Mercurial Morpheus

Nightspeed.... Why bother...? There are indeed. Though I fail to see the significance outside a reason to say Nunnally survived by Romeyer didn't as they're both shown engulfed in light. Though nice catch. Still, how they could miss the craft after the impact is beyond me, if that's what you're saying. FLEIIA is some sort of transport device it seems, or a matter converter. Why is anyone's guess.

Probably due to none of it being addressed to you. Still, glad to know someone appreciates it. It's not the funnest thing out there. These things either help me, or distort my thoughts so much as to confuse even me as to what I'm trying to convey. The traces of Strawman don't help either. Any thoughts to add, VF25? Though I'm still a bit too perplexed to to be of service. Damn cursed fandom... Score! Welcome to the party Morpheus (though backtracking reveals me wrong about you previously posting in this thread). Sorry for any infamy Big, Bad Mercurial has brought down on you. This thread needs to lighten back up. I guess I'll try to exit it again... @_@;;

"QUOTE (Final Vegeta @ Aug 13 2008, 02:15 AM) * Regardless, it's still better than hear Sheryl's character being described as inconsistent. That's really comes out of nowhere rolleyes.gif Completely agreed. It wasn´t me who said that ( points at Morpheus ). " Really? I didn't know Mopheus had said that. Much less posted in this thread! The funny thing is if anyone had actually read my posts instead of picked at them, you'd find I was actually in agreement with most of what had been just said. Not all of it, but quite a bit. She's an interesting character, even if not the best written. As for the "inconsistent" remarks, it came out of a five month break, cutting of some early scenes, and the obvious rewriting of the character in that timespan giving the impression the character had rather 180ed and hence felt rather erratic. So it hardly came out of nowhere. I never really fell for the cutesy Sheryl. It applied mostly to the early episodes only as I've already said it's mostly been reconciled by recent events. Let's not get into it, I guess. Apologies for the "walls of text", but it's how I write when the conversation arises. Of course provocative statements are going to provoke. Tis natural.

Actually, i kind of like how their voices mesh. They balance each other out well. I've been meaning to try to rip some in show versions. All I can say is that it just felt "off" when i heard it. I can't really describe it other than it felt wrong. It's probably a mix of Ranka's connection (even Alto was taken aback when she militarized it, a feeling I shared and thought spoke volumes about Ranka's development) and my fondness for it's somewhat solitary original. Tis all. I actually did like how you summed up Sheryl's perspective. Though i honestly thought they probably did it for the heck of it given the following scene (singing about how "that little cutie's an alien" wouldn't quite fit. Though it would be rather mocking).

Probably not, as this has nothing to do with Ranka. Actually, that was the definition of eloquence. Nice.

