-holes

or

Boxster drivers are wannabes

are fine.

[pfunk]

any sports car that weighs in over 3,200 lbs curb is a porker, along with my old 3,300 lb vette

[myk]

Talk about lightweight cars makes me think about my dream car, the '65 Shelby Cobra-427. How much does that thing weight? I was sure it was around 3200 lbs...

[yellowlightman]

Talk about lightweight cars makes me think about my dream car, the '65 Shelby Cobra-427.  How much does that thing weight?  I was sure it was around 3200 lbs...

370893[/snapback]

Pretty sure they're closer to around 2200lbs, which is why they're so notoriously hard to drive.

[Agent ONE]

Watch the racial slurs. 

anything else like

BMW drivers are a-holes

or

Boxster drivers are wannabes

are fine.

370866[/snapback]

Mods are a-holes

mini-mods are wannabes

[pfunk]

Talk about lightweight cars makes me think about my dream car, the '65 Shelby Cobra-427.  How much does that thing weight?  I was sure it was around 3200 lbs...

370893[/snapback]

Pretty sure they're closer to around 2200lbs, which is why they're so notoriously hard to drive.

370899[/snapback]

yup, they were sub 2200lb cars, as for the hard to drive part, it was a mix between gearing for the day (4speed 1:1 final) and a rear gear of 3.73:1 so when you let off the throttle at 6,500 RPM's the torque from the engine would break the rear tires loose in a corner so you would allways have to have part throttle in the corner to avoid the backlash

[areaseven]

Before I got my Mustang, I was used to 4-cylinder FWD imports. Now, I will admit that I'm driving a car that's heavier and consumes more gas than my old Honda Civic HX Coupe, but I will say that it's much more fun to drive than any car I've owned.

And sure, the Mustang GT is heavy, but it's no heavier than the BMW M3 or the average Ferrari in the market. As a matter of fact, most Volkswagen GTi's weigh more, even at nearly half the size.

[pfunk]

a lot of weight has to do with content (sound deadning, power everything), but with german cars, its the way thier built in layers (the main reason they are so solid)

[Lightning]

well, I could always talk about the day when I "Decided" to find out which was more solid, a '77 Chrysler or a '98 Cadilliac....

[myk]

yup, they were sub 2200lb cars, as for the hard to drive part, it was a mix between gearing for the day (4speed 1:1 final) and a rear gear of 3.73:1 so when you let off the throttle at 6,500 RPM's the torque from the engine would break the rear tires loose in a corner so you would allways have to have part throttle in the corner to avoid the backlash

I'm speechless, as that is so fraking awesome and it boggles my mind to have a car so wrecklessly powerful. I want a replica now more than ever...

[yellowlightman]

yup, they were sub 2200lb cars, as for the hard to drive part, it was a mix between gearing for the day (4speed 1:1 final) and a rear gear of 3.73:1 so when you let off the throttle at 6,500 RPM's the torque from the engine would break the rear tires loose in a corner so you would allways have to have part throttle in the corner to avoid the backlash

I'm speechless, as that is so fraking awesome and it boggles my mind to have a car so wrecklessly powerful. I want a replica now more than ever...

371115[/snapback]

For the same dangerous thrills, try getting a first gen MR2. Those are pretty sketchy in corners.

[reddsun1]

yup, they were sub 2200lb cars, as for the hard to drive part, it was a mix between gearing for the day (4speed 1:1 final) and a rear gear of 3.73:1 so when you let off the throttle at 6,500 RPM's the torque from the engine would break the rear tires loose in a corner so you would allways have to have part throttle in the corner to avoid the backlash

That characteristic sounds reasonably easy to counter, at least in theory. One of the things I was taught was that when you're gettin' in it, [on the track, anyway] you ought to be either on the gas, or on the brake--but you never ought to be just be coasting.

The real challenge, and the fun I suppose, would be learning to master modulating the throttle on a lightwieght car with such high power like a Cobra. They're considered "throttle-steering" cars anyway, aren't they? When I asked my former boss about his technique for wringing the most out of his McLaren, he said you basically have to "pretend you've got an egg between your foot and the gas pedal."

