Duke Togo

I missed it, what exactly blew up in my face? And just because you state something doesn't mean anything I've said is instantly wrong. I said it before and I'll say it again, if the answer was that clear, this wouldn't be an ongoing discussion in the Star Wars fan community. I stand by my argument.

Yes, now you understand it. Anakin wipes out the Jedi, then the Sith. Balance is achieved. Luke is literally the heir to this.

And you completely miss the fact that nowhere in the Saga is the truth behind this clear. Lucas himself has changed his story several times on the subject. The only answers generally come from the EU (which generally support my argument, which is amusing, because I don't really like the EU).

Yes, that's me, and nowhere in that post did I state that Luke is the one who brings balance to the Force.

Roll your eyes all you want, but its true. Should we start involving the so called "Dark Jedi" in this discussion? You can sit and read through not just what little we have said here, but the pages upon pages of discussions and articles elsewhere, and come to the conclusion that there is no conclusion. Otherwise, this wouldn't be an ongoing debate.

Um, no its not. Where the hell did you get that from?

I've spent some time now poking around other message boards, reading discussions on this topic, and I have come to the conclusion that Lucas farted all of this up. There is no one answer here, no right or wrong answer. The truth is, its unknown. The only answers you will really get are from the EU, which isn't canon. Too many contridictions.

I don't see how this proves your argument.

Paul F. McDonald isn't exactly an unknown in Star Wars fandom.

Actually... http://www.space.com/sciencefiction/movies...med_000510.html

Its a bit of both, I think.

I wanted to add this... its easy to ignore what Lucas said 20, 15, 10, and even 5 years ago, because there has been more Star Wars since then. The story evolved.

You don't get it. The Force doesn't know good from evil. I think the Space.com quotes do a better job explaining this than anything I could say. I am going to stand with that as my side of the argument, and I guess this won't be settled until we get to hear the Episode III DVD commentary track.

I found these great bits from Paul F. McDonald of Space.com:

This thread is VERY fay.

No, but thanks for playing. And you play off the Jedi as this group of innocents, while the Prequels show that obviously to not be the case. They are more concerned with their dogma and their place in things than the will of the Force. And the Sith don't use the Force to further their own agenda, the Dark Side of the Force controls them. Once you start down the Dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny. Once you give in to the Dark Side of the Force, you become bent to its will, not your own. I won't go as far to say the Prequel Jedi are corrupt, but they are certainly out of touch with the Force. Qui Gon is considered a maverick and a rebel because of his beliefs, but he himself is redeemed at the end of Sith, as Yoda recognizes the mistakes they made, and the wisdom of what Qui Gon believed in. You play down "the Living Force" because you are stuck in the Original Trilogy. The Force is not good or bad, it is the Force. Its gray, and there is where the balance lies. What Obi Wan and Yoda teach Luke in the Original trilogy are the teachings of Qui Gon.

For someone who is ignoring me, you sure are putting out alot of text in response to me. Care to add some substance to that? Or are you admitting that you're full of crap? You are ignoring me, and you just responded to me again. Who is full of crap? So, explain this to me. How is the Force "in balance", if only the Light Side is left? That seems fairly one sided to me.

For someone who is ignoring me, you sure are putting out alot of text in response to me.

Of course you do. The FX 5200 is a poorly rated, low end video card. That's not to say you can't do decent graphics on a budget, that's just a really shitty card. If I remember well the FX5200 was comparable to a high end GeForce 3 I don't know, were the GeForce 3's crap, too? Seriously, though, the FX 5200 is considered to be a fairly poor video card. From performance to cooling, its gotten some pretty bad reviews.

Of course you do. The FX 5200 is a poorly rated, low end video card. That's not to say you can't do decent graphics on a budget, that's just a really shitty card.

And we've had 2 movies come out since then. Just because you don't want to acknowledge these movies, doesn't mean they aren't real.

Okay, for like the fifth time. . . Or, in other words: A properly trained Jedi is mindful of keeping the Force in balance. He does not affect the balance of the Force. We're not talking about the number of Force users on each side, but how the Force is used. In other words, you're still wrong. The Jedi put the Force out of balance as well. No matter how much you don't want the Prequels to be real, they are.

The Empire Strikes Back did very poorly in its critical reviews. They hated it. Now its widely considered to be the best film of the Saga. Go figure.

BTW, Star Wars is number 2 all time in adjusted dollars. Number 1 is actually Gone With the Wind.

Or, it could be what George Lucas said it was. That reference by Palpatine doesn't have to have any relation to Anakin's birth. Now, I could see the need to assign it that meaning if it had been mentioned with no obvious purpose. But it already serves as the plot device that motivates Anakin to consider the Dark Side. It doesn't need to serve two purposes. And, according to Lucas, it doesn't. I have to agree with you here, but its too late. They'll debate this 5 ways to Sunday no matter what anyone says.