Welcome to the Jungle

[JsARCLIGHT]

I just got the email that my copy shipped tonight and should be in my grubby mitts tomorrow at work. Seeing as I'm a huge fan of this game series and I know others on the board are and are not I'd like to get some feedback from folks on this new chapter in the pimp shootin', pedestrian hittin', car jackin', uzi sprayin', punk cappin' opus of crime.

I myslef have heard so much rumor about the game from my employees and on the internet... the game seems to be almost double the scope and size of Vice City (if that is possible) and some people (to a degree myself included) think it may be a bit too overly ambitious.

What does everyone else have to say? What have you heard? Will it be true? Have you got yours yet? Are you going to get it? Do you think the people that claim the game inspires hate and crime are right and I'm going to go jack an old lady's crown vic tomorrow under the influence of this game?

Good? Bad? You're the criminal with the gun... or at least you will be after tomorrow.

... and while I thought the Vice City "I Ran" commercial spots had flair and style this new Guns and Roses spot for San Andreas just seems to capture the spirit of the game. Plus with the darn commercial running in super high rotation on local cable here I hear that darn song like every ten minutes now... must... kill... axl... rose...

[areaseven]

Yeah, I'll have a hell of a day tomorrow when 400+ people will pick up their copy of GTA:SA at GameStop. But then again, that'll be nothing compared to November 9th at midnight, when 1,200+ will get their hands on Halo 2.

[JsARCLIGHT]

Are retailers actually expecting a mob for this release? I myself do not expect GTA:SA to put up the numbers Halo 2 will... I mean, GTA has a pretty hard stigma riding on it whereas Halo 2 (while also sporting a M rating) seems to not be seen as the violent kill-fest GTA is. I know a lot of parents at my office who swore their children would never get their hands on any GTA games yet they would buy Halo 2 for their kids.

Another thing I just noticed (watching my little TV in my study here) there are two different edits of the TV spot... both are almost exactly alike except that one has a few cuts of more violent, gun brandishing action (that runs on the more adult channels) and the other has those clips replaced with less violent, more mundane clips (on the networks).

[Kin]

Arg... I can't wait so long for the pc version. Is it possible to run that PS2 CD with an emulator?

[JsARCLIGHT]

You got me... I'm an idiot when it comes to PC stuff.

I'd think that if there is such thing as a PS2 emulator for the PC that will read the discs then why not? It's the same kind of discs as all the other games.

[Phyrox]

If I wasn't so behind out here I would be picking it up tomorrow...but as it is I should, really should wait at least a week or so.

But I am really looking forward to GTA:SA. I don't think any other series I have ever played has as much replay value as the new GTAs. I just hope I like the "atmosphere."

It took awhile for the environs of Vice City to reach the level of Liberty City coolness...but I couldn't go back becaue VC was so much bigger and deeper. I hope I instantly prefer SA to either.

[bandit29]

Na I won't be picking this game up. I got bored in less than hour with GTA 3. Plus there are so many other games out right now its hard to keep up. Maybe I'll rent it down the road.

[areaseven]

Plus there are so many other games out right now its hard to keep up.

Yeah, like Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude and The Guy Game.

[mikeszekely]

Are retailers actually expecting a mob for this release? I myself do not expect GTA:SA to put up the numbers Halo 2 will... I mean, GTA has a pretty hard stigma riding on it whereas Halo 2 (while also sporting a M rating) seems to not be seen as the violent kill-fest GTA is. I know a lot of parents at my office who swore their children would never get their hands on any GTA games yet they would buy Halo 2 for their kids.

Another thing I just noticed (watching my little TV in my study here) there are two different edits of the TV spot... both are almost exactly alike except that one has a few cuts of more violent, gun brandishing action (that runs on the more adult channels) and the other has those clips replaced with less violent, more mundane clips (on the networks).

