Maluk Posted March 16, 2004 Posted March 16, 2004 I've been thinking about this, since the Zentraedi's and Meltrandi's are not from Earth, their mecha and battleships must be made out of some compound element unknown to Earth-people. It must be made out of something like metal. Anyone got any ideas or does it still remain a mystery. Quote
Anubis Posted March 16, 2004 Posted March 16, 2004 Could still be steel or titanium or at least similar to what we use. The riddle of steel is not limited to earth. Granted the Zentradi's materials were of a very high quality given the length of time the ships operate without any maintenance or overhaul. We likely studied in great detail the composite materials the SDF-1 was built with as part of the OT package of goodies. We probably had a good deal of knowledge into their type of constuction materials by the time they arrived. Quote
Boxer Posted March 16, 2004 Posted March 16, 2004 (edited) I had assumed that the Zentreadi ships had very thick outer hull armor plating, perhaps made of an advanced form of Titanium or an entirely new alloy or metal. Just because it isn't on earth doesn't mean it doesn't exist. We probably had a good deal of knowledge into their type of constuction materials by the time they arrived. The Materials for the Supervision army yes, but I assume earth didn't have any knowledge on the Zentreadi or Protoculture manufacture methods or armor creation until the UN spacy captured and repaired the factory sattelite. Edited March 16, 2004 by Boxer Quote
Aurel Tristen Posted March 16, 2004 Posted March 16, 2004 The Zjentohlauedy relay on more organic materials while the Meltohlaeundy rely more mechanical materials/systems in their ship and mecha construction... (DYRL) The Supervision Gun Destroyer that became the Macross (TV series) was made of "hyper-carbon". According to MAT (Chiba, et. al), the VF-1 is made of special metal [composite) (processed/recreated by Dyna-Metal Company ?) That is unofficial of course.... as Egan has pointed out. We now know of something called SWAG energy converting armor.... with the VF-0 and other VFs. Quote
azrael Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 We now know of something called SWAG energy converting armor.... with the VF-0 and other VFs. But that's armor. What they want to know what it's actually made of... Quote
Aurel Tristen Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 (edited) We now know of something called SWAG energy converting armor.... with the VF-0 and other VFs. But that's armor. What they want to know what it's actually made of... "hyper carbon"* and/or space metal(s) From anaylizing OTM, a new company (Dyna-Metal) new made OTM material composite armor from these space metals in space-mass producing them. (from MAT text/unofficial) * from DYRL dialogue Anyone ever heard of 'Warmolium'? ; ) Edited March 17, 2004 by Nanashi Quote
Boxer Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 The Zjentohlauedy relay on more organic materials while the Meltohlaeundy rely more mechanical materials/systems in their ship and mecha construction... (DYRL) Ah, forgot about the organic part. Maybe I filed that in my mind under Robotech-only ideas... Ug. And that was apparent too.... Oh, speaking of mechanics, are the Meltran soldiers mechanically inhanced? I gathered that from your site Nanashi, can you clarify it? (and might as well say what armor they are made of, if any ) Quote
Aurel Tristen Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 The Zjentohlauedy relay on more organic materials while the Meltohlaeundy rely more mechanical materials/systems in their ship and mecha construction... (DYRL) Ah, forgot about the organic part. Maybe I filed that in my mind under Robotech-only ideas... Ug. And that was apparent too.... Oh, speaking of mechanics, are the Meltran soldiers mechanically inhanced? I gathered that from your site Nanashi, can you clarify it? (and might as well say what armor they are made of, if any ) We all know of the imfamous term "Clash of the Bionoids". Its not really a made up thing that was magically pulled out of the air. Not too many people know this, but according to the Macross the Movie "Gold Book" text, the Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy are Bionoids. The genitically engineered warriors created by the Protoculture to fight their proxy wars against each other (factions of the Stellar/Galactic Republic). The Meltohlauens are synthedic bio organisms. [Try to] Read the following: http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat...amiz_fleet.html http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat...k_laplamiz.html Quote
F-ZeroOne Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 (edited) Didn't someone point out a little while ago that whatever they're made of, it tends to blow up really easily...? Edited March 17, 2004 by F-ZeroOne Quote