Wow. You're still dwelling on the basest meaning of a line in my first of now four posts explaining what I meant by it and how you were misinterpreting it as some reflection of my character. I'm surprised you haven't done a tirade on the second part of "so-so personality" (meant here as a love/hate sort of thing). The main issue is that you apply it's context in a far more general and spitful way than intended, and despite explaining it more fully, continue to dwell on it and twist my words against me. It's vaguely strawman. I've explained that it's in the same context of how Mike_s has it. Enjoying seeing the reversal of fortunes, or in my case, the shattering of her mask. The situation is how it is partly to her own actions,m so it's a comeuppance to it, one even I admitted was a bit harsh. I liked how the situation caused a truer her to appear. You took it in the base way of it meaning her personality. That I like seeing a proud woman being cast down. It's not the case, especially since I don't even see her that way - for the last time. It's simple magnuskn. You're line "I don't feel threatened by strong women..." and "don't feel that they should be put in their place" implied you felt I did. If you can't see how it could be interpreted as it was, you don't understand the shear flexibility of english text and reading comprehension. Like I'd explained before, it reads much more generally than in a single character context, hence my need to explain that my line had nothing to do with how you were interpreting it. Had you simply said, "I love strong women and felt Sheryl didn't deserve this", it would've been different. Even the "I did disagree with the "putting her into her place" quote you yourself said, because that is an attitude which I personally do not share and it that particular case even strongly dislike." is off as I've repeatedly said the statement has to do more with her mask, her false nature, her actions, not her "strong" personality. You state it as me saying I don't like her because she's confident or something (which, given recent events, she's not). You're hinging everything on choice of words instead of context. Words which were also uttered in closing, in a light thread and were not meant nearly as seriously as you make out. Heck, words I just typed that came to mind, and weren't really put down with any deep meaning. It's not like A cried for joy to see her in the rain. I was mostly apathetic, which drew me to the conclusion that I felt the situation wasn't as unfair as to warrant my usual "poor suchandsuch" response I usually have (I was a wreck at the end of CG 18 for example). It's all in how they've written her, and how it's sort of kept me from sympathizing with her like I should have by now. In other words, take it with a frickin' grain of salt. (of in your case, a salt lick) . Interesting, though i fail to see the baring, as I'm like you, not your friend, and even said so in the post you malign. Hmmm.... had I used the words "oh how the mighty had fallen" or described it as a "fall" instead of "in her place", would you have calmed down? Describing it as "faltering" seems not to irk you as much despite it really being no better. Nor does it fit as well. Perhaps "reversal of fortunes" or an outright "seeing her mask broken". Don't know what a smiley means, eh? It's a joke, reflecting merely what I simplified as the difference in our views. I know it's deeper than that, as I've said mine is deeper than you give me credit for. I said I liked her strong personality, but I am to be faulted if I don't like how far see tends to take it? It's a matter of taste I suppose. She can be a bit too brash and tactless. I also don't see her as being so mature like others state her to be. "sign of a strong personality" or no, they're not the only signs, so saying I dislike such in no way means I dislike her confidence. Geez. it was a joke on how you apparently sniped Mike_s, and her saying she'd double posted, when the post above her was yours. Hence my humor in saying if you're secretly the same person. In this case, Two Face. Enjoy your talk with Final Vegeta. I need to move on to CG discussion (like hell that'll happen, I know).

What greater tension than that amongst fans? But yeah...

It's either or deep significance, fun on the makers part, a typo, or them messing with our heads. I vote a combo of 2 and 4.

Now who needs to lighten up? Seriously though, it's just a comment. It's not like I attacked the guy, nor refused him his right to say it. Why disparage me for saying I think he gives it too much credit for such a small snippet? Especially since I don't really agree? Why are we arguing this? I said it was Ranka's in that she has the connection to it. I know she didn't write it. But that's like saying Sheryl's songs aren't hers because she probably didn't write them either, and most aren't even as personal as Aimo is to Ranka. It's been passed to her as you said. So Sheryl singing it sounds a bit wrong, and it honestly didn't sound like much of anything given it's 2 second length. It's like I said, May'n drawling out the words a bit. Maybe it's "Sultry" or "bluesy", and even "mournful" or "solitary", but it's not much of anything, especially in use to comparing singers. It's just an eyecatch. You've given it more meaning than probably intended. Oh yeah. Case in Point then, given how little it stuck to mind.

Um, no you weren't. You were misinterpreting me. I said I was somewhat interested in her downfall as she hid behind a mask and it was interesting to see it stripped from her. The annoyance part was her slipping it back on in front of Michel and Klan despite it already being broken, reminding me of the side i don't like about her. The dishonest, weak side. The part after that was an observation on how that should have made the following scene sweeter, but the phrasing, I thought, implied that it really hadn't. You took that as I am threatened by strong women and enjoy seeing them being broken simply because I didn't sympathise with the character and felt she sort of had it coming (which is exactly what the writers had set up). This paint's me as women hating, and frankly begs the question of why I should bother addressing you in the first place. I only do so on the basis that's it's a misunderstanding. Hence my "treatise on how I'm not 'mysoginistic'". So you like the inconsistent character and stuffy attitude as that's what i hadn't liked. ^_^To each their own. Well, i can only work with what you give me. i do agree somewhat on her barriers, though it's more of she was open, but in her way sort of thing. She's been plenty forward with Alto. Mike_s, obsane is what you described, and it's a word I'd just learned myself. I also said you weren't. Though rereading my post, it seems my fatigue didn't catch the mistyping. Which should be obvious if the sentence were to make sense (how could complaining about fans than talking to said fans help?)I believe the first like was supposed to be a "non-". i must've reworded it as i typed and not caught it. Apologies. And what double post? You're not magnuskn too, right?

