MZero Ep. 5 *SPOILER THREAD*

[Duke Togo]

I hate to tell you, but there was "magic" in Macross Plus as well, what did you think Sharon Apple represented? As well as Myung's song at the end...

Um, no Keith. Its called hypnotism and subliminal suggestion. This was all made rather clear, perhaps you should watch it again.

[Lestat]

I don't know what you're all whining about, it was brilliant, amazing. Blew me away.

I think macross zero is a natural evolution from the direction macross 7 was headed. I simply loved that we finally got to see the protoculture's own mecha, and boy was it worth while. The zjentoholauedy are all flying Fokker Dr.I's compared to the protoculture's f-22s.

The ending was traditional - open ended, and I thought very appropriate. I think what we're seeing at the end of the episode with Focker is the actual cause of his alcoholism. The fold scene was excellent, and the thing you people don't seem to get is that in Macross, magic IS real. Deal with it. There had to be magic involved for ONE ship to stop millions of enemy ships. i.e. it wasn't minmay's singing, it was the magic of her singing.

Soundtrack took a turn towards excellent. Highly appropriate. Dogfights are unparrelleled by any macross episode ever, including macross plus.

The sense of tragedy when they whip out the reaction warheads really sinks in, and what can I say? MONSTER!

Who knows, maybe the megaroad ran into shin and sara. I reckon they're headed for the centre of the galaxy - and the last surviving protoculture.

[John Focker]

I hate to tell you, but there was "magic" in Macross Plus as well, what did you think Sharon Apple represented? As well as Myung's song at hte end....

For those who don't like it, I honestly don't know what tell you. Macross has always had this style of balance for me, be it with giant aliens which are awakened to love & music, or giant flying bio-mecha (which I sure as  hell don't see as a giant leap from the Zentradi in general). Anyone thinking Macross was just a hard war story needs to wake up to the fact that it was never intended to be. Gundam has Newtypes, Macross has Spiritia.

Sorry Keith, but I beg to differ. Sharon Apple was really more "hypnotism", and like the Duke said, "subliminal suggestion," rather than magic. Several scenes were shown in Macross Plus that pointed to the manipulation of brain secretions (hormones and neurotransmitters) leading to hypnotic effects. There was NOTHING magical, or even remotely supernatural/paranormal in Macross Plus.

As for the parallel drawn between Gundam and Macross, Gundam was designed to have NewTypes as a main plot device since the very beginning (Gundam 0079). Macross, on the other hand, went through the TV series, DYRL, Flashback 2012, and Macross Plus without even touching SPIRITIA! Spiritia is a much later (both chronologically and in terms of continuity) afterthought that's only received partial acceptance amongst fans.

From the look of things, more spiritia may be coming our way. However, this doesn't necessarily mean that ALL Macross fans are fans of M7 and spiritia. There are still many who psychologically refuse M7's canon status, therefore the statement "Macross has spiritia" stands only for M7 fans. For the rest of us, it is still the good ol' love triangle, songs, giant transforming ship, and 3-mode transformations.

Edited October 24, 2004 by John Focker

[F360°]

well, I finally had time to watch ep 5, it's not that good at all. It seem to have the worse ending among all the Macross series/ OVA. Every thing in this ep is rushed. I guess a instead of a movie edition,,. it's better off they makea season 2 kinda thing.. 5 more eps, to recap some parts in the first one, explain some things, show some VF-1, etc. SDF1, etc

to keep it short, The dogfight is pretty good, and it's action packed, but the ending sucks.

oh and it's was Sara that help Shin's plane decellerate before reaching the ocean and not Mao. And they did show something that looks like that anti gravity thingies being turn on before the aircraft carrier flys off into the skys. Not sure about the submarine.

[Zero Enna]

I think it isn't all bad, finally we can see the destroid's full potential and the most amazing dogfight since the YF-19 vs. YF-21 and YF-21 vs. Ghost. But I want more info! WTH happened with the other mayans? How they explained the death of the entirely crew of 3 frigates? And the Austerstäd? Haven't anyone thinked about using the monster to shoot at it or launch a VF-0 equiped with one of that monster bombs to explode the anti-un big toy?