Boxer Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 We all know of the imfamous term "Clash of the Bionoids". Its not really a made up thing that was magically pulled out of the air. Not too many people know this, but according to the Macross the Movie "Gold Book" text, the Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy are Bionoids. The genitically engineered warriors created by the Protoculture to fight their proxy wars against each other (factions of the Stellar/Galactic Republic). The Meltohlauens are synthedic bio organisms. I didn't know about the Bionoids part, but I did know both races were genetically engineered. What I'm asking is that are they Cyborgs, i.e. are they artificially enhanced with robotic comoponents and the like? From those descriptions Nanashi, it seems that the Meltran are from the description of Lap. Quote
Gerwalker Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 I too thought that the organic tech was a RT thing... (not bad at all IMHO, I always like that idea of the organomechanic self-healing armor) Quote
ewilen Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 I didn't know about the Bionoids part, but I did know both races were genetically engineered. What I'm asking is that are they Cyborgs, i.e. are they artificially enhanced with robotic comoponents and the like? From those descriptions Nanashi, it seems that the Meltran are from the description of Lap. Depending on how "realistic" you want Macross to be, it would stand to reason that the Zentradi (and Meltrandi in DYRL) should have some kind of artificial skeleton and/or an internal structure which isn't just a scaled-up version of humanity. Otherwise, they'd probably have difficulty moving and they'd be extremely vulnerable to injury when running or falling, etc. Quote
Anubis Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 Zentradi bones are probably quite sturdy naturally. I doubt they break easy. Quote
Boxer Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 I didn't know about the Bionoids part, but I did know both races were genetically engineered. What I'm asking is that are they Cyborgs, i.e. are they artificially enhanced with robotic comoponents and the like? From those descriptions Nanashi, it seems that the Meltran are from the description of Lap. Depending on how "realistic" you want Macross to be, it would stand to reason that the Zentradi (and Meltrandi in DYRL) should have some kind of artificial skeleton and/or an internal structure which isn't just a scaled-up version of humanity. Otherwise, they'd probably have difficulty moving and they'd be extremely vulnerable to injury when running or falling, etc. You mean artificial bones that can shrink with the rest of the body during Micronization? I'd hope so, it would be a nighmare to have most of you shrink while your bones don't. Unless they take out their bones first, then shrink them So even though Zentreadi ships have organic armor does this mean they have limited healing abilities or is this indeed a Robotech fabrication? Quote
ewilen Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 Zentradi bones are probably quite sturdy naturally. I doubt they break easy. In that case, maybe we should make bridges out of them. If Zentradi skeletons and tissues are made of the same stuff in the same way as humans (only scaled up 5-6 times), they'd probably be very vulnerable to fractures and broken bones if they got into a fistfight or fell down; even simple movements like standing up or walking might be challenging. (Elephants and giraffes are much bigger/taller than people, but their bodies are shaped much differently.) Maybe the Zentradi suits are designed to help support their bodies--in fact, their shoes look an awful lot like the feet of mecha--but as a general rule exoskeletons don't seem to work well for terrestrial organisms much larger than a mouse. Ergo, either Zentradi have special parts implanted and/or or their tissues are formed around artificial substrates during their "generation", or their genetic engineering enables their bodies to synthesize materials which are different from, and much stronger than, normal bones and tissue. Or we can just chalk it up to "anime magic" and accept it as a fundamental premise of the Macross universe, along with the feasibility of transforming airplanes, that ten meter tall humanoids can move and fight pretty much the same way as two meter tall people. Quote
Lezt Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 recall "some one" in the Xmen series? i think his bones will be similar with the Zens Quote
