Keith

he endagered the lives of the actual fighter pilots early on by getting in between the line of fire while they were attempting to fight, forcing them to break and leave themselves open to an attack. Gamlin complains about this for some time. 424536[/snapback] No, he pissed off Gamlin by being an unknown on the battlefield, he never endangered anybody. Gamlin has no one to blame but himself for is own distraction. Didn't the populace, or everyone but the VF pilots of the New Macross 5 fleet get destroyed too? And wasn't the planet Rax also destroyed? (As in the entire planet is no more, not like the limited-to-the-surface destruction of Earth.) The populace was used for Spiritia, the military was used as Varuta soldiers, and the ships were gutted for usable technology. Except the leg missiles. Which were only used in a hasty moment to protect someone else. And got in their way. On the other hand, he DID use himeslf as a shield for civilian targets a few times You'll note no one aside from Gamlin complained about Basara being on the battlefield. He didn't actually get into anyones way, the only shots he blocekd were those of the Varutal. What, you never saw "Rape-inator: Robotic Tentacles of Doom"? I generally assume every possible porn concept has been explored at least once Nope, musta missed that kiddie show The AFOS had also been "stored" with much less care. While the protodeviln were encased in ice, the AFOS was sitting exposed on the sea floor. The AFOS was stored to be found. It was intentionally left relatively out in the open. Once human tech became advanced enough to find it (cyclops radar), it would prove as a test. Chiba used Basara's song for psychological torture on Gamlin. Because Gamlin had a stick up his ass for the first 3rd of the series. He was right along with everyone else singing Planet Dance & Light the Light later on. It's idealistic. Particularly the manner in which it's attained. What's life without ideals? It's called a flat character. One of my major gripes with Macross 7 is that Basara has no character growth, either in "real-time" or backstory. Were he a secondary character, this would be acceptable. But he's not interesting enough to be the lead, and he steals camera time from far more compelling characters. Gamlin and Mylene would've both made far better main characters Gamlin & Mylene were interesting because they were placed there to grow to the point Basara had already been at. As I said, Basara had no conflicts, problems, etc, because he already had his sh!t together from the start. Everyone else was playing catch up. That hardly makes him a flat character. As for backstory, enough was revealed about him to understand him. He's obviously the kind of guy who doesn't speak about himself, some people are like that. Plus there's Kawamori's penchant for mysteries & un-resolved endings. Macross 7 also only pursued one major point. SDF Macross had many concurrent major threads. Some were fully realized, others were truncated or abandoned. And I'd argue that the music angle WAS developed quite adequately in the original series, for the setting it was in. At the end of the series Minmay admits she doesn't have her emotion for singing yet, but she wants to find it. Kamjin throwing culture shock in her face finally woke her up. She wanted to achieve that ideal emotion to share with people. Macross 7 fully realizes Minmay's dream. I also don't see how 7 had any fewer major threads than Macross. And the "corruption" of said infiltrators by the "good guys." Sivil and Gigile were both influenced by Basara far earlier than their companions were. I'd still debate that the shows are from the same mold, though. Gigil especially had some great moments, and definately stands as my favorite Macross bad guy.

nah there were tons of casualties, ya just never hear of any of them since they weren't in the cast 424453[/snapback] Kinyru, Physica, & Gigil were the 3 big main cast deaths. With the implied loss of the populace of the Megaroad-13.