By he way....maybe Edgar was that afro-american pilot who appear on SDF Macross (The only black pilot who appeared only one time).

Edited October 24, 2004 by Zero Enna

[Aegis!]

for the most part, it looks like a lot have seen the chinese subbed version and theyre contributing what they can. i being one of them but understand maybe more than others since i can read minimalistic chinese. dry.gif some views just might be off since they didnt understand it but oh well, the more the merrier.

i dont see how people are being "very harsh"... if they see something they dont like, they dont like it. seems logical to me. i didnt mind it at all. i actually thought it was decent but that obviously depends on my preference of whats good and whats not.

as far as other "magic" scenes are concern, imo mao being able to contact shin in the ship seemed pretty magical to me. maybe im just weird, but i dont usually have halographic figures of my friends talking to me when im in need of help. blink.gif

the AFOS looked quite organic to me when Sara was inside. maybe it was just me. i should go watch it again. but i have to say the AFOS imo resembled a proto-devlin so i dont see it as "poo" as you would put it. i dont see how its a "limited" view, just different. im sorry that i dont share your point of view but i dont feel that mine is "limited" either. i dont see why people need to resort to questioning each other intelligence due to their "views".

i agree the animation was quite good. the fights were great too. hopefully we can see more macross in the future to further "tune" our views on where all of this heading. meanwhile with all we've got, one guess is as good as another until kawamori can fill us in with the details.

In case you didn´t notice I kinda appealed to those who DIDN´T watch the chinese fansub hence my comments about refraining from posting here , the thread title clearly says it ¨spoiler thread¨ , so those who have no idea what happens on the episode should calmly wait till they watch it.

Well , they´re being harsh in some way cause some of them try to impose their ¨it´s all magic¨ vision over everyone , be it for good or bad.

In regards to Mao´s appearance inside Shin´s VF-0 , that would have to be the only really unexplicable scene in the whole episode , Although one could quite easily explain it by analysing the scene within the Azuka when Mao touches the AFOS and it proyects what´s happening inside the ANti-UN sub , it wouldn´t be strange if Mao could use the AFOS to proyect herself since she had the AFOS blood inside her.

If the AFOS was organic at all then the UN scientists would´ve catalogued it as an organic fossil instead of a protoculture artifact had it had signs of having organic elements from the begining. Besides that , we can clearly seen the mechanical parts of it when the head unit attaches to the main body , and the supposedly organic part where Sara is being hosted is only a life support chamber , much like an artyficial womb ( kinda reminds me of Zentradis micronization chambers).

And I´m honestly sorry if you took my commenst as agresive so I apologise , but either way , when I reffered to limited I meant people only saw what they wanted to see under their ¨M0 is just a M7 sequel¨ vision.

I personally aint a M7 fans , I hardly like it and I actually see no conection between the two series in terms of magic elements since M0´s somehow unconventional elements can be easily explained in conection to the Protoculture technology.

Also , it seems to me that it´s is finally made clear Sara and Mao aren´t exactly humans , in fact I doubt they´re humans at all since they could connect to the AFOS and all other protoculture remains ( signed flying rocks).

As I said earlier , something nice at the end is that they seems to allude that Shin and Sara went towards the center of the galaxy or wherever the last protoculture remains are so it would seem the protoculture aint finnished at all.

I also agree the episode was ineccesarily rushed , it´s a shame they had to waste epside 2-4 in irrelevant stuff instead of going more in depth story-wise in relatinon to the protoculture and the Anti-UN.

I don´t know why but it really left me withhis the impression that everything in this episode kinda set ground for a new series , either post M+ or another prequel , not because of the bunch of unanswered question but more importantly cause of the implications of some of the things shown within the OVAs

[Seven]

No no no, you all have it wrong. The AFOS is an Invid Inorganic! And it took Shin and Sara to go back to the Invid homeworld! Sheesh!

[Skypoet]

I found episode 5 awesome without the translation (my japanese is so basic I can't understand a lot of what is said). Maybe once there'll be a fansubbed version I'll find this episode a bit, slightly disappointing... but remember the macross series/fanchise is mostly about spaceship/mecha design and nice, fast-moving battles, period...