Well, at the Gamestop where I work, we had it in at 7:00 tonight, and we had a long line by 6:30. However, the line was pretty much gone by 8:00. We had a busier first day for Vice City, and we had a busier first day for Madden 2005. Don't get me wrong, San Andreas will have strong sales right throughout the holiday season... but then again, so will Madden. People like some of the writers at Gamespot who think San Andreas will the biggest game of the year are way off. Madden will probably outsell it on the PS2, and Halo 2 will probably sell more than Madden and San Andreas combined. In any case, I know we had about 160-ish preorders for San Andreas, and over 300 for Halo 2.

I think San Andreas ultimately suffers from the same problems games like True Crime suffered from... they're old hat now. GTA3, although I got bored with it pretty quick, was an innovator with it's huge city and open-ended gameplay. Vice City worked because it was supposed to be more of an expansion than a sequel. And it was kinda cool to be taking jobs for the big crime family, and Vice City had that 80's flavor working for it. Not to sound racist or anything, but I'm tired of hearing about inner-city gang violence, I'm tired of the violent, thuggish image that the rap industry is pushing on black children today (why can't more young black men look up to Tiger Woods instead of DMX or Snoop Dogg?), and I don't think San Andreas is going to work the way GTA3 or Vice City did because crime families and the 80's made for good TV, but drive by shootings is too evening news.

[JsARCLIGHT]

I myself am somewhat dubious of the subject matter this time around for GTA as well. It is obvious that for Vice City Rockstar simply ripped off Miami Vice, Scarface and a few other notable '80s movies for their story and content fodder and it appears to me they did the same thing with San Andreas. You can feel the Colors, Boys in the Hood and Menace 2 Society influence... heck, most of the character pics I have seen appear directly lifted from those movies. One character is just about ten pounds away from being Doughboy. The difference is that those movies were social commentaries with a moral at the end whereas GTA:SA seems to be just capitalizing on it... cashing in on the image rather than the lessons those movies taught people.

In the game's defence (although not meaning to defend the game as it is what it is) this time around it appears they are trying to give the main character a sort of "reluctant criminal" feel to him. Making him out to be "forced" back into crime... I know that doesn't mean much but perhaps the game will allow the player to take a more noble and less criminal road to solving some of the problems in the game.

Then again this is Grand Theft Auto we are talking about and all those pimps and hookers won't shoot themselves.

[TheLoneWolf]

Arg... I can't wait so long for the pc version. Is it possible to run that PS2 CD with an emulator?

Probably not for another 2 years, unless you're willing to settle for 1 fps and glitchy hell.

[Kin]

Hmm.. today I got a Dreamcast backup cd emulated

I sure hope San Andreas willl be fun. Although I think I still prefer Vice City's clean and colorfull world with different nutcase characters.

Hope somebody will use the San Andreas engine and import Vice City data in it for better world light rendering in the future.

[RichterX]

Is San Andreas coming out for PC too??

if so any one knows where to see system requirements?

[Kin]

Is San Andreas coming out for PC too??

if so any one knows where to see system requirements?

I think so.... aproximately 1 year+ , starting from today

[UN Spacy]

I'm getting mine copy this week.

It's worth it just for the soundtrack and hookers.

[TheLoneWolf]

Hmm.. today I got a Dreamcast backup cd emulated

Yup, only took 'em 5 years!

If you factor in that the fact that the DC used off the shelf parts, has a user-friendly OS, and is easy as sin to program for, 5 years is a long time.

Anyways, you're better off waiting for a PC port rather than a PS2 emu. It'll look better at a fraction of the processor power

[wakobi]

The scores for this game have so far been I.N.S.A.N.E. Here's the scoreboard so far:

Gamespot 9.6/10.0

IGN 9.9/10.0

[sabretooth]

yeah but they tend to be hype whore scorers

[Cyclone]

Looks great, but I'm happy to wait for the PC version.

In a world gone multiplayer, online gaming mad... it's nice to have a game just intended to be single player

[Kin]

yeah but they tend to be hype whore scorers

Indeed. Although I'm quite a fan of the GTA series.