That doesn't prove it was "more" or "as" sophisticated or dramatic as SDF. It did reveal more about Protoculture, but mostly to justify the space monsters. The revelations that directly relate back to SDF is the further explanation about the Supervision Army and the Civil War. I'm still trying to figure out how giant aliens who are freaked out by sex & music is more mature than space monsters in general. You make an awfully large assumption about what I write off... I found the fact that a civilian having a state of the art military fighter that has been customized to be flown using a guitar and that the same civilian was not arrested for flying said aircraft into a military operation, thus endangering pilots, to be "kiddie" as only children would accept that (I won't comment on the Kai's "face" or the Sound Force fighters as that's just redundant). Then you apparently missed the part of the series where all that was explained. Max himself hoping for a solution for the fighting that had gone on sanctioned the project years before. Ray, after his friend Stephen died, retired from the military, & wandered around the universe drunk. He crossed path's with Basara, & came up with the general idea after witnissing his determination. Ray got in touch with Kinryu who had been assigned to the 7 fleet, who in turn got in touch with Max, who apparently also had Chiba chewing his ear off about a similar concept. All things came together, Akusho was attached to City 7 as a training ground, Chiba had the custom VF-19 Kai worked up, and Ray instructed Basara on how to fly. While Basara was a civillian pilot, he was sanctioned in a military Project (Project M Specifically). I also fail to see where anything Basara did wad "endangering" anybody. He had no live ammo, and even in the early stages before he was "effective," he still drew fire away from the other pilots. Any Arguments regarding "faces" is just inane, mecha having humanoid faces, and or having a camera eye make no difference whatsoever, and comes more down to personal preferance. Hell, Gundam's have been running around with Samurai armor masks since the beginning. The same goes for the guitar shaped control stick, big deal, it still uses the basics of a standard control scheme. I found the notion of "giant" monsters grown to wage war is more of a throw back to Dancougar and Mazinger and those types of shows. I found the AFOS much more believable as a bio-engineered weapon than the PD. Thus making Macross 7 aimed more at a "kiddie" audience than not. Nothing you've said here implies anything of a "kiddie" nature. Hell, by that logic, all tenticle rape hentai is "kiddie" because it doesn't feature robots or more standard humanoid aliens? And then you go and claim the AFOS to be more believable, despite its complete & total lack of mechanical parts? None of the powers (aside from possessoin) are anything that wasn't already shown to be possible with already existing Protoculture technology. For all intents & purposes, they're bio-engineered self aware battleships, be them suped up past anything given to the Zentradi. The anti-war sentiment in threaded throughout all the Macross shows, in SDF the sentiment was displayed by showing the devastating affects of wars, not Hikaru flying around shouting into his radio to "Listen to my message!". No, instead you had Hikaru being forced to compromise his ideals in order to protect his friends. A necessary decision given the circumstances, but one that's not necessary in 7, as Basara is someone who doesn't compromise his beliefs for anything, and it just so happens that the technology that exists by the time of 7 means he doesn't have to try. As for the "devastating effects of war," I still fail to see how you're finding more in SDF Macross than 7. Aside from the bombardment of Earth, there really "aren't" more. I fail to see how someone saying "listen to my song," is somehow worse than someone pulling a trigger, & killing someone. As for the "devastationg effects of wars," the point of 7 was to end a conflict without having to have anyone on either side die, it was specifically goal oriented against further "devastationg effects of wars." Unfortunately for your assumption, I don't write off Macross 7, I simply categorize it as a children's show and enjoy it for what it is. I give it no more expectation than I would any other superior animated kids show. Thus your pigeon hole attempt does not apply to me... And the only area where it fails that expectation, is tha the main character tries to motivate his opposition "not" to fight instead of killing them? How again is that more childish? Macross 7 is one of the rare occurances of a main character who isn't unsure of himself, isn't moody & brooding, doesn't have to overcome some major shortcoming, & doesn't compromise himself to suit a situation, instead, he chooses to change the situation. Does that make the show somehow childish? If so, I don't see how. I never made any technical complaints against macross 7. The only ones I could make are the blatantly recycled battle footage and maybe the character design of the twin PD, whatever their names were. The lack of personality in those last two had far more worse to do than their designs, but luckily they don't have enough screen time to be a problem. The only true major difference in tone between the two shows, was that the original series presented an ideal that they hadn't quite achieved, while Macross 7 went that extra length & fully achieved it. And say what you will about recycled launch sequences & explosions, but in 52 episodes, there was not even one clip show. That's almost unheard of even today. Please do go on, Ive become intrigued... 424326[/snapback] Sure, -Bridge Bunnies - Check -Love triangle - Check (several actually) -Abandonment by the U.N. Spacy brass - Check -Ineffectiveness & surviving by the skin of their teeth against a more advanced threat - Check -Enemy infiltration into the civillian populace - Check -Crazy mis-folds - Check -The distinguishing between an "artist & an idol - Check etc. Just about every major & minor theme that was covered in Macross TV is still present in 7.

So will this be related to the aweful 90's made for the USA network cartoon that took place in the Future with yet another "McCloud," but never actually showed anyones heads being cut off?