The aerial battle, dogfight, when Shin and Nora both use thrust vectoring, is great... has any other film/anime done this before (well maybe Yukikaze but I haven't seen it yet)? No... the way the planes moved was nice and somewhat realistic (note: I have a bachelor in aerospace eng.) well realistic enough.

And for the "bird-human" divinity shooting energy beams and pink missiles, and the "poor" script/scenario/plot well... keep in mind (for those of you who were disappointed) this is shoji kawamori stuff... remember he is neither Jules Vernes, nor Asimov nor Philipp K. Dick nor Frank Herbert (even though he is a good mecha designer) so don't have too high expectations. If you want a complex plot, 10 philosophical quotations every minute and character building go see "ghost in the Shell 2: innocence" (but there you won't have the COOL mecha!).

No, truly, for an anime of this kind/standard I found this episode great. Maybe sometimes the graphics were slightly inferior in standard than in the rest of the series but not so much so.

[Seven]

I found episode 5 awesome without the translation (my japanese is so basic I can't understand a lot of what is said). Maybe once there'll be a fansubbed version I'll find this episode a bit, slightly disappointing... but remember the macross series/fanchise is mostly about spaceship/mecha design and nice, fast-moving battles, period...

The aerial battle, dogfight, when Shin and Nora both use thrust vectoring, is great... has any other film/anime done this before (well maybe Yukikaze but I haven't seen it yet)? No... the way the planes moved was nice and somewhat realistic (note: I have a bachelor in aerospace eng.) well realistic enough.

And for the "bird-human" divinity shooting energy beams and pink missiles, and the "poor" script/scenario/plot well... keep in mind (for those of you who were disappointed) this is shoji kawamori stuff... remember he is neither Jules Vernes, nor Asimov nor Philipp K. Dick nor Frank Herbert (even though he is a good mecha designer) so don't have too high expectations. If you want a complex plot, 10 philosophical quotations every minute and character building go see "ghost in the Shell 2: innocence" (but there you won't have the COOL mecha!).

No, truly, for an anime of this kind/standard I found this episode great. Maybe sometimes the graphics were slightly inferior in standard than in the rest of the series but not so much so.

I don't think everyone was complaining about wanting more complexity, more the lack of any semblance of character development and how the story was rushed.

[RichterX]

Sara and Mao are not 'human'... that's all I can say.

You think normal humans can control AFOS?

The blood that flows in Mao's body is partly from AFOS, I suspect their whole family is not 'human'.

So I think it is okay if Mao and Sara did something 'magical'...

Anyways, just my $0.02.

Oh I forgot to say... when Sara was inside AFOS, she keep seeing 'Kadun', which are people who are 'possessed' by anger/rage. At the end Shin gave up his anger and put his life in the hands of Sara, that sort of broke the 'spell' that AFOS had on Sara and she could finally recognize Shin as who he is and not a Kadun. She saw all the valkyries as kadun and that's why she was firing at them...

Was it anger?? I thought she was seeing Kadun in anything with armament.

Sara didn't saw Shin until he ejected all of the armament out of the VF-0

[Macross_Fanboy]

What I also liked about the action is that you see some good ol' regular planes in the battle. The Anti-UN seemed to use Sea Flankers to replace some of its irreplaceable SV-51s. You see it shoot down a Ghost and then I think it was Shin who shot it down with a couple of micromissiles.

[ewilen]

I think I saw a Mig-29, but I didn't make out any Flankers. Things were moving very fast, though.

Changing gears, as nice as it was to see Shin and Nora pull Cobras, why not just do a Gerwalk brake instead? For that matter, Nora used conversion to battroid in ep. 1 for essentially the same purpose.

[JLYC]

I think I saw a Mig-29, but I didn't make out any Flankers. Things were moving very fast, though.

