Agent ONE Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 How about for money? It was all part of my ultimate plan to posess your soul.
Agent ONE Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 Get a room, you two! No sh!t man... I PM'd but he can't help himlsef. At least he and I are both having fun aren't angry or anything. THE BEST PART ABOUT THIS THREAD: We aren't bashing RT!
Agent ONE Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 Here is something interesting: <meta name="keywords" content="Macross,Movie,Macross The Movie,Do You Remember Love, Do You Remember,Love,Hikaru,Ichijo,Misa,Hayase,Lynn,Minmay,Roy,Focker,Maximillian,Max,Genius,Milia,Hayao,Kakizaki,Bruno,Global,Tatsunoko,Artland,Kenji,Yoshida,Yoshimasa,Ohnishi,Noburo,Ishiguro,Shoji,Kawamori,Hiroshi,Iwata,"> Look at all the stuff they have in their meta tags. They have the name "Tatsunoko" in there but make no mention of it in the shown text. Thats really funny.
treatment Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 They prolly just want all Macross and DYRL search-traffic going to their site, instead of say, our macross-retailers.
Agent ONE Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 They prolly just want all Macross and DYRL search-traffic going to their site, instead of say, our macross-retailers. Yeah! Thats exactly what they are after.
ewilen Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 About editing DYRL to "robotechify" it or tame the violence/nudity for the kiddies... According to the relevant IP law (Japanese copyright law and the Berne convention), although HG could conceivably own the right to sell DYRL and even to translate it into another language, there's no way HG owns the right to alter the story. This is because the "author's moral right" in a work, which can't be transferred or sold, includes the right to preserve the integrity of the work "against any distortion, mutilation or other modification". The author of DYRL (who may be undetermined, though it is likely to be Studio Nue or Kawamori) would have to consent to any changes to the story. Although HG did change SDF Macross TV to make it part of Robotech, and there are already existing releases of DYRL which have been edited for nudity and violence, it's not clear whether those changes were approved. And even if there was approval, it's doubtful that it would provide carte blanche for additional changes, and it's possible that it wouldn't even carry over to a new edition/release.
Hurin Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 No sh!t man... I PM'd but he can't help himlsef. It takes two!
zxmagus Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 You know i really wish HG would remake the whole Robotech saga from scratch fix all it's continuity errors and not mix it self up dealing with bits from the series it was grafted onto, so finally the RT and macross communities can finally get divorced. Eventually this split will probably be so permanent and final that the two groups never talk or respect each other in any way causing an ever increasing dvid between them till they both become 2 armed camps Eventually calling them selves the zentradi and meltrandi and the ensuing conflict gets waged across the stars destroying everything in it's path. My point is that I hope the song sung to end the conflict is not we win win since that song is annoying.
Agent ONE Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 You know i really wish HG would remake the whole Robotech saga from scratch fix all it's continuity errors and not mix it self up dealing with bits from the series it was grafted onto, so finally the RT and macross communities can finally get divorced. Eventually this split will probably be so permanent and final that the two groups never talk or respect each other in any way causing an ever increasing dvid between them till they both become 2 armed camps Eventually calling them selves the zentradi and meltrandi and the ensuing conflict gets waged across the stars destroying everything in it's path.My point is that I hope the song sung to end the conflict is not we win win since that song is annoying. GREAT post!
EXO Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 About editing DYRL to "robotechify" it or tame the violence/nudity for the kiddies...According to the relevant IP law (Japanese copyright law and the Berne convention), although HG could conceivably own the right to sell DYRL and even to translate it into another language, there's no way HG owns the right to alter the story. This is because the "author's moral right" in a work, which can't be transferred or sold, includes the right to preserve the integrity of the work "against any distortion, mutilation or other modification". The author of DYRL (who may be undetermined, though it is likely to be Studio Nue or Kawamori) would have to consent to any changes to the story. Although HG did change SDF Macross TV to make it part of Robotech, and there are already existing releases of DYRL which have been edited for nudity and violence, it's not clear whether those changes were approved. And even if there was approval, it's doubtful that it would provide carte blanche for additional changes, and it's possible that it wouldn't even carry over to a new edition/release. So did they get permission form BW to alter it to RT back in the 80's?
Radd Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 I gotta admit, I like the spiffy logo they chose. Nice colours. I actually dissagree, the one thing I really dislike about that logo is the colours. I've never been a fan of of their lack of colour sense, and overuse of Photoshop effects over at the HG ranch. This isn't baseless HG bashing, I do like some of the linework, like that picture of Dana on the remastered Southern Cross boxes, but I think the art would look so much better with a more natural pallette and less Photoshop filters and effects.
ewilen Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 So did they get permission form BW to alter it to RT back in the 80's? I raised the issue in the license debate forum a long time ago, and nobody really had an answer. Even wrylac admitted that the alteration was probably a violation of the author's moral right, yet it's obvious that no one has ever really done anything about it. http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...660entry47662 (At the time, I wasn't aware that moral rights were inalienable, so I allowed that Tatsunoko might have somehow gotten the moral right and passed it on to HG. It turns out that's not possible per se.)