I voted both. Each has their qualities. Megumi's been impressive for someone new. Though I wish she'd get more songs. Each does their song well, though I prefer Ranka's What 'bout my Star to Sheryls. Though mainly due to May'n getting rather shrill in it. As for Aimo, it's ridiculous to comment on May'n's version on so little, but it felt off. The songs appeal is in part to it's a capella and rough nature. It's sweet, but sad. I think I even prefer the a capella version. Though the others are good too. The battle version has a good beat despite the screwed up feel. Was that sakamoto in 14? That was nice, refined, but still with it's own soul. Like a embellished Ranka. Besides, all May'n did was drawl on it, and it didn't sound right to me. Calling so little "sultry blues" is an overstatement. That, and it's so Ranka she has no business saying the name, much less singing it. It'd be like Ranka sing Diamond Crevasse. I like the new opening. The second endings okay.

All this "Ranshe looks like Sheryl" talk had me notice this. Excuse me if this has been mentioned, but Ranshe>RanShe>Ran(ka)She(ryl). Coupled with the supposed Sheryl looks and Ranka's hair color. Maybe it's an animator's joke or outright laziness. Though for now, Sheryl's a waif/experiment. Ranka probably too. I've probably just fueled another page or two for you, Mr. Togo. Mike_S, I think he's just having a little fun. Why so serious?

Oh, I like characters that are interesting. Virtues aren't everything in a character. She need not be an angel for me to like her. I was always greatly more into Page than Monroe. Heck, didn't I say I think my favorite is fast becoming the rather wicked and cruel Grace? The Joker was more awesome than Batman, though on repeat viewings I'm drawn just as much to Harvey Dent (a woefully overshadowed Eckhart). It's just that I also prefer ones I can relate to, especially if they're trying to play for sympathy. It must be believable. So giving a confident, sassy, brash girl a kitsch nature suddenly, and then a sad background and trying to make you feel for her when even she doesn't want you to requires special work that so far Frontier has done a mediocre job at. I'm not saying she should have stayed cold, as than I'd probably be laughing at her misfortune, but there was something off about her in the early episodes that just hurt her credibility, so I couldn't relate to her much. Something that fan gushing annoyingly augmented (though discussions with the like obsane fans like yourself do help, otherwise I probably wouldn't give her much thought). All i know is that I didn't really like her much at all, but for some reason, I didn't hate her either. So I don't care much for her character, but still like her. It's weird. Maybe I just don't like her bewildering overpopularity despite her shoddy writing and the presence of better early defined characters. I can't put my finger on it. So maybe I just find her interesting. I've said in the past the Sheryl is more my usual type, and normally I'd be all over her in moments like the one in your avatar. But there are things I don't like about her that's kept me from wrapping myself around her (same as my usual avoidance to Ranka types keeps me from outright supporting her as well). I like her sass, but not when they're trying to play up some kid in a candy store and than switch to hard exterior again. While I usually like duality like that, it felt more like inconsistency or forcing likability than the depth they were going for. Her character feels much more like the one they established in episode one than the one we got in most of the episodes (the nice/notsonice "but I'm Sheryl" one that bounced a little too much). So I mostly blame the execution, the viewing schedule, maybe my own inattention (repeat viewings of scenes don't paint hewr so poorly for some reason, be it hindsight or lack of initial attentiveness) and the shear phenomenon of her popularity despite such. Reading about how great she is when I saw a okay character just didn't mesh right. So it's Alucard syndrome, just not as bad or undeserved (stupid polls). Though as i reconciled that, there was the triangle. I just don't like her underhandedness ( especially the whole invite Alto to Gallia IV despite knowing Ranka's plans). Aggression is good, but being Ranka's friend and all, that was outright low. Ranka is a bit more generic, but she has that "little queen" curve ball going for her. She's also got the whole "New Sheryl" thing to. So it's a nice complementation. I also like her shift in recent episodes. I agree that Sheryl's more interesting, but Ranka's much more consistently written and developed. Sheryl felt a little "what are we going to do with her" early on. It's late so pardon if I'm not making much sense or babbling. Hopefully no more curveballs will get sniped as I post this, so I may either sleep or trudge through the latest Geass than sleep.