Changing gears, as nice as it was to see Shin and Nora pull Cobras, why not just do a Gerwalk brake instead? For that matter, Nora used conversion to battroid in ep. 1 for essentially the same purpose.

i believe it's because they're travelling at a speed too fast for transformation (you'd know if you're able to read the chinese subtitle) so they have to use vector thrust instead. later in the scene when you see the circular gauge go green indicating speed is ok, shin transformed into battroid. i think it was pretty cool- reminded me how edgard was always reminding shin to keep an eye on the gauge before transformation.

[Ignacio Ocamica]

Just watched it!!! And noticed an animation mistake

Shin aproaching AFOS...

Edited October 25, 2004 by Ignacio Ocamica

[Ignacio Ocamica]

Shin in front of AFOS...

Where is the mistake? No price for the winner

[the white drew carey]

His FASTpacks are back on the legs?

p.s.- no PRIZE for the winner. Not PRICE.

[Ignacio Ocamica]

Yes, we have a winner with no PRIZE

[Ignacio Ocamica]

TWDC:

You won nothing, but you can give mom a hug

[DarkReaper]

Also, the backpack isn't folded. Looks weird.

[JLYC]

just watched it for the 3rd time...i liked it the first time and it's still growing on me. i guess i just have a really open mind and the mix of sci-fi and spirits dont really bother me (although it did in final fantasy the movie). maybe some of the purists just need to sit back, relax, and enjoy the show rather than letting the spiritual components bother them so much.

[Ignacio Ocamica]

Also, the backpack isn't folded. Looks weird.

Yes, it's a semi-gerwalk! I kinda like it (I display my Yamato VF-1D that way).

The funny thing is that the leg packs are back

[Renato]

I think I saw a Mig-29, but I didn't make out any Flankers. Things were moving very fast, though.

Changing gears, as nice as it was to see Shin and Nora pull Cobras, why not just do a Gerwalk brake instead? For that matter, Nora used conversion to battroid in ep. 1 for essentially the same purpose.

i believe it's because they're travelling at a speed too fast for transformation (you'd know if you're able to read the chinese subtitle) so they have to use vector thrust instead. later in the scene when you see the circular gauge go green indicating speed is ok, shin transformed into battroid. i think it was pretty cool- reminded me how edgard was always reminding shin to keep an eye on the gauge before transformation.

Yeah, this was one of the few things I liked about this episode -- the little gauge that tells you when it is OK to transform. Shin needed to get away but at the speed he was travelling he couldn't switch modes to change direction, so he used vector thrustering until he was in transformation speed, at which point he stomped on Nora's head in Gerwalk.

[Renato]

So what exactly happens in the end? Who dies? Does it lead into SDF Macross, DYRL or is it just vague? Who or what makes a surprise apppearance?

Aries, Ivanov and Nora are dead.

Sara and Shin are 'gone', as they both appear to head out into space.

Edgar lives but appears for about 15 seconds total.

No direct lead in's to any of the other series.

Probably what's going to hit people the hardest about the episode is that it certainly does appear to suffer from being accelerated to get things finished. Specifically, the cliffhanger of episode 4 is not addressed at all. I mean that literally - no explaination is given for how Shin and Sara survived the blast, and it jumps ahead an unknown amount of time as Shin, Sara, Focker and Aries are all together in front of an AIPHOS artifact, then suddenly SV-51s swoop in and grab it.. and Aries and Sara are captured because they were inside it (when a second ago they were outside it). This happens in the first MINUTE of the episode. I don't understand Japanese so I don't know whether Shin's narration is making anything clearer, but I wouldn't be surprised if it isn't.

Agreed. Everything about the first few minutes just screams "last-second addition".

How the hell is it that Shin, Roy, Aries and Sara were all together just then?? And the animation is terrible, the SV-51s weren't even animated, they just zoomed in and out and scrolled around the screen.

[Renato]

Hmm, can we have an actual full event rundown of what happens!

I don't know if I remember everything, but here we go --

Opening -- Shin and Roy in a helicopter. The anti-UN picking up the Birdman's head (with Sara and Aries inside it, for some messed-up reason) from the craters of the bombings and Roy and Shin ducking from their fire are shown in flashback (poorly).