Hmm, I always thought the western storytelling concept was to do completely unstrung together episode of the week shows for as long as possible until they won't make money anymore, while the Japanese took a more direct beginning, middle, & end stance. I'm glad this guy corrected me

From your comments I gleen that you are saying that Macross 7 is as thought provoking and dramatic as SDF Macross? Comparatively speaking, SDF Macross is far more sophisticated in its story and execution than Macross 7, IMO. However, I enjoyed several aspects of Mac 7 too, just not as many as the first series. Mac 7 to me, is kinda like what Gundam Seed is to many old school Gundam fans. Very popular right now, but not what MS Gundam started out as. 424227[/snapback] Wait, you're saying that Macross 7 isn't as throught provoking, sophisticated, or dramatic as the original series? Unlike the myriad of AU Gundam, Macross 7 "did" maintain the core of what Macross has always been about, while evolving the original concepts presented. Hell, in a rare Kawamori moment, we also got some pretty nice backstory on the original Protoculture conflict, and you know how he loves just leaving things mysterious. The only real arguments against Macross 7 come from those who A: See singing in a cockpit & immediately write the show off, B: See more of an anti-war sentiment in a show they think is supposed to emphasive militaristic battles, or C: See what they construe as "space monsters," not taking into account that they're actually biological evolution of already existing Macross technology, and write it off. And because of that, people such as yourself write the show off as "kiddie," despite the fact that it's far more "kiddie" to have the token G.I. Joe never ending fight. The truth is, SDF Macross had more than its share of goofy moments & bad animation, with nearly any technical complaint you can make against 7 being applicable to it as well. At the same time Macross 7 has more than its share of drama & serious tone. -Big space battles - Check -Max doing his usual thing - Check -Hot alien chicks - Check -Planetary destruction - Check -Transforming robots - Check -Giant aliens - Check -Well written main character deaths - Check The list goes if you'd like.

That makes at least 2 Gundam 0079 cast members who've died relatively young of cancer. Makes you wonder if there was something in the studio.... Apparently he was Yellow in Mospeada too. What a great range of characters.

Ah, but passable translations already exist for the whole series, there's absolutely no reason why they shouldn't be out on a (non-handheld) collection. We were supposed to get the Sega Ages version done a couple years ago, but looks like that fell through. BTW, don't forget there's also a Capcom Classics volume 2 coming out, and we can all finally play the crappy original street fighter again! (well, those of us who don't have psp's).

Maybe the CG studio was holding out with the "good" renders until HG coughed up the money to pay them. Just as the mythical screenings were a ruse to get a licensor, perhaps the final CG will be improved now that the cash exists to fund it. I for one can't wait to see how they make those cat robots crumble apart with modern technology!

Not really, I suspect not many Japanese adults would admit to watching much anime as it is looked down on in society because of the Otaku Killer. However I hear that such notions are waning as the years pass. So you are left with kids who would enthusiastically support a show directed to their demographic. Let's face it Mac 7 is a very good kids show... 423272[/snapback] Psst, 9 & 1/2 anime series are directed at kids, the original Macross series was, and your implication would seem to imply Macross 7 is somehow different in that nature, which it is not.

Who's to say his VF-1S was completely totalled. May have only needed repairs, something that'd be pretty high priority consideirng his rank. As for being Macronized/Micronized, who's to say he wasn't Macronized after the treaty, & before the wedding. A bit of a stretch yes, since he wasn't actually "seen" there during the ceramonies, or anywhere else until the final battle...but hey, why not. And lastly, perhaps Milia didn't come at him with that fury until that particular fight. It's not unreasonable to think that the Metlran would have had ample opportunity to attack the Macross during the Month between Hikaru & Misa's being captured, and then being found on Earth.

That is an awesome scene, though as a first time watcher, I won't ruin future episodes for you, but look forward to episode 26.

Keep in mind, though the ADV DVD's are less prone to "cracking" (hopefully), the Japanese audio on them is inferior to the AnimEigo release. It has a lot more noise in it.