Ummm...okay...&_&

You misinterpret me. Insultingly so. You practically paint me as misogynistic, especially on suggesting that I feel women need to be weak and that I'd prefer that strong woman be brought down a few pegs from some male need for dominance". It couldn't be further from the truth and you defame me. I'm not "threatened" by strong women, and very much prefer them. Though it's always nice to see a softer side (which felt forced in Sheryl due to some shoddy early writing and a five month gap, but has balanced a bit). My problem with Sheryl's personality isn't so much due to it being a confident one in that as it is often more of an obnoxious, spoiled, over-confident one. Even more so in that it's also a mask, one she's rather dependent on, and she is actually rather weak. It's being put in her place for this fact that is somewhat satisfying, not seeing a strong woman being broken as you suggest, as it's not the case here. Her background has made this personality understandable, hence she's become more likable to me, and identifiable, if not so much sympathetic (or is it the other way around?). She was nothing, so she had to believe she was something through her own perseverance. Being "Sheryl Nome" supposedly had to mean something that makes her superior, because Sheryl Nome crawled from nothing to possess everything through her own shear will. Even though this is a lie, and everything's been handed to her on a silver platter. A fact she can't acknowledge, even complete with silver spoon in mouth. She does know this however, hence she worked hard, even if it was ultimately unnecessary, to make the lie true. Having Grace throw it in her face shatters this and she's gone back to what she truly is, Nothing. If that's not utterly delicious, I don't know what it. It's also way more identifiable than the bigshot who gets it all, knows it, sports an unflatteringly blunt attitude mixed with coy attempts at being cute, and is supposedly sexy because of it. I'll probably like her this way much, much more the second time through, as such revelations make earlier foibles much more bearable and her more likable, at least in an understanding way. She's rather unlikable at times in her earlier full of herself moments beforehand. For now, the earlier damage appears to still be done aI just can't sympathize too much with her at the moment given her earlier bleh nature and reading elsewhere on how she supposedly made the show. How she acts in the next episode may be the decider, but so far they've chosen to make a fairly unsympathetic character into one and it's not really working. She's better, but I won't cry for Sheryl Nome. Maybe the girl that came before though. That's the true gain here. I suppose I'm just the rare type that wasn't convinced by the vaunted episode six and turned off by her triangle dealings. The real character began only a few episodes ago, so I'm still deciding. I agree that she certainly needed "good characterization" as she had plenty of the mediocre type early on, and fans loved her for it for whatever reason. So basically her trying the put the mask back on after it was battered and broken right before it outright shattered annoyed me a bit as it was classic of the more unsavory aspect of her that keeps her from endearing herself to me. That obstinate, stubborn adherence to the outer self she feels she must maintain. Hence it wasn't all that painful and sort of nice as it was very much the real her. She's [finally!] interesting, but I can't feel for her yet. Though even Ranka's finally striking a cord with me. As much as I love this show, I've never had such a hard time putting my finger on the characters, and characters are my main reason for liking anything. I like Ranka and Sheryl, but I'm not to emotional on them yet. I also love how you supposedly love her for her strength yet say she'll win Alto by being in a time of need, hence by weakness. Sort of contradictory if you ask me. Moving on, anyone else take amusement that the text of "Operation Cinderella Horn" is the EULA for Panopticum Array? Pardon if it's been mentioned already. Pardon the lack of reply to whomever may have sniped me. Oh and to be clear, yes I do like Sheryl. I just read her differently and it's something of a love/hate relationship. Aw screw it EDIT: Since it's Mike_S and cordial, I'll make the edit. It's an okay theory, but you're right that there's not just two factions. Like the Ranka/Sheryl fans like me, and the Love/Hate Sheryl fans like I think I am. Something good, eh? Like becoming a decent character deserving of the unabashed praise she gets? Who knows? Though if you're implying Alto will fall for her directly because of this, then again, I find the contradiction amusing Why the preference for Alto going the pity/sympathy route if you prefer the "strong woman" bit. I personally hope it triggers a more personal attitude shift. One more believable and realistic than the coy one from before mixed with the mask. One not afraid to show weakness. There's no shame in that. Then I can see Alto going for her. Though they're fairly even at this point with Sheryl having a slight lead as Alto feels more responsible for Ranka rather than friendly. Granted the revelations make those understandable, but it felt forced by the creators at the time. Probably why I didn't fall for it most of the time (7 was the best I think).

