Uxi

Uxi, I'm just curious as to why or how you could rate TPM before ESB on this list. But you don't have a question about me ranking Jedi or Clones higher? Or Sith? I must preface by saying that most of he rankings are all "by a hair." I've found all of the movies to be pretty consistent in their element. Good popcorn fairy-tale flicks in a sci-fi setting with bits of mythology assimilated from all over the place.

Hurin, Golgo 13 is doing nothing but baiting you. Right now, I rank Revenge of the Sith # 2. My order of best to worst Star Wars movies: 1) Return of the Jedi 2) Revenge of the Sith 3) The Phantom Menace 4) Attack of the Clones 5) The Empire Strikes Back 6) A New Hope

We should just get a sticky up on this thing already. Planes look ok to me, though probably unnecessarily futuristic. They should have just done a naval variation of the YF-23 or something...

Important to note that the novelizations of the movies ARE canon, as are the screenplays... in increased order of "magnitutde." As far as the EU, it IS official. There is no contradiction that is not irrelevent minutia. Remember LFL's stance that while the movies can be considered a camera on live events, the decreased orders of "canon" are sort of like documentaries, colored by perspective. The rest of the EU is everything from jouralistic articles to tabloids. While some stretch the "truth" (as it were), all of them have some fragment of it. But if it has a legal Star Wars logo on it, it's been screened by the continuity folks at a branch of the Great Plaid One's Empire. Yes, the same ability to ignore a poorer piece of the EU (something by Kevin J Anderson, for example) lets one ignore something in the movies themselves. The distinction between "canon" and "official" is as irrelevent as those who decry the EU.

Yeah. Blue chic is trying to pull her lightsaber up and go out like Conehead... but the difference in Conehead's "success" in beginning to defend himself is probably why he's on the Jedi Council and she's not. The fact that Conehead was in a battle leading a charge and that Hot Blue Chic is walking around with hers might just be a coincidence, tho.

Don't get distracted by minutia. Lucas doesn't care about any of that and neither should you. Though Thrawn also believed the Emperor was driving his forces with the Force. I wouldn't call it Battle Meditation, though.

Well Macek would be very right about Robotech. But he'd be very wrong about the component/origin series.

It's decent, but I'm hoping they have a red herring for the seemingly obvious insinuation that the Cylons have let the survivors get away. Though I've been thinking what the appropriate response would be... that's it, full scale invasion of Caprica. That, or hit the Cylon home world(s). I'm really hoping they'll do something with a new analogue to the "Imperious Leader" and Lucifer more than the whole Pegasus things (which itself shouldn't be good for more than a 2-parter anyway).

Considering Lucas' well known stance with Hollyweird, I don't he gives 2 shits about the Oscars.

It seems obvious to me that Hurin is being baited or there'd be responses to other people. There can certainly be other points of view. You can add 1+1 a hundred times... but if get a hundred different answers, it's likely at least 99 of them are wrong. Now a deceitful bloke like Palpatine might try to confuse a guy under alot of pressure and say "it's 10 in binary..." but unless he's talking to a droid, it's a filthy lie meant only to confuse and distract since people almost exclusively think in decimal. Good Point about the intent of artistic creation, too. People can certainly interpret things differently than the artist. But their interpretation is still wrong, as far as objectivity is concerned.

Are you gonna load up both fighters with full and/or similar combat load? Everything I've seen says that in the real world the F-35 is gonna be a better fighter. The F-16 looks better on paper, when it's not carrying any ordinance... but such a hypothetical is a cripple fight. Let's talk real world scenarios...

Well methinks we should keep any semi-credible debate to in-universe perspective. Lucas' intent is obvious to anyone who cares to research it, but the execution sometimes has other implementations, but a person who wants to find a spade is usually gonna find what they want. I get an entirely different interpretation of Yoda versus Sidious from the novelization than from the movie, for example. If one is looking for contradiction, it can probably be rationalized. Intent towards validation is far more goalworthy IMO. IOW, Yo Golgo 13, can you think of any in-universe corroboration that the Jedi put the Force out of balance? Despite the fact that we have explicit on camera mention that they avoid casual use of the Force? For that matter, what do you have beyond opinion that's even in the Real World ? I'm taking in-universe is Hurin is saying "Lucas said." So far, all you've said is "nah uh!"

Makes sense, though. Most good idea conversions are horrible in the Real World, especially with the "built by the lowest bidder" approach.

So are there any spoilers from season 2 yet?

Widely considered by those with no basis in fact. Butts in seats tells the story of popularity far more than gross adjusted by inflation, which itself tells more than unadjusted gross. Critics are generally full of poo.