Apollo Leader Posted May 28, 2004 Author Posted May 28, 2004 With a little digging, it is safe for me to confirm that Harmony Gold currently does NOT have the rights to DYRL as in the movie. Though it sounds like they are trying to snag it as we speak. Harmony Gold currently has DYRL merchandising rights. We'll be finding out more by the time the Anime Expo rolls around.
treatment Posted May 28, 2004 Posted May 28, 2004 can i quote you on that? btw, could you elaborate on the "digging" thing you did? thanks.
Pat Payne Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 About editing DYRL to "robotechify" it or tame the violence/nudity for the kiddies...According to the relevant IP law (Japanese copyright law and the Berne convention), although HG could conceivably own the right to sell DYRL and even to translate it into another language, there's no way HG owns the right to alter the story. I ask again: Like it's stopped them before?
Radd Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 About editing DYRL to "robotechify" it or tame the violence/nudity for the kiddies...According to the relevant IP law (Japanese copyright law and the Berne convention), although HG could conceivably own the right to sell DYRL and even to translate it into another language, there's no way HG owns the right to alter the story. I ask again: Like it's stopped them before? Big West didn't care about the international market before. Recently it seems they have taken an interest. Hence all the lawsuits and such flying around.
LePoseur Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 I wouldn't really say that they didn't care. I mean all of their post-SDF Macross shows have been licensed for international release, so they were obliviously aware of it. If you mean them staying away from HG, well... I think BigWest knew they had given the rights away and so felt that they should just ignore it. It wasn't until HG started claiming they owned Macross and all of it's derivatives, blocking the Mac+ toys etc., that BigWest started all the legal wrangling. Battles that I believe were never to win back the rights to the original (that would have just been icing on the cake) but to secure the rights of all the sequels. International sales have never been their top priority, that's for sure, but I wouldn't say they didn't care about them.
SkullLeaderVF-X Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 (edited) Is HG also trying to get Macross7? If you type in Macross7.com it takes you the HG shope site?WTF is up with that? *edit: You need to have a RT account I am asumming to get the link to take you to the HG store.I can be wrong though. Edited May 29, 2004 by SkullLeaderVF-X
Myriad Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 Anyone who really wants these titles already has the "alternative" sets. I won't be seeing the need to buy their versions if they come out.
Radd Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 I wouldn't really say that they didn't care. I mean all of their post-SDF Macross shows have been licensed for international release, so they were obliviously aware of it. If you mean them staying away from HG, well... I think BigWest knew they had given the rights away and so felt that they should just ignore it. It wasn't until HG started claiming they owned Macross and all of it's derivatives, blocking the Mac+ toys etc., that BigWest started all the legal wrangling. Battles that I believe were never to win back the rights to the original (that would have just been icing on the cake) but to secure the rights of all the sequels.International sales have never been their top priority, that's for sure, but I wouldn't say they didn't care about them. I meant the pre-Macross Plus time period. HG got Macross and edited it into Robotech, without a decent release of the original series until very recently, and the english release of DYRL? was very lackluster. It just looks like they didn't care one bit about the international market. Flashback 2012 wasn't even marketed. If Big West did care, they could have gone after HG about Robotech, or even worked out a mutally benefitial deal in them releasing and seriously pushing an uncut version of SDF Macross back in the 80's, with HG getting DYRL? and other Macross sequels so long as they did them up right. Heck, if they were that dissapointed in HG, even if they couldn't go after them, they could have made a bigger push on DYRL? amd all other sequels at a time when Robotech was popular enough for people to make the connection and take interest. As it is now, it seems they didn't take much interest in the international market until after they saw how well Macross Plus did. That's not to say they had no interest in selling to anyone who wanted to license the shows, but until the Macross Plus toys and the VFX game, they never seemed to show much interest in merchandising outside of Japan, or actively pushing their shows for a western release.
JB0 Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 If Big West did care, they could have gone after HG about Robotech, or even worked out a mutally benefitial deal in them releasing and seriously pushing an uncut version of SDF Macross back in the 80's, with HG getting DYRL? and other Macross sequels so long as they did them up right. But back in the '80s... It was understood that Tatsunoko had TV series distribution rights, which they COULD sublicense to HG, and Did NOT have rights to anything else, so Big West COULD license it to anyone they pleased(and they did so, repeatedly), as well as the lineart(see BattleTech). This continued into the early 90s, if Macross 2 and Plus are any indication(HG ignored the actual release of Macross Plus, and only attacked the later toys). That's not to say they had no interest in selling to anyone who wanted to license the shows, but until the Macross Plus toys and the VFX game, they never seemed to show much interest in merchandising outside of Japan, or actively pushing their shows for a western release. Well, anime's only gotten big enough to be WORTH merchandising in the US recently. They DID push the shows for western releases.