Possibly, though you'd think conversely that some Sheryl fans would hate seeing that happen, thus vote negatively. The Ranka fan in me was happy in what she did, having nothing to do with Sheryl either, so that's not entirely true. I would've liked a shout-out to Sheryl though. Though I'm still between the two (though with my strange apathy during the breakdown scene, I must admit a somewhat stronger character fondness for Ranka apparently. I again blame early episodes and ardent fandom for damaging Sheryl I suppose. I just can't fully connect to her. I never liked her tactics either. ; Though maybe it was the whole "I'm Sheryl" bull right before. I love confidence and the whole "I'll be strong" mask, but it mildly got on my nerves there. Heck, a Ranka fan should be happy Sheryl gets developed. That, and her fall is somewhat satisfying from a Sheryl fan perspective. She sort of had it coming, though the death part was a touch cruel. So the Ranka fan was pleased with her continued new-found selflessness, and the Sheryl fan was pleased in her being put in her place as well as annoyed by her so-so personality (which I suppose should add to the former). as a warbird fan, I love the nose art. Though I still would've preferred it to be Sheryl. Though Grace is continuing to become increasingly more deliciously evil. Coupled with Inoue's voice (always fun to have miss sweetness and light in such roles), she's definitely threatening to steal Ranka and Sheryl's spot on my favorites. Even Klan won some points this time around. The new opening is sweet. The Sheryl "Aimo" eyecatch just sounded absolutely wrong though. The Ranka/Vajra connection continues to intrigue. I liked the touch of her singing the real version afterwards.

As will K-lite. They're both good choices. K-lite just doesn't have the viral marketing. GG plays perfectly on my K-lite setup. Though let's not start that silly debate. As for conversion discussion, it makes me glad I can just hook my laptop to my TV with VGA. Simple, quick, perfect quality.

Timing shouldn't be much of an issue if I merely edit grammer and names. Though in the rare case that I know there's a bigger problem, then maybe. I don't know much Japanese, so it shouldn't be too big a concern. I'd just started ripping them myself too.

Lunar and GG are pretty much par in my opinion. GG might have an edge since they have the CC at their disposal. I like Lunar's phrasing better at times.

Ah, sorry i wasn't able to get to ripping them properly. I was trying to correct the errors in them as well. Namely the horrid name problems. Is it too late to do any correcting?

Tempting, but I believe it's actually Pineapple upside down cake. Someone should bring one and set it beside a nice big serving of Pine salad. Strawberry Pie for those that survive!