Except Luke is NOT in between both sides. He is a JEDI and he clearly rejects the Sith and Palpatine's overtures. Like his father, he balances precariously between the Light and the Dark but he DOES choose the light. Good and evil are not equivalent opposites in Star Wars. The dark side is a parasite, at best, that merely degrades the whole or a cancer that destroys the whole. Besides which, by this inane definition, the Force would be in imbalance at the end of RotJ (One Jedi / Light ( Luke) and zero Sith). The Jedi are Force conservationists. They treat the Force with reverence and manipulate it subtly and even then only when they must because they strive to keep the Force in balance. Witness Anakin's remark to Padme that they're not supposed to use it in a casual manner (to bring fruit from the plate). They surrender themselves to the universe both figuratively and literally and give up their lives in service. The Sith are Force polluters. They don't care how their manipulation of the Force (fate, if you will) affects those around them. They ARE the universe, from their perspective and the rest exists only to serves them. The Sith are CANCER, consuming their host and destroying themselves in the process. It's just a matter of time.

I'm shocked and honored Hurin. I don't think we disagreed so much as we exaggerated our positions a bit to the more extreme opposition. At least I hope you were exagerrating. I know I was at least a little bit. Now start talking about raped childhoods or something before it starts getting mushy around here. Regarding the RotJ Novelization, that fits in as minutia IMO. You could easily add "again" to the met Yoda bit and everything fits. Besides that novel has more than a couple typos IIRC. The rest of it is really good, expanding significantly on the movie and invalidating nothing significant (there is a bit about Obi-wan saying Owen was HIS brother, which was from an earlier draft as Lucas admits in the annotated novelization), but again that's irrelevent and easily corrected by ignoring/altering one word. These things ARE interesting as bits of previous drafts that never made to celluloid. Even if completely true, they don't change ANYTHING regarding the major story arcs. Let's keep our eyes on the big picture and ignore the small stuff to quibble about. We have major fish to fry in discussion yet.

It's all about perspective. Remember the official stance regarding the EU. It's all true... from a certain point of view. The movies can be considered documentaries. The screenplays, novelizations, etc perspectives (yet all "canon."). The non-movie novels, comics, etc. Range from opinion pieces and editorials to interpretations to exagerations to slimey National Enquirer type stuff. All have elements of truth (all "official"). Most of the "contradictions" out there are regarding irrelevent minutia... the rest easily fits under the umbrella of the Certain Point of View. My take on Sidious versus Mace. Mace won. Like a true Jedi Master, he neutralized Sidious' attacks. He was younger and stronger than Yoda and wasn't yet emotionally fatigued by the loss of the other Jedi or physically fatigued by his ordeals beyond the fight itself, from which Sidious would have suffered just as much. The prophecy? It's end was envisioned at RotJ. "It knew" what Anakin's choice would be. It doesn't take away from Anakin's free will if Mace had finished Sidious off (Anakin chooses to NOT intervene or he chooses to hack down Sidious instead). Either way, the prophecy is fulfilled. Another thing I noticed from RotJ. Luke is tipped over to the dark side by a similar motivation to his father. He had chosen to not fight darkness with darkness... until Vader threatens Leia. Danger to Leia tipped Luke right to the edge when he had courageously decided to NOT go into darkness. Danger to Padme is what tipped Anakin to Sidious over Mace.

Why would Owen recognize that protocol droid amongst others? Especially when the old one had grungy plating and the new one has gold plating... Besides which, it's just a droid. It's property like a car or a tractor. Any lingering issues are cleared up with a memory wipe. And Owen has need for a droid that can speak with his load lifters.

Sounds great. Especially the blooper show and The Real World.

The trailer looks half decent. It'd be nice if they put a plot twist that the AI is actually not going "rogue" at all, etc but then it's likely to be another government cabal of some sort. Whether I'll see it or not... depends what else is playing.

Anakin was cared about TOO MUCH. As Obi-Wan reminices at the end of the novelization for Revenge of the Sith, he made excuses for Anakin, covered for him, defended him to the Council etc. He needed to be slapped down more than once along the way and maybe expelled from the Jedi order... but once he began training it couldn't be undone and he could always look to the dark side to pick up where he left off. Qui-Gon may have been right about Anakin being the chosen one, but he probably should never have been trained at all after TPM. The Council WAS right. Anakin was too old to be spared the emotional turmoil that he wasn't disciplined enough to master himself. He should certainly have not been made a Jedi Knight, despite his heroism. And as Obi-Wan admits to Luke in ROTJ, he was wrong in thinking that he could train Anakin as well as Yoda. As he admitted to Anakin on Mustafar, he failed him.

I was impressed by some of the FX sabers I saw for the opening day. Might have to get me one. See if I can find the one with Bad Ass MoFo on it.

Heh, but seriously... CGI Yoda looks MUCH MUCH better for Revenge of the Sith. I'm kinda hoping Lucas will do a full revamp of all SFX for all of the movies to get them all consistent. Particularly, this would include the Revenge Yoda (aged appropriately) for Episode 5, Episode 6, and Episode 1 replacing the puppets. And replace the CGI of Episode 2, as well to match the Episode 3 model. I'd really like to see the deleted scene of Dooku with 2 sabers edited back into the film itself, too. This should really stick in the craw of some raped childhoods.

Heh, now that the bold font rant over an irrelevent point has passed... back to meaningful SW discussion. Yes, murder is murder. Which is to be differentiated from killing in general (particularly self defense, but one could add other qualifiers). In this case, though I specifically had a qualifier that was added in the original post "cold blood." Sheesh.