Master Dex

I agree, in episode 4 at least you see it is a lot bigger. For example with Alto goes in to try and knife it to death you get a good idea, as well as when he gets on it's back to shoot it with the beam cannon. Besides this, stuff form the 1st and 2nd episodes showed the comparison fairly well. Good point, I see that, so the vajra model is definitely taller, but I don't think the VF-25 is that much closer to the camera. I still think Graham had it correct by assuming the Vajra was a different scaler earlier. However I have been proven wrong on many things in the past.

Well before Frontier introduced me to the VF-25 I was practically in love with the VF-22 design, however I'm not so much of a fan of the VF-17, and that translated to the VF-171 in frontier, which looks better to me, but still not my type of aerospace craft. I don't think it is anything against the valkyrie itself, mostly it is probably because they are inspired by the F-117 and I don't like that plane much at all.

I believe we will at least see some, because

The character of Klan is intriguing, but myself being a mecha lover find more interest in the Q-Rea (I don't want to try to remember the full spelling). Although I have to admit I never paid much attention to Zentraedi mecha/suits until recently. I don't really know why.

Well I guess I should be lucky that I do not have an animated avatar then. However Mr March let me propose this idea to you, if you have something against those of us who's named begin with M, you may want to take a look at your own name too, heh heh heh. And I believe you mean fricking sharks with fricking lasers attatched to their fricking heads, because otherwise it just doesn't work.

In that case, would you say I'm better off watching the subbed version or the dub, because I know they dubbed the original Macross series now as a separate entity to Robotech, and in truth I have been considering just buying the DVD pack of the Macross dub for a while now (although even if I end up watching the dubbed version I'm probably just going to do it online now... my money situation isn't at it's best for me at this time). Well then there's the thing isn't it, I first found out about Robotech some years ago because I saw cool mecha stuff (side note: it was destined I'd like Macross better, besides it actually being better, because I never had any interest in Robotech besides the Macross saga... mostly because of the VF-1 though). When I migrated to Macross is was partly to see even more mecha than Robotech could ever offer, but also because I'd get a good story. I'm liking Frontier so much now because it seems to be a story about the people living on the colony who are pulled into this unexpected conflict with the Vajra and as result we get mecha action. However I must admit even though I know music is big in Macross and in all I've seen I think it fits perfectly, a show where they decided to make the music aspect the main story instead of the story happening aside the main story, I don't know if it will appeal to me as much based on the kind of person I am. Not to worry, I'm not letting Mr March there influence me, but I have a feeling the reasons he has for not liking M7 might be some of the same I would find, however in the end I still haven't even tried to watch it, so regardless of my final opinion I will at least try to watch some of it... the question is when I'll get around to it.

It seems I revived that old VF-171 vs VF-19 discussion with a vengeance... but I go away for one night and there is 3 more pages, lol, I'm amazing I can keep up with all these threads (probably because I haven't posted much until recently). I'm just sticking with my theory that the 19 and 22 are still out there probably, but Frontier doesn't have them for whatever reason and we probably won't see them in Frontier, nor do we need to with the sexy VF-25 guarding Frontier's ships. However I do admit I wouldn't mind seeing the 19 and the 22 in shiny new CGI, but I agree with Mr March and others that we probably won't and I can live with that (unless Earth sends a special shipment of non-cannon fodder pilots to help out with a mission or something...). Apart from that, my speculation on the VF-19 and co. is done.

I'll look into finding a good copy of DYRL sometime this week probably (veoh hasn't failed me yet), escpecially now that semester is done and I'm on break somewhat. As for 7, I will probably try to find some episodes again, like I said, it was a technical glitch that kept me from finishing episode 1. However I must admit from reading a large summery, I think from the compendium, that basically explained it in addition to what I've heard here, I'm not sure if it will strike me the way others have. I worry I won't be able to take it seriously with the guitar controlled valkyries and the whole music can restore your life force idea. However I can at least watch 5 or so episodes to try and get used to the idea. I must say though, I'm glad Frontier is making more sense than stuff like that, and I am really enjoying Frontier so far. Truthfully Macross Plus was my induction into official Macross as well (actually I saw Macross II a little before, but I didn't watch less than half of it the first time, then I saw Plus and later II more fully). Also in fact, I haven't really seen the actual SDF Macross in it's original format, I've seen Robotech the Macross Saga, and I've read the main differences so I understand, so in essence I've seen it, but not in actuality.

I would assume Lt. Wilan (I believe that was his name) was taken on board. As to whether he needed medical attention is unknown, however he probably was never meant to be a character of significance, despite giving us a name. Wouldn't that make you the 5th member, seeing as you listed 4 members there?