I agree with that last sentiment. As I said before, the MGS parody on your site is very true about the whole, "he who releases first, wins". i know plenty of fans who don't even care much if things are highly accurate, as long as it's fast and makes reasonable sense. After all they're at the complete mercy of the group and know not if they mess up as long as it's not obviously out of left field, so they'll grab whatever is put out first. Even if it's not who made it the first last time. Some do adhere to one group though, I being one of them within reason. However, it really does seem to be a case of fastest consumption possible. Though i hope it's the better subs that have the staying power. I'm rather particular in that I value the accuracy of a sub most, so in a project like this I look for opinions and comparisons and try to go from there. I also prefer not to switch groups mid-stream for consistency and archive sake. I get the feeling I'm in the minority there, though at least some people have loyalty to one group. The only time I do so is if another group is hands down better (which is often never the case as it can be episode to episode), if something's just off about the group and another corrects it ( say honorific use or or phrasing) or if I feel that two groups are par enough that even I can go with the one that releases first (like on S1 of Code Geass). In this case, I'll watch either GG or Lunar, as both are pretty good from what I've seen. So lately I've been watching GG, but grabbing Lunar as well to possibly archive, as I still watched the majority through them. I haven't decided yet, as a lot of good groups are handling the show. As for speedsubs, I abhor them, but it depends on if it's actually the case. GG sounds like it's simply being a well oiled machine that allows such speed. My definition of a speed sub is one released mere hours from the raw, by some group I've never heard of that hasn't done the previous 16 episodes and probably skipped QC and the finer points of encoding. Sort of how I'm not touching the Nightspeed Code Geass subs. I have no probably waiting if the waiting's worthwhile.

Ah yes. I think it was in episode one or two. It might have popped up again on the Macross. Good catch. Though I think that's the only instance of it. Every other time it's -ay, like on the poster, and her autograph, and has been so ever since if memory serves. So despite that early instance, I think the other version is fully adopted, even if -ei makes more sense (along with Fokker, which I've not seen a fansub get wrong). Though if everything on screen were canon, someone in missile distro loves Budweiser. Speaking of the Robotech spelling, did anyone else find it amusing that they kept her name asian order in it. It's both a nice touch, and horribly confusing for those not in the know. EDIT Wow, everyone's awake, as I'm getting sniped. It does change at times. It's the nature of old shows. The only difference is, I'm pretty sure they settled on the spelling later in the series, and it's the DVD spelling (which also throws out the odd Zentradi [itself romanized different ways like Zentraedi, Zjentradi, etc] spellings like "Vritwei" which is apparently canon over "Britai"). isn't that right, Guvava? Personally I prefer Millia, as it's an actual name I've heard of, rolls off the tongue better, and differentiates from Robotech's overdone "Miriya" and Chris Beverage's daughter... (why i know about that is anyones guess sincew I'm not fond of AoD). I never knew about Jan/Yang. Thanks for that one. Oh, one more thing. The most confusing spelling I've ever seen concerns her last name. At least a handfull of groups have depicted it as "Linn". I assume this has to do with Chinese romanizations again? I don't believe there's ever been any artwork to support such a spelling, and it just looks odd.

I figured it had to do with that. I'm not offended, it's just that I've only ever seen the spelling "Minmei" on Robotech products. Just about every official art piece I've seen (including her autograph) uses "Minmay", and it's the official spelling on the US DVDs and Macross Compendium. So I'm always amazed that every fansub always goes with the Robotech only "Minmei".

I appreciate the reply, creamyhorror. Really I do. Thanks. One question on the recent sub, why the Robotech spelling for Minmay? I noticed even Lunar did it. I get that's it's more "chinese" looking, but all the official sources have the Macross spelling as "-ay". Sort of how it's "Focker" instead of "Fokker" (though in that case I prefer the later since it's an obvious reference to the bi-plane manufacturer). Yet I rarely see fansub groups adhere to it (Central had name changes galore in their M7).