Aurel Tristen Posted March 17, 2004 Posted March 17, 2004 We all know of the imfamous term "Clash of the Bionoids". Its not really a made up thing that was magically pulled out of the air. Not too many people know this, but according to the Macross the Movie "Gold Book" text, the Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy are Bionoids. The genitically engineered warriors created by the Protoculture to fight their proxy wars against each other (factions of the Stellar/Galactic Republic). The Meltohlauens are synthedic bio organisms. I didn't know about the Bionoids part, but I did know both races were genetically engineered. What I'm asking is that are they Cyborgs, i.e. are they artificially enhanced with robotic comoponents and the like? From those descriptions Nanashi, it seems that the Meltran are from the description of Lap. The Gold Book says: (See http://nanashi.macrossmecha.info/resrc/cat...amiz_fleet.html ) "..... Meltohlauens created these women with her genes.... the Meltohlauen-type Bionoid is the compound creation with an artificial body and optical nerves through the complicated combination of heredity bionics, laser optics, holography theory, synthetic frame and external leather armoring. Unlike Zjentohlauedy types, the dependence is higher with the inorganic optical systems. ....." Note: There were Meltohlauendy who created Meltohlauendy Bionoid. See: http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=bionic genetically engineered female warriors who manufacture female bionic/bio weapons which are partly snythedic (enhanced mechanics) and part of their genes... real flesh. Compound creations. Quote
Boxer Posted March 18, 2004 Posted March 18, 2004 So the compendium seems to suggest that the Meltran 'weapons' seen in DYRL are 'made' by the real meltran? I suppose hereditary Bionics and external leathering armor could point to a truely biological creature, but the Meltran have built-in holographics and laser optic eyes? Sounds like any synthetic components would have to be bio-organic in nature to permit micronization... And before you say the Meltran in DYRL don't Micronize (don't know if they do or not) then how can you explain Max's macronization if the Meltran don't have the technology? (And I have to wonder how Lap felt about Max borrowing a Q-rau...) ------------------ On second thought, could these descriptions be referring to the ships instead of the soldiers? Perhaps the ships are also called Meltrans... Quote
Maluk Posted March 18, 2004 Author Posted March 18, 2004 Hey, why is it spelled Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy rather than Zentraedi and Meltrandi? Which one is correct? Quote
Boxer Posted March 18, 2004 Posted March 18, 2004 Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaudey are romanizations of Zentran and Meltran, IMO, and might be the real spellings of the names. But I do know Zjentohlauedy was the way it was spelled on the model kit box to the Zjentohlauedy ships... Quote
Aurel Tristen Posted March 18, 2004 Posted March 18, 2004 Hey, why is it spelled Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy rather than Zentraedi and Meltrandi? Which one is correct? "Zjentohlauedy" is an English official spelling its on Studio Nue design sheets for DYRL, the ARII model boxes, and it is also seen on screen in the Macross movie (in Zjentohlaeudy). 'Meltohlauendy' is my own personal romanization I came up with based upon the official 'Zjentohlauedy'. Egan Loo corrected my own misspelling.... I typed 'Meltohlauedy' when I meant to type 'Meltohlauendy'... either way since neither has been seen written in English I can't say they are official. But, I will keep using it. : ) Quote
nathan Posted March 20, 2004 Posted March 20, 2004 Meltran is a DYRL? And Macross II term. I don't remember hearing it anywhere else. I wish people would stop using it. They're Female Zentraedi not another life form. DYRL? is a fictional movie, (I prefer the original alternative universe) so very little of what the Gold Book says applies to the rest of Macross. Dispite DYRL?'s designs being official, only Exedol and the occasional Quedlun Rou designs are seen later on. (Yes we all know about Fleet of the Strongest Women but that doesn't exist in the Macross timeline.) The Movies designs also don't match the "Official" story. If the "Meltran" are all bionics why do they bleed? They also can't get pregnant. Female Zentraedi can Micronise. Milia, Vifidas (spelling), who know how many others. Since Zentraedi are 6-8 times the size of humans they must be 6-8 times as tough as human size person. Quote
gnollman Posted March 20, 2004 Posted March 20, 2004 I just ascribe to the 'big-ass human' theory... Zentran and Meltran folk are bio-constructs, yes, but are essentially human. Just really big human. Anything else gets too complicated, fast.... Quote
VF5SS Posted March 21, 2004 Posted March 21, 2004 Since Zentraedi are 6-8 times the size of humans they must be 6-8 times as tough as human size person. Technically a giant human would be incredibly weak because our bodies are not designed to support such a massive frame. Everything in the Zentradi gene pool would have to strengthened almost to the point of them not being human. Quote
Boxer Posted March 21, 2004 Posted March 21, 2004 (edited) You have to remember that they're human save for the ability to shrink to human size, at least I think that was said in the series... Edited March 21, 2004 by Boxer Quote