That is really helpful Mr March, I didn't really know how much of the VF-19 was shown in Macross 7 as I've really only seen half of the first episode and that's it. I've actually been to your site before and I think it is a really nice site with just the right kind of information I tend to look for, all mecha info . As for Macross 7, I in fact have pretty much not seen any of Macross 7. I saw half of the first episode (didn't get to finish it due to the way I was seeing it online), but other than that I haven't seen the show, the OVA's or the movies related. Other than that though I can say I've seen most of all the other Macross stuff, the original series of course (although if you want to get technical I saw the Robotech version of SDF Macross first, I'm one of the ones that started with Robotech, kill me later), Macross II(which wasn't as good, as most people seem to agree), Macross Plus, Zero, and I've been keeping up with Frontier. Actually I've never found the time to actually watch DYRL, but mostly due to not getting around to it. Anyway that's just my little short story there, thanks for the help on the technical differences and such. I would also assume the YF-21 and VF-22 have some cosmetic differences, although I can't see any. The only differences between the YF-21 and the VF-22 as far as I know is the elimination of the Brain Direct Imaging system from the final version.

It's always possible, if so I'd imagine we'd find out this week in ep.7, but I get the feeling since Galaxy is said to be a sister fleet to Frontier than it is not as likely as they are probably very similar (despite people saying Galaxy isn't a dome ship, I don't know why people think that). I would imagine that Earth and Eden both see the use of VF-19's and maybe VF-22's still and some fleets probably do use them, such as Macross 7 and such.

I played VF-X2, but without knowing Japanese, my explanation is not foolproof. What I got form it was you were a pilot in U.N. Spacey and your new squadron is trying to fight off a terrorist organization, but in the midst of this a rebel group that seceded from UNS is getting the terrorists help to overthrow UN Spacey because they believe they have been corrupted or something like that. The game lets you take two different paths at one point, which I've done both, one where your old mentor turns out be in the rebellion and you decide to stick with UN Spacey and fight him, which in the end it turns out the rebel group was right and you killed the only chance of stopping the corrupt UNS. The offical ending is you joining you mentors and together you work to stop the corrupted UNS people who have taken control of Macross 13, your mentor dies and you help destroy Battle 13 and that seems to be it there I believe. Also, question of my own, don't know how newbie it is because I tend to research this stuff for myself, but I'll just ask, what exactly are the differences from the prototype YF-19 and the VF-19 besides that the latter is the mass produced version, is the final product better than the original. My reason for asking is it seems everyone here talks about the YF-19 but never about the VF-19, so I wonder if it isn't because the YF-19 is better than the VF-19.

By looking at what we've seen of the Macross Quarter in ep.6 and the attacker mode ship in the opening, I am 99% certain that that is indeed the Macross Quarter, the head resembles the 'bridge' section, the arms look right (the right arm obviously being the one split open) and the legs can easily be folded back to match the Quarter's engines. Also of note is the two 'shoulder' pieces that are reminiscent of the SDF Macross match pieces on the upper back the Quarter in ship mode. I agree that Fold Dislocation represents a limitation in space fold technology, much like how in Star Trek, the faster you go in warp the higher the power requirements (on the TNG scale anyway) to a point where your requiring large amounts of power just to move even a little faster (of course that is when getting closer to warp 10, which is an impossible infinite speed requiring infinite power). However I think fold dislocation is something that can be overcome with more advancement in technology, but there will always be a limit to how far you can go in a certain time frame I believe.

I too wonder about the 19, by this time it would have been the main fighter for the U.N. Spacey for about 12 to 13 years at least. However we should take into account the apparent change in government as it is now New U.N. Spacey or N.U.N.S. Perhaps the new government didn't want to produce the 19 any further for whatever reason. Regardless we know the VF-171 just came into service in 2058, so it's new. If I were to conjecture, which I am, I'd say the 171 didn't replace the 19, but the VF-25 project was designed to replace the VF-19, and as a result we see S.M.S. is testing out the VF-25 (which I am curious why it is not YF-25 in this case). On this path I believe perhaps the VF-19 is still around, but Frontier simply doesn't have any or doesn't use them. Hey if we're lucky we may see a VF-19 pop in some time to show off how it looks in CG, and if we are really lucky it will be joined by a VF-22 which I believe was only a special forces fighter last we saw it, so it can still be around. Personally I'm not much of a fan of the 171 though, nor the 17, but that's just me. I've never liked the real world F-117 much either (from both an aesthetic and engineering standpoint).