Back on the Asuka, Mao uses the Birdman to magically project what's going on aboard the Anti-UN sub. Sara, Aries, Nora and gang are shown. Hasford is explaining (whilst imagining Sara naked, the old perv, I kid you not) how the Birdman will use the body of the priestess to sing the song of destruction, while Sara is angry because they destroyed the forest. Nora then says, "What if it had been the UN who bombed the island?" She then knowingly asks Aries what Operation Iconoclast was all about, to which Aries replies that had the UN not been able to get hold of the APHOS and it had fallen into enemy hands then the entire island was to be destroyed by the UN, without a trace left. This of course drives Sara crazy.

Meanwhile, Shin says something like "Don't believe them, Sara!" But this doesn't make any sense either, since it is Aries who is saying this so it's obviously true (dumbass).

Then Mao begs Shin to stop the Birdman from waking and Shin's like "screw the birdman, we gotta go get Sara" and Mao says "no, cos Sara is prepared to kill herself in order to not allow the birdman to make her sing the song of destruction, yada yada ..."

So then Roy says, "once in a while ya gotta throw your life away for a woman" which is too cool so Shin says "Wow, I love ya, daddy". (Lie)

Roy and Shin prapare for takeoff from the Asuka which is now flying for no reason whatsoever but some idiot on the deck still says no, you don't have permission. However, he gets knocked out by Edgar's crutch (though he should've been knocked out by Edgar's crotch). So Edgar launches them both off, asking Shin to sign his leg cast upon return. Yeah, right, pal.

Roy and Shin then head off to the also-flying enemy sub, cant remember the name, whilst being chased by DD and Nora. Shin makes a hole in the side of the sub and sees Sara, but then his battroid head gets blasted off (to reappear later without a scratch, yay) which of course makes him plummet down to the sea (??).

Sara thinks he's dead (I wish) so she lets out a scream, which is like the last straw for her "misery".

Next.... Umm, I think the Bird man awakens. The body (in dildo form) shoots out from the asuka as the head -- with sara in it -- shoots out from the sub, and connect "mechanically", even though in episode two we were told that the head had been cut off from the body using some kinds of tools.

The birdman asks Sara if Mankind has progressed to the point of building starships, she says yes. He asks if they have ended war -- she stops and flashes back to previous episodes scenes and says no. So the dildo transforms into a.... thing, and shoots off energy beams, blasting those flying ships to kingdom come.

So now everybody's flying around in circles, and Nora, oblivious to the Birdman, while chasing Shin, dies a la TV Kakizaki, she gets in the path of the Birdman's blast. Then, Shin notices that Sara is inside the Birdman, so goes towards it, but there are lasers and poo coming towards him, so it's just as well that a crazed Ivanof gets right in front of him, shielding Shin as he is blown to minestrone soup by Sara in a pathetic attept at payback for Nora's death.

Then, as Shin looks at Sara, he too has flashbacks of his family being killed and stuff and so shoots at her while flying away. Then, he is prepared to destroy the Birdman, but AND NOW FOR THE STUPIDEST MOMENT IN MACROSS HISTORY -- a tiny Mao appears in his cockpit like in those disney cartoons where a little angel and a little devil appear next to the character and say "go on, you know ya wanna" or "no, it's bad!" alternatively. So Mao says something like "you have to save her"

And he says OK.

Actually, I gotta go now, more later. Or not.

[ewilen]

I'll continue, but be warned that I don't know Japanese or Chinese, and I've only seen the thing once, so all that follows is in glorious Error-Vision.

First, though, the flying ships and subs--some people have said it was because they had antigrav generators like those on the Macross. I saw some animation like the generators, but regardless of that, I assumed that the reason everything started floating was because of an effect from the birdman. Maybe they did have antigrav generators (or some kind of superdimension machinery based on overtechnology), but the birdman activated them?