Keith Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 With a little digging, it is safe for me to confirm that Harmony Gold currently does NOT have the rights to DYRL as in the movie. Though it sounds like they are trying to snag it as we speak.Harmony Gold currently has DYRL merchandising rights. We'll be finding out more by the time the Anime Expo rolls around. HG have re-asserted themselves as slimy bastards, and if Steve Yun did indeed claim those domain names under his own initiative, then I can be quoted as saying: Steve Yun is a c*nt!
Radd Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 If Big West did care, they could have gone after HG about Robotech, or even worked out a mutally benefitial deal in them releasing and seriously pushing an uncut version of SDF Macross back in the 80's, with HG getting DYRL? and other Macross sequels so long as they did them up right. But back in the '80s... It was understood that Tatsunoko had TV series distribution rights, which they COULD sublicense to HG, and Did NOT have rights to anything else, so Big West COULD license it to anyone they pleased(and they did so, repeatedly), as well as the lineart(see BattleTech). This continued into the early 90s, if Macross 2 and Plus are any indication(HG ignored the actual release of Macross Plus, and only attacked the later toys). That's not to say they had no interest in selling to anyone who wanted to license the shows, but until the Macross Plus toys and the VFX game, they never seemed to show much interest in merchandising outside of Japan, or actively pushing their shows for a western release. Well, anime's only gotten big enough to be WORTH merchandising in the US recently. They DID push the shows for western releases. That's true about anime in general, but people forget that there have been very prominent exceptions around for a very long time. Speed Racer, Star Blazers, Gigantor, Astroboy, Battle of the Planets/G-Force, and a little show called Robotech were all popular well before anime in general became popular. These shows were merchandised mostly with a good degree of success. With Robotech as a kind of beach head, Big West could have rode on HG's back like some crazy Santa Clause, delivering Valkyries to all the good little boys and girls. Also, Big West didn't choose very wisely when it came time to bringing DYRL? to western shores, and we certainly saw no merchandise for that. They also let that whole Robotech thing slide, without questioning the edits that they could have fought if they really wanted to. As for all thise other licensing and merchandising, such as the line art, did they license the line art to Battletech? I've always been under the impression that they used a lot of anime mech designs without actual permission. I recall reading articles that said as much before the Harmony Gold lawsuit forced them to stop using the Macross designs.
ewilen Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 Is HG also trying to get Macross7? If you type in Macross7.com it takes you the HG shope site?WTF is up with that? Looks like domain name squatting to me. As might be the macrossmovie.com domain name. www.macrossplus.com also exists but it doesn't look like a HG site. macrosszero.com and macross0.com are registered, apparently, but I don't think there are any servers in those domains.
Panon Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 Anyone who really wants these titles already has the "alternative" sets. I won't be seeing the need to buy their versions if they come out. I assume then that you'll be buying copies of the originals from Japan, so as not to be a lowlife parasite who just buys illegal bootlegs of things instead of actual legal copies.
JB0 Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 That's true about anime in general, but people forget that there have been very prominent exceptions around for a very long time. Speed Racer, Star Blazers, Gigantor, Astroboy, Battle of the Planets/G-Force, and a little show called Robotech were all popular well before anime in general became popular. These shows were merchandised mostly with a good degree of success. With Robotech as a kind of beach head, Big West could have rode on HG's back like some crazy Santa Clause, delivering Valkyries to all the good little boys and girls. Also, Big West didn't choose very wisely when it came time to bringing DYRL? to western shores, and we certainly saw no merchandise for that. They also let that whole Robotech thing slide, without questioning the edits that they could have fought if they really wanted to. *bows* As for all thise other licensing and merchandising, such as the line art, did they license the line art to Battletech? I've always been under the impression that they used a lot of anime mech designs without actual permission. I recall reading articles that said as much before the Harmony Gold lawsuit forced them to stop using the Macross designs. I'm under the impression they licensed them, and when HG sued for theft of "their" lineart, they were forced to settle out of court because they couldn't afford the legal battle that would have ensued. Either way it should've been Big West that sued, as Harmony Gold owns neither the lineart nor the mech designs.
Hybridchild Posted May 29, 2004 Posted May 29, 2004 I'm under the impression they licensed them, and when HG sued for theft of "their" lineart, they were forced to settle out of court because they couldn't afford the legal battle that would have ensued.Either way it should've been Big West that sued, as Harmony Gold owns neither the lineart nor the mech designs. Thats preety much what happened but FASA never gave out all the info