The world in San Andreas looks big, but it seems not to be as detailed as Vice City.

Rockstar sure did a hell of a job + when nostalgy and childhood is involved it gives them more motivation and inspiration.

But the big plus would be the extra features such as personal care, casino's and highways.

Yeah Lonewolf, they said they went to the edge of the ps2 performance... imagine that with an emulator

[Hoptimus]

I am gonna wait for the Xbox version.

The GTA 2 pack on Xbox was so much better than its PS2 brothers.

Plus I will be plenty busy with Outrun2,Dead Or Alive Ultimate and the H bomb.

[baronv]

Well most of my friends and I know we'll be getting GTA:S.A., though maybe not in the first few weeks. The reason we'll be getting it is that we grew up in generally the same 'hood-like areas that is in the game, and we'd find nothing better than exploring the hood and blowing some of that shiznit up and clocking some fools upside their head with a 2x4.

[NSJ23]

Yeah, I'll have a hell of a day tomorrow when 400+ people will pick up their copy of GTA:SA at GameStop. But then again, that'll be nothing compared to November 9th at midnight, when 1,200+ will get their hands on Halo 2.

I don't know. halo 2 would have to put up some serious sales #'s according to this story.

GTA : SA Record breaking sales

[Kin]

Heh... expect some big bonus if you work at rockstar..

Oke oke... we can do alot in San Andreas.. but has everyone think about filling gas at a gas station?

[NSJ23]

LOL! I called my girlfriend to see if my copy came today, and she said she had been sitting there playing the game for the past hour and she's not really into video games. I can't wait to get home.

Edited October 26, 2004 by NSJ23

[JsARCLIGHT]

My copy just showed up here at work and now I'm antsy to go home and play it.

So far the manual is waaaaay better than the previous two games. Plus the soundtrack is finally "something for everyone". I always felt GTA3's sound track was weak, very "techno heavy"... and unless you grew up in the '80s Vice City's sounds probably burned your ears.

My radio will most likely be tuned to the talk station, K-DST (with Axl Rose as the DJ of all people) and Radio-X... the music of my childhood and my college years. Boss.

[Agent ONE]

My copy is in the mail... Can't wait!!!!!!!!

[Panzer]

LOL! I called my girlfriend to see if my copy came today, and she said she had been sitting there playing the game for the past hour and she's not really into video games. I can't wait to get home.

heh heh

thats what she told YOU she was doing..

i split outta there about 30 seconds before you got home..

[JsARCLIGHT]

Damn, If I'm having this much fun just reading the manual then the game must be the shiznit.

"De Koch Fine Jewels: Shut that Bitch up... with ice!"

[mikeszekely]

Yeah, I'll have a hell of a day tomorrow when 400+ people will pick up their copy of GTA:SA at GameStop. But then again, that'll be nothing compared to November 9th at midnight, when 1,200+ will get their hands on Halo 2.

I don't know. halo 2 would have to put up some serious sales #'s according to this story.

GTA : SA Record breaking sales

At my store, we had about 160 preorders, and we've sold maybe 150 total copies over two days.

We have over 300 preorders for Halo 2.

San Andreas may be setting records today, Halo 2 will be breaking them later.

[Max Jenius]

I hear Halo's storyline is much more fleshed out.

[JsARCLIGHT]

OK, I just spent the last three hours or so playing the game and here is my very early de facto review of the game (keep in mind I have only played for a few hours and the game is about 5% complete for me)...

READ ON PAST THIS POST as I may inadvertently give out spoilers, if you want your play experience to be unbiased I would not read any further if I was you!