Anyway, Shin makes a leap of faith and jettisons all of the weapons on his VF-0 (but people have pointed out that his leg fastpacks reappear magically later), flies over to the AFOS's "cockpit" and awakens Sara. Around this time, the UN forces trot out a Monster on the aircraft carrier. It looks a lot like the MAC II, but the arms then open up to reveal the "claws" (see Nanashi's Monster thread), and it turns out that the claws are used to anchor the Monster to some sort of stays embedded in the deck while it prepares to fire. The Monster fires at the AFOS...and frankly, I don't remember what happens here. I think maybe the AFOS activates a shield or something, and the Monster's round is supposed to be a reaction shell or missile. The AFOS survives with Sara on board and folds out. Shin's VF has been badly damaged (I think by the AFOS while he was approaching it), and takes a nose dive toward the Ocean. He tries to pull out, and it looks like he's going to make it. But then, just as he's about horizontal a few dozen feet above the surface, the VF-0 plunks straight down into the water. Mao and Edgar watch in horror from the deck of the aircraft carrier. After a long while, though, the VF-0 flies out of the water and folds out.

Aries and Roy are left on the shore somewhere. Some dialog occurs, and Aries dies.

The End. Or something like that.

[Renato]

OK, Im back. Theres no apostrophe on this keyboard that I can see, sorry.

Anyway, where were we? Oh yeah, so the Birdman.

Hasford and Aries, now covered in blood probably due to the "entrance" that idiot Shin made, speak about how many ancient civilizations prophesised the end of the world, and that ultimately it seems that the experiment known as mankind seems to have been unsuccessful, thus the terror unfolding now.

Meanwhile on the Asuka, the Captain is like, "well now what??" So one of the other guys whispers something and he says, "This is hardly the time or place!!" But then he listens a bit more and says, "oh yeah, Operation Iconoclast... good thinking, strapping young soldier." "I aim to please". "Not half". Anywaaay... the Cap then orders for the reactive weapons to roll out.

Shin rushes headlong into the APHOS, and jettisons all his weaponry, so Sara finally recognises him as Shin and not a Kadun. He reaches towards her but she is inside that bubble thing. The Birdman calms down and Mao looks up and smiles, but then the monster appears next to her and fires off its load. Sara says "kadun!" and pushes Shin away, back into his VF, and says "Thank you for believing me.." as the bombs hit the Birdman.

Shin flies away, but the explosion engulfs the rear section of the VF. However, the explosion begins to "implode" and the birdman is seen charging up some energy and then "folds" away. Shin says "shes gone".

Roy and Aries are then seen on the shore and Aries tells him she loves him. "There, that was easy, wasnt it?" and then she coughs blood and dies. Supposedly.

Meanwhile Shins engines no longer work and he cant eject so hes a bit pissed freefalling to his doom. But then he hears Saras, and the Mayan islanders song (who are all on the deck of the Asuka now) and his VF magically begins to turn horizontally again. But he abruptly plummets to the sea anyway. So Mao is shocked, but then the flying fish jump out, and then so too does the VF-0. Mao says "I guess Shin is a bird-man after all", and as she says so the VF-0 grows feathered wings and flies off into the stars.

The End

*EXTRA FEATURE* .... Oh, baby.

Four losers gather together and talk about what it was like working on Zero. In particular the Mao girl got on my nerves with her "er... I dunno... Hmm... I thought it was ... really.. er.. Macrossy". As she said that you could tell that "Shin" had really had enough of her, and sarcastically replied "Thank you for that. Best comment ever. Great". Really he was thinking "Damn you, Im trying to make the best of a sucky situation over here and you dont seem to be making any effort whatsoever. At least I didnt get the auction just cos I give great head.... err.. yeah."

The Aries girl didnt even want to face the fact that she had died. "Nah, she isnt dead.. that was ketchup or something that she threw up."

At the end, Shin really pleaded to the staff that they get more work by begging for a sequel or at least a movie edition (to which Aries says "yeah, where I dont throw up blood!") "Lets do a movie! Director?? Ah, hes not here. Anyway, lets do one."

So, Ill be surprised if there isnt one later down the line.

[Graham]

I must say that i'm quite disappointed with this episode.

Just some feelings after watching a mandarin fansub.........

What exactly is the Hory Froating Head thinking?!?!

Now the "bird-man" has become a giant Venus Fly Trap, complete with purple petals?!