Ok, that one was good, I got a laugh out of that. I tend to not make so many theories, but just let the show progress, but I'd be lying if I hadn't imagined different possibilities the show could take. However anything I imagined up had nothing to do with past series, personally I don't feel the need for this show to rely on the plot of another show. So everything that is the best of Macross then, I was mainly just liking the way you put it, 'kawamori-stuff', I like that. However I do agree with you, when I first saw Macross II I found myself wondering why this wasn't interesting me as much as the other stuff. That was before I really knew much about Kawamori and his involvement, now I do and I can safely say I am a fan of his works now.

Yeah... pass .

Technically we didn't defeat AFOS, it just left to parts unknown and took Sara and Shin with it. What technically constitutes Kawamori-stuff?

You know guys... perhaps we can just say the VF-25 Armored can fly in gravity, because after all this we know it surely can... and just leave it at that. Lets stop this battle, it is getting old. You can always agree to disagree. In the end this debate serves nothing since we do know the armored VF-25 can fly in gravity, whether by the science of you two or the fact that it did it in the show anyway. I'm just trying to resolve this issue as peacefully as possible. Edit: Well Sketchley seems to have beat me to it, we basically said the same thing.

I had thought of that, I was mainly offering the 75% gravity tidbit in aiding how the armored VF-25 is able to fly. I'd assume the engines are running more power to the thrust with the armor (or they output a lot of thrust at standard and don't use the max for a Valkyrie without armor). I could also believe that in 50 years time we could make an armor system out of lighter materials that offer similar or more protection.

Actually if you remember from episode 1, the gravity level on Macross Frontier is only set to .75 G. This could explain why the Armored VF-25 can hover inside the dome without too much problem, that is a lot lighter that Earth gravity. I so rarely post unless I feel I need to say something, maybe I should speak up more often. I've seen the raw and the Gattai sub (didn't bother looking at any others, the Gattai sub gave me a good idea as to what was going on, I don't analyze translation much), and I am really loving this show right now, especially the VF-25 which just looks gorgeous. Eagerly awaiting episode 3.

I agree, I've always liked sleeker jets myself. All my ideas for designs involve something usually looking very sleek. Although for space ships that really isn't necessary and therefor not needed (and I would be contradicting myself in my last post, lol). As for atmospheric or aerospace craft such as the Valkyries are, I go for something sleek because that helps negate air resistance. I believe the boosters on the armored VF-25 are connected to the wings. I believe the boosters have a sleeve or something the wings slide into, but this is all based on observation and screen shots I've taken from episode 1 so it could be something different, but seeing as the wings don't appear to be there in the armored shots, I think that the boosters are simply fixed over the wings.

The Valk can look feminine all it wants. They are all referred to as "she" in the end, even the VF-1. From an Engineering standpoint (being an Engineering student) I love the design of the VF-25. It seems what most people don't like is something aesthetic. The thing with the way it looks though, although the show tries to make it look good in any case, in engineering vehicles like this every part and every curve has a certain function (whether we know what it is or not) and if to make the design work then the vehicle has to have something that makes it ugly then the vehicle will have to be ugly. An Engineer doesn't change a design that works based on whether it looks good or not. Despite all this though, I think the VF-25 is beautiful, but then again, I have an engineering and mechanical mind so perhaps my perception of it is warped a bit.

Like I said, I see it as more of a combination of the VF-1 and VF-19 designs. It has the look and feel of the 19 with a general shape of the VF-1. That's just how I feel about it though, for all I know Kawamori never meant it to be inspired by the VF-1 at all.

Personally I love the VF-25. I do notice it is a lot like the VF-1, but the VF-1 was one of my all time favorites in design. I am an Aerospace Engineering student (focusing on spacecraft) so this kind of thing really is what gets me interested. I can kind of see the VF-25 as a cross between the VF-1 design and the VF-19 in the transformation in some ways. I just like the VF-25 all over now. Before that I was really interested in the VF-22, but now I just can't wait for more episodes of Frontier to see more of this plane. Also, seriously, when do new episodes start?

I can't seem to find it, but what is the date for when the series 'officially' starts, I'd like to know. As for all of this, I can see both ways how Frontier could be connected to Megaroad 1 and Macross Zero. The spiral designs on the Vajra make me wonder if they have a related to AFOS from Macross Zero. There was a lot of mystery left behind with that, it would be nice to learn what exactly the Birdman was. At the same time it could have been the Vajra that caused Megaroad 1's disappearance. There are many possibilities, only time can tell.