Initial Impressions:

Wow. Again... Wow. Visually the game is a step forward from Vice City... the feel of the areas and the "look" of things just seems "right". Several added touches to the game engine like the grasses, the much improved sun glare and night time light effects and the overall blending of the game's textures present a very cohesive package. I will say that this game is not the graphic leap forward that the makers promised... I will admit you can notice the "goosed up" elements but for the most part the game is Vice City on seroids in the looks department. All the negative things like draw-in and pop up still happen, sometimes glaringly so... but when you are just milling about without the world screaming down on you the game presents a very immersive picture. While I have only played for a few hours I already find myself getting lost in the city of Los Santos... I find myself winding the streets in a hot car going from the "hood" to the downtown district to the suburbanite areas and actually getting lost and having to access the pause menu map to plot my way "back home". I am chalking this up to unfamiliarity with the game map for right now though. The game feels huge... it may not actually be as huge as people claim but it sure feels dauntingly huge so far. The story is run of the mill so far to me, nothing to write home about... typical GTA fare with no real twists or turns yet.

Thug Tomigotchi:

The added "RPG" elements to the game are strange and somewhat foreign feeling. When you press L1 (which like old centers your camera) it also calls up your "Stats" window that shows your "levels" as well as the day. I've discovered that you really, really have to pig out in order to boost your "Fat" ratio and working out like three days in a row at the gym makes you almost uber buff instantly. The other level meters like "sex appeal" are a mystery to me though as you go get some tatoos or a new hair doo and the meter goes way up but then seconds later it goes way down again. What and how things affect some of the stats are a mystery and they are not explained very well. The Tony Hawk like clothing shopping is addictive... I outfitted my guy in what I thought were some stylish (albeit cheap ass) clothes and it made my sex appeal die down to almost zero. I guess a white man just can't dress a black man right. Initial impressions lead me to believe that while you have all these options to mod and deck out your guy almost everyone will end up doing the same things... buff him out so you can beat the living sheeit out of people and run him around so he can book like a olympian on foot. Also every weapon, vehicle type and other things I have yet to bump into have their own "proficiency meters"... meaning your guy sucks at shooting all of the guns and you have to "practice" to get his skills up before you can adequately take people out. In the long run that is what this game is about, the long run. The whole custom system of character creation is geared towards dedicating months of your life to this game... boosting skills and hitting the right "harmony" so you can beat the game. Certain levels even favor boosting your skills before you attempt them so you may find yourself driving around looking for things to shoot at like I am just so when you hit a certain mission you can shoot straight and no get killed.

Gameplay Mechanics:

A lot is the same and a lot is different. The basics of the game are the same... the control layout and function is almost identical with a few ecceptions. Subtle things like using the R3 stick to look around now rather than a herky-jerky cut to a first person camera simply pans around your guy and his little head moves to track the camera's look point. They moved radio controls to the D pad (which is nice as now you can change channels up as well as down the dial). They even added a feature to the menu that pre-sets the radios in your cars to your favorite station (I am currently rocking out to K-DST)... but that feature only works in cars you "own", meaning if you jack a car it's radio will be set to whatever the person in the car was listening to, but if you get out of that car and get back in it at a later time (like say you save your game, stash the car in a garage and come back to it "days later" in the game) the radio will remain set to what you had it on. There are also a few changes that are not meeting with my liking. For one, they touted the "new aiming system" as being far and beyond Vice City's system... guess what? It isn't. You still lock on to stupid things like innocent pedestrians when a gunman is ten feet away from you shooting you in the head and you now lock on to rediculous poo like car tires and such rather than a nice pissed shooter blasting away at you. In other words the aiming system is still frustrating as all get out... especially when it decides to switch over to the "new" manual aiming when you are despirately trying to kill someone who is shooting you and you end up dying while trying to line up a shot at him. I have died umpteen times tonight due to this ass aiming system... but that is nothing new. Another not so new yet somehow "new" gameplay element is the notion of roaming gangs around the city. Yes they are there... yes you can see them from a mile away... yes sometimes they will approach your guy and trash talk him... but only occasionally will they attack him. I have been able to lay waste to any who opposed me so far. Either the game is taking it easy on me early in the game or the other gangs are pushovers on the street. However while these random encounters seem far too easy to put down the actual scripted attacks on your person seem dauntingly hard... mostly thanks to that ass aiming system mentioned earlier.