nathan Posted March 24, 2004 Posted March 24, 2004 Zentraedi (male and female) are human. DNA tests proved it. As anyone can be enlarged, the enlarging process must strengthen the bodies. Quote
EganLoo Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 The Supervision Gun Destroyer that became the Macross (TV series) was made of "hyper-carbon". According to MAT (Chiba, et. al), the VF-1 is made of special metal [composite) (processed/recreated by Dyna-Metal Company ?) That is unofficial of course.... as Egan has pointed out. We now know of something called SWAG energy converting armor.... with the VF-0 and other VFs. It is not said in the Macross television series that Supervision ships are made from hypercarbon. While Do You Remember Love? does say that hypercarbon is one material used in the engine block of the Macross, it is not said that it is used in the armor of the VF-0 and other VFs. The above Dyna-Metal conjecture is not only unofficial, but also contradictory to Studio Nue's official story. OTEC, not "Dyna-Metal," is the company that analyzed and developed the new materials. The VF-0 posess SW-AG energy converting armor, but it is not said that similar technology in future variable fighters is also called SW-AG. Quote
EganLoo Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 Hey, why is it spelled Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy rather than Zentraedi and Meltrandi? Which one is correct? Zentradi and Meltlandi are correct and official. Meltohlaeundy/Meltohlauendy is not correct or official. Quote
EganLoo Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 'Meltohlauendy' is my own personal romanization I came up with based upon the official 'Zjentohlauedy'.Egan Loo corrected my own misspelling.... I typed 'Meltohlauedy' when I meant to type 'Meltohlauendy'... either way since neither has been seen written in English I can't say they are official. But, I will keep using it. : ) "Meltohlauendy" is just as much a made-up fan spelling as "Meltohlauedy"--especially since there *is* an official spelling: Meltlandi. Quote
EganLoo Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 We now know of something called SWAG energy converting armor.... with the VF-0 and other VFs. But that's armor. What they want to know what it's actually made of... Fortunately, the VF-0's armor composition has been specifically described, and it's not hypercarbon. This will be in the next Compendium update. Quote
Mechamaniac Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 Hey, why is it spelled Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy rather than Zentraedi and Meltrandi? Which one is correct? Zentradi and Meltlandi are correct and official. Meltohlaeundy/Meltohlauendy is not correct or official. Thank Kawamori!! I get so sick and tired of seeing those spellings. Quote
Aurel Tristen Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 Hey, why is it spelled Zjentohlauedy and Meltohlaeundy rather than Zentraedi and Meltrandi? Which one is correct? Zentradi and Meltlandi are correct and official. Meltohlaeundy/Meltohlauendy is not correct or official. Thank Kawamori!! I get so sick and tired of seeing those spellings. Well, 'Zjentohlauedy' is still correct. Quote
daeudi Posted June 22, 2004 Posted June 22, 2004 Since Zentraedi are 6-8 times the size of humans they must be 6-8 times as tough as human size person. Technically a giant human would be incredibly weak because our bodies are not designed to support such a massive frame. Everything in the Zentradi gene pool would have to strengthened almost to the point of them not being human. A common myth perpetuated by those who do not want us to believe in the old legends of giants. by that reasoning, the legendary King Og (yes, a real person!) who was 12-14' tall (depends on roman or egyptian measurement of cubit) would have been a cripple. And all of our legendary basketball players would be on the bench due to breaks. get real- the body will support itself. Quote
Vespaeda Posted June 23, 2004 Posted June 23, 2004 Well, yeah. 12-14ft., I can easily conceive of 15-25 feet before load & shear stresses becoming problematic, assuming the same biochemistry. Modern day rhinos & elephants fit around this and dinosaurs functioned in this size range. Antediluvian & post-flood humans at these sizes are akin to grizzly & polar bears. The 50ft & larger sauropods & therapod dinosaurs(meat eaters & plant eaters, respectively) show evidence of stress & injury fractures in fossil records, at least educated interpretations. The human shape at those scales may not fair as well in augmented sci-fi combat, so organosynthetic composite bioengineering is a very favorable premise, as far as Macross goes. Good thread to resurrect! Quote
ewilen Posted June 23, 2004 Posted June 23, 2004 Even tall modern-day humans (over 6') are at a greater risk of lower back problems, and being overweight is often cited as a factor in joint deterioration. Quote
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