Actually, the only one that doesn't fit is the one of Hikaru & Misa kissing in Britai's ship. All the rest would fit quite nicely, though there'd obviously have to be more animation to feed them in with. A battle between Max & Milia in space would fit during the period Misa & Hikaru were on Earth. And their wedding could fit somewhere durring the preparations to take on the Bodolza fleet, perhaps a bit before their launch. As for Milia she only became mayor within a couple years of the start of 7. Before that she was still Military, and was Gamlin's flight instructer. If you haven't already, check out the "Top Gamlin" short, as aside from showing the above, it's the only place to catch her custom VF-11. She only decided to leave the military & become mayor because she didn't want to be "ranked" lower than Max in the fleet. As mayor of City 7, she was the head of the civilian populace, and (in her eyes at least), held an equal rank to Max. Milia's VF-1 obviously had the 1X-Plus upgrades, unlike the other civillian/ex-military VF-1's in the city. I don't think Max would have been so nostalgic about keeping his though, he seems more like the "trade up to bigger & better technology" kinda guy. He did afterall opt for a new VF-22. Of course when Milia found out, he had to get her one too Dynamite showed a pretty well stocked black market for weapons, so it's not too far out of a notion to believe that those Monster pilots who wanted to keep it pristine could have gotten a hold of some live ammo.

It's not so much "how long have they been in the gunbuster," as it was how long they took to detonate the bomb. Obviously things didn't go according to plan, and only thanks to Noriko's improv did they succeed. The extra time spent however caused them to miss far more "real time" than they had planned. For them however, it would have been a matter of minutes.

There are some quick shots of Max's VF-1S in the "extra" DYRL scenes shown in 7. I love how Kawamori took the opportunity to animate some of the scenes that were cut from the film, and insert them into the episode prologues. Minmei Video does have a quick shot of a fight Max & Milia had in the film, prior to the Macross reaching Earth (when Max was lead of the Skull in Roy & Hikaru's absence). There's also a nice scene shown in a later episode where Hikaru, Max, & Kakizaki (in Valkyries) are attending the actual treaty signing between Global & Britai. As for favorite song, definately a tie somehwere between Holy Lonely Light, Power to the Dream, Totsugeki Love Heart, Sweet Fantasy, Wild Life, & Starlight Dream....it's hard to pick...

Oh come on, Escape from LA wasn't "that" bad. Now the funny thing would be if this, & the Metal Gear movie hit theaters at the same time

Note on folds: There are actually two types shown in Macross. The first being the more commonly recognized point to point fold, where the space between two points is completely folded, allowing instananious travel. The second being more of a long distance fold, where the space between two points is "mostly" folded, but some distance between is travelled, assumedly this is the version where a time dialation takes place. The difference between the two would be the initial fold that took the Macross & South Atalia out into space, while the other would be represented by the longer trip Britai took to meet up with the Bodolza fleet (with Hikaru & gang as prisoners), or Isamu's fold from Eden to Earth.

I wouldn't be surprised if the next project turned out to be a movie, though if it is going to be an OVA, hopefully it'll be more of the 13 episode variety, as the 4-5 episode OVA's always seem too short.

No, but that would be funny. You'll notice in this larger version, you can see his index finger raised nearly the same amount, negating it as flipping anybody off And Milia's VF-22 pops up in 2 more episodes, "Fleet of the Strongest Women," & "Which One Do You Love?' Assumedly, she & Max got them after the Lux incident.

Have they released any preliminary cover art?

Don't forget Gunbuster was also a pioneer in the fanservice department. Didn't it revolutionize admited breast jiggling?

Misa loosing her camera didn't really change anything either. The U.N. Spacy brass already knew enough about the Zentradi to stay firm in their stance. It could also be assumed (retroactively) from Zero, that they may have mis-interpreted the AFOS leaving after firing reaction weapons at it, as a viable tactic for threatening the impending alien threat. Little would they have realized the reaction weapons had nothing to do with it ceasing its attack & leaving.

Maybe it's just being jaded for so many years, but my first reaction was to search your post for sarcasm... Anyway, you'll see as the story goes along just why those first 12 episodes were so repretative, they were important for the long term developement of the story.

Nope, entirely different ending, though I didn't find anything wrong with the Eva ending myself. The Gunbuster ending is more ::::spoiler:::: Stop reading here & finish watching it! :::end spoiler:::