Vehicular Manslaughter:

While only playing for a few hours you do encounter some of the new vehicle types... most notably the bicycles. While cool to ride around on and bunny hop all over the place the bikes in the game are pretty much worthless. You so much as tap a larger vehicle and you go flying. They are basically motorcycles with a tenth of the speed and no radio... plus the rapid tapping of the X button to peddal like your ass is on fire is annoying. Combine that with your stamina wearing out fast make bikes sort of a last ditch vehicle. On another note vehicle physics are a bit better in this game. Cars react and handle a bit more like real cars should, which includes spin outs, squealing tires on hard stops (along with plowing) and wild spins if you throw the car around too much. Supposedly as you boost your driving skills your car control will improve (there is also supposedly a driving school somewhere in the world) but as I have only played for a few hours I have yet to encounter it. All in all the "meat" of the game, the driving and the cars is improved... not by a landslide but by just enough to make it new and fresh.

My Final Thoughts:

While only having a few hours under my belt, my guy sporting combat fatigues and a face bandana running around like an urban commando I find myself getting sucked into the game all over again. Unlike the antics of the unnamed goon in GTA3 and the psycho Tommy Vercetti in Vice City the ability to custom out your guy has this strange ability to suck you into the game a bit faster. While the story is mostly pre-scripted and your guy's responses to almost everyone are out of your hands (so far) you still have this "along for the ride" feeling... but something tells me that might change. So far I like the game... a lot suprisingly. I mean, I just sat there... glued to the TV for three hours... cat curled up in my lap... all alone in the room with the lights out... wife away... it was almost a religious experience. I am not dissapointed... and for people who know me I really only like about one in ten games these days. For my money this game is a required purchase if you like the franchise and if you have never played a GTA game this one will suck you in if you like it or not.

[Jawjaw]

Na I won't be picking this game up. I got bored in less than hour with GTA 3.

You and a buddy of mine are the only people I know that play games and didn't love GTA. The first GTA was a blast and the third blew my mind the first time I saw it. I played it for hours doing nothing but driving around and messing with the dynamics of the game. I loved the way the vehicles handled and all the different things you could do. You could play the game for weeks and still find something new.

I'm not sure what to think of the new GTA. Things like having to tool around on a bike and work out at the gym don't sound like much fun. Sadly, I won't be able to check it out for a while personally because of a tight budget. If I am going to buy a game, it can only be one and that is going to be HL2.

BTW- What's the freakin deal with Halo? Anytime there is a discussion about any game, someone has to bring up Halo like it's the god of all games.

[mikeszekely]

BTW- What's the freakin deal with Halo? Anytime there is a discussion about any game, someone has to bring up Halo like it's the god of all games.

In terms of sales, it is. It's been, what, three years since its release? But its still consistantly high on the sales charts. Statistically, something like two copies of Halo have been sold for every three Xboxes (which doesn't seem accurate to me... I don't know anyone that owns an Xbox and doesn't own Halo).

Mind you, I'm not saying GTA is a better game or Halo is a better game... they're really very different types of games, and there's no law that says you can't like both, or dislike both, or prefer one to the other. The only reason to bring up Halo 2 is a thread about San Andreas is to speculate which mega franchise is likely to sell more copies.

That said, though, if you've never played Halo but you own and Xbox or know someone that does, do give it a try. PC enthusiasts tend to rag on it (and Xbox in general for lacking the keyboard/mouse setup they're used to), but it probably really is the best console FPS to come down the pipe... and before anyone says anything, I used to only play Goldeneye and then later Perfect Dark exclusively in the FPS genre. I've branched out a bit, and had fun with the Medal of Honor series and Nightfire, but Halo is the only one that really sucked me in, and definately the only one to hold my interest on the multiplayer front... to this day, when my friends come over, we usually fire up Halo.

[dr_vandermeer]

Great review JsArclight. Can't wait to check it out!!!