Edited February 17, 2006 by reddsun1

[emajnthis]

yup, they were sub 2200lb cars, as for the hard to drive part, it was a mix between gearing for the day (4speed 1:1 final) and a rear gear of 3.73:1 so when you let off the throttle at 6,500 RPM's the torque from the engine would break the rear tires loose in a corner so you would allways have to have part throttle in the corner to avoid the backlash

I'm speechless, as that is so fraking awesome and it boggles my mind to have a car so wrecklessly powerful. I want a replica now more than ever...

371115[/snapback]

For the same dangerous thrills, try getting a first gen MR2. Those are pretty sketchy in corners.

371124[/snapback]

My hardtop turbo gen 2 was the opposite. It would break loose in a straight line, but would completely plant a corner. I could take a curve with more confidence than i could a straight shot, but that was kinda what i liked about it.

I know a lot of cars of the 60's were so incredibly light, i understand emissions and safety, but you figure with the heavy uses of exotic materials like carbon fiber, aluminum, and magnesium, our modern sports cars would be much lighter than cars nearly a half century old. It seems like the only sports cars on the road that are under 3200lbs are either Inline 4 go karts, or all aluminum space framed exotics.

Edited February 17, 2006 by emajnthis

[pfunk]

the cobra was alunimum alloy,

The remakes are a lot better/safer to drive, a tremac 5 speed does wonders for the car along with better suspension and chassis. I drove one with a hopped up 5.0 5speed, independant rear and i would put it against any supercar made today,,,, the only thing I hated abou tthe car was he got it from an owner in canada and they required him to put a 3rd (chmsl) brake light,,,,looked rediculous,,, it didnt have any of the horrible oversteer a mustang has, but you could coaks it too I really like the datona coupe better, but I havent drove one yet,,,,,yet

[Agent ONE]

I have decided to clean up my M3 and keep it for another year.. It had 8 miles on it when I got it, now it has 160k. I apparently like driving it, so I guess it doesn't really matter as I am still excited about the thing. The thing is still in showroom condition.

I thought about the Lotus, and it would be awesome, but I think I would give up a LOT of comfort by getting that car. Going to try to save about 75k and get a 911 next year.

Smart move? What do you guys think.

[pfunk]

youll get a lot more comfortable miles ou tof a 911, just like yer 3. I ussed to know a guy who only drove a 911c4 traded them in for the exact same model every 3 years with over 100,000 miles on em. It was his primary car (and probably still is), you cant match the paint quality on those cars (ii think they still use enamal instead of base/clear) just a good rub out and like new. His 1st one was out right out at the factory when he worked for them (back in the 80's) just cause the massive discount. he was going to ship it to the us (US spec) and sell it, but he fell in love with the car

[emajnthis]

You haven't driven a daytona coupe, well you're in luck because there's a company out there that will make one for you for barely more than the cost of a Viper with about twice the performance of a Viper. In last months... i wanna say Motor Trend, there is a company that will build you a Daytona Coupe to the specs that it was suppose to be built to (they cut corners due to time and money) and also with a good amount of modern integration (better framework, lightened motor, tremec transmission, etc etc).

You have an option of three motors, I can't recall the cubic inches of the first two at the moment, i just know the best one is the Ford Windsor 7.0liter (427cu.in) OHV 2 valves per cylinder producing 500hp/torque and that without a motor shipped it's something like 70 or 80 grand. The motor and trans with installation run an extra like 20 or so. Bob Negstad (427 cobra chassis designer) and Peter Brock (daytona coupe designer) came together to recreate to their original specifications this brand new piece of art work.

In the one that motor trend tested, it ran a 0-60 in a little over 3 seconds and a quarter mile in the 11's, also pulling over 1.0g in the skidpad. It comes optional with or without a radio, talk about raw performance, not to mention the car only weighs a smudge over 2900lbs (i'm working from memory, i'll get the printed numbers later). The average driver will still be able to pull a 0-60 in 3.9 and a quarter of 11.9, a great driver much much better numbers.

Edited February 17, 2006 by emajnthis

[emajnthis]

911's a good car, but for a lot less you could just get the more stylish and practical Cayman.

[Agent ONE]

911's a good car, but for a lot less you could just get the more stylish and practical Cayman.

371199[/snapback]

The markup and options on that car bring it for the most part to 80k... Thats a 911.

[emajnthis]

i think you should just drive both, most people buy a 911 because of the name, just take each for a test drive and see which one you feel is the better performer in all aspects.