Duke Togo

Not only that, ship design, mecha design, all Vajra inspired. You see the cannon on the backs of the lobsters, you see their capital ships split open to fire, and you think, hey, these must be made by the Protoculture, but the truth is something totally different. Of course, my question still stands, where were the Vajra when the Stellar Republic was being ripped apart by civil war? They don't seem to shy away from conflict.

Indeed. For those who still lurk, thank you for all of your time and effort. You guys did a great job and I think I can speak for all of us when I say we truly do appreciate it.

Talk about problems with reading comprehension. Never once in these publications are the Mardook referred to as the creators of the Zentradi. Not once! He is assuming, that is his guess. It is his opinion. And he states, "Had you actually read my posts, you would know that I have taken great care to remind people that what I am presenting is a theory." But this statement, "At several different points in Entertainment Bible, the Mardook are referred to as the creators of the Zentradi." IS FALSE. Not once is this said. He is not presenting this to you as a theory, he is stating this as a supposed "fact" to back up his assumptions. Anyway, continue on with playing "what if? with Macross II. You can come and get me when you guys start posting up Metal Siren pics. I like me some Metal Siren!

The subs are out, this question is answered. Heck, it was answered before the subs came out. The Protoculture revered, and perhaps even worshiped the Vajra. They copied much of what they saw of the Vajra.

I think you need to watch the series again. I think its quite clear that he never had any true feelings for either of them. His love was for flying, that was his passion, that meant everything to him. I don't see why this ending is so shocking to anyone.

But how? There seems to be a big chunk of information missing here.

I think one thing that bothered me about Frontier is that Macross 7's animation and art was far more consistent episode to episode than Frontier's. If they were to go back and reanimate all of 7's combat sequences using CG, would I still call Frontier the best animated of the 3 series? I don't know. Also, the original SDF Macross, when not being outsourced, had some brilliant sequences and gorgeous art, all hand drawn.

You forgot Grace. But is she really dead?

Yes, you are right. Multiple screen shots and over 20 years of Macross canon totally fail in the face of Zinjo's opinion! We're beating a dead horse here. This was amusing during the multiple rain delays last night, but this discussion has long since lost its appeal. Wake me back up when the Chronicle is finished and the Compendium is updated.

I agree. Here we have this disabled Zentradi (war veteran?) who has his own Macross, his own Skull Squadron, and dreams of seeing Minmay.

Are we just going to ignore his line of dialog in episode 24, where he says, "Soon... Soon I'll be able to meet you"?

Well, that still leaves us with the big question of why they went from nicey-nice with Nome and the 117th fleet to destroy all humans?

"Super Dimension Fortress" does not sound like a fleet configuration to me. Unless we want to start playing engrish games.

Ah yes, but that doesn't explain how she turned the Vajra against the humans. In one flashback, Brera seems to imply that Ranka caused the attack.

Have you seen DYRL or Plus? Or Zero, for that matter?

I wonder why they give some names and not to others. Its very inconsistent.

Global-04 LOL

You know, the Global cannot be the Macross-04, because that designation belongs to the New Macross Class vessels. I don't know why I didn't remember that.

So the others are just an error in the animation?

Is this in the anime, because I don't remember it? I don't know how I missed this.

Because the plot is silly and the characters are kinda lame. But the emulators idea is kinda cool, and there are some pretty sweet mecha designs to be seen. All that said, Kawamori has done him damnedest to work II concepts into the franchise.

Ugh, I don't want a retelling. They cut out so much of the story as it is to cram it into 25 episodes. You cut anything more, and its just a mecha-fest.

Like what has been canon for over 2 decades.

Back in 1997, maybe...

Whatever you want to believe, Zin. Nevermind it actually says "Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-0X". Never let the facts get in the way of Zin!