If any one thinks that "magic" was too much to bear in the previous 4 episodes, this one takes the cake!

Flying subs and aircraft carriers... .even without the afos inside them? thats stretching it too much!

Not to mention that animation was picc poor for this episode.....darn.......i would venture to say that animation is waaaaay below par, more series standard rather than OVA...... i just seriously did not like the presentation of Shin hearing mao's voice.......

This episode could have really wrapped up the whole OVA series nicely... so much potential, only to be squandered by Kawamor's whims and fantasies

This episode makes macross 0 on par with Mac II.

Flying sub and aircraft carriers?!

When does this happen, is there a picture.

At one point in ep # 5, Anti-Grav generators are shown (similar to the ones in the SDF-1). I think these are in the Asuka, which could explain why and how it is flying. Presumably the Anti-UN submarine also has anti-grav generators as well? Not sure why the Aegis cruiser is also flying tho, perhaps it all is magic?

Anyway, I agree that the begining is very rushed, but the dog fight scenes are excelent, although it is a shame that Roy or Shin are not the ones to kill DD and Nora.

I liked how there was a practical use for the Destroid Monsters claws, after all the speculating on MW about why it had claws and how impractical they were.

Graham

[Aegis!]

I must say that i'm quite disappointed with this episode.

Just some feelings after watching a mandarin fansub.........

What exactly is the Hory Froating Head thinking?!?!

Now the "bird-man" has become a giant Venus Fly Trap, complete with purple petals?!

If any one thinks that "magic" was too much to bear in the previous 4 episodes, this one takes the cake!

Flying subs and aircraft carriers... .even without the afos inside them? thats stretching it too much!

Not to mention that animation was picc poor for this episode.....darn.......i would venture to say that animation is waaaaay below par, more series standard rather than OVA...... i just seriously did not like the presentation of Shin hearing mao's voice.......

This episode could have really wrapped up the whole OVA series nicely... so much potential, only to be squandered by Kawamor's whims and fantasies

This episode makes macross 0 on par with Mac II.

Flying sub and aircraft carriers?!

When does this happen, is there a picture.

At one point in ep # 5, Anti-Grav generators are shown (similar to the ones in the SDF-1). I think these are in the Asuka, which could explain why and how it is flying. Presumably the Anti-UN submarine also has anti-grav generators as well? Not sure why the Aegis cruiser is also flying tho, perhaps it all is magic?

Anyway, I agree that the begining is very rushed, but the dog fight scenes are excelent, although it is a shame that Roy or Shin are not the ones to kill DD and Nora.

I liked how there was a practical use for the Destroid Monsters claws, after all the speculating on MW about why it had claws and how impractical they were.

Graham

Yeah , those were anti-grav generator that the APHOS activated (otherwise there wouldn´t be a reason for that scene to be shown). I would assume engines generate a whole magnetic field around them like the macross before it folded in the TV series and M+ and that´s why all the other ships are floating , OR a fairly simplier explanation would be that the other ships also had anti -grav generators ( doubtly though).

[Macross_Fanboy]

I must say that i'm quite disappointed with this episode.

Just some feelings after watching a mandarin fansub.........

What exactly is the Hory Froating Head thinking?!?!

Now the "bird-man" has become a giant Venus Fly Trap, complete with purple petals?!

If any one thinks that "magic" was too much to bear in the previous 4 episodes, this one takes the cake!

Flying subs and aircraft carriers... .even without the afos inside them? thats stretching it too much!

Not to mention that animation was picc poor for this episode.....darn.......i would venture to say that animation is waaaaay below par, more series standard rather than OVA...... i just seriously did not like the presentation of Shin hearing mao's voice.......

This episode could have really wrapped up the whole OVA series nicely... so much potential, only to be squandered by Kawamor's whims and fantasies

This episode makes macross 0 on par with Mac II.

Flying sub and aircraft carriers?!

When does this happen, is there a picture.

At one point in ep # 5, Anti-Grav generators are shown (similar to the ones in the SDF-1). I think these are in the Asuka, which could explain why and how it is flying. Presumably the Anti-UN submarine also has anti-grav generators as well? Not sure why the Aegis cruiser is also flying tho, perhaps it all is magic?

Anyway, I agree that the begining is very rushed, but the dog fight scenes are excelent, although it is a shame that Roy or Shin are not the ones to kill DD and Nora.

I liked how there was a practical use for the Destroid Monsters claws, after all the speculating on MW about why it had claws and how impractical they were.

Graham

You want Shin to take out Nora?!?!?!?! Shin is an ass! I'm GLAD he didn't get Nora! As for Roy taking out DD it would have been great, but in the end it was better that DD went off on his own Anti-UN and UN be damned.

And I don't think the Auserdat had any anti-grav generateors because those sub personel seemed to be freaking out that they were surfacing without wanting to. And I doubt the ASKA had the same thing as well. It's all Anima Spiritia so it may as well be magic in Macross Zero's time era!

[Keith]

<blockquote>Um, no Keith. Its called hypnotism and subliminal suggestion. This was all made rather clear, perhaps you should watch it again.</blockquote>

Again, I have to ask the question. Why is it so much easier to believe an A.I. can exist that can decide to use holograms & influence over brain chemestry to hypnotize the masses & perform elaborate light shows (that themselves appear magical) to be practical. But biological representations of many of those same things are written off as fantasy & magical? We still don't know exactly how we work, but humans aren't considered fictional or magical.

If you fail to see the representations of Sharon Apple in Plus, I don't know what to tell you. Suffice it to say to you.

On another note, from these new descriptions of the ending here, I definately think this is a setup for perhaps a bigass Macross finale. Perhaps humans vs the last of the Protoculture? It doesn't sound much like Sara & the AFOS left with a good impression of humanity. If they are indeed traveling to the last known location of the Protoculture, or perhaps the location of some super PC doomsday device, this could all lead to a big 'splody end battle movie.

[CoryHolmes]

Again, I have to ask the question. Why is it so much easier to believe an A.I. can exist that can decide to use holograms & influence over brain chemestry to hypnotize the masses & perform elaborate light shows (that themselves appear magical) to be practical.

Because we already know that pleasing images, and images not-so-pleasing, have a noticable effect on the brainwaves and other biological signs of people. We also know that music that is pleasing to the ear can also affect brainwaves, not to mention the mood of the listener. We also know that hypnotism, while not "scientific" in nature, can and does work and its primary medium is sound.

While its application in Macross Plus is definitily the realm of science fiction, it's not too much of leap of imagination to see something like that happening in the real world.

[Macross_Fanboy]

Man, I'm thinking there could be a "semi-sequel" to Macross Zero since the events in Macross Zero were classified for 50 years, so 50 years later, the information can be divulged and set things up. Who knows, maybe we'll get an Aegis Focker in the new series if there ever is one. Either way, the Protoculture has technology that surpasses the UN's. Look at the AFOS's Macross cannon-style weapon, that thing can sustain fire, the SDF-1's and Battle 7's couldn't. Well, let's wait, maybe 5 years from now we'll get a new Macross, I'm hoping for something after 7 so we can get a bunch of CGI cel shaded Valkyries.

[Pat S]

Yeah , those were anti-grav generator that the APHOS activated (otherwise there wouldn´t be a reason for that scene to be shown).

So, the Aphos activates the ship anti grav generators, then later asks Sara if the people of this planet have advanced technology? Uh, shouldn't it already know this?

[Renato]

Yeah , those were anti-grav generator that the APHOS activated (otherwise there wouldn´t be a reason for that scene to be shown).

So, the Aphos activates the ship anti grav generators, then later asks Sara if the people of this planet have advanced technology? Uh, shouldn't it already know this?

Hehehe. I was thiking about this a bit earlier. And when it asks if the humans have ended their wars, doesn't the very fact that the Birdman has awoken mean that they obviously have not??

That is one stupid birdbrain.

[Pat S]

Sheesh birdmen, relax, don't worry so much about us humans. If you wouldn't crash your super space fortresses on our planet, we would blow ourselves up at a much slower pace.

Edited October 25, 2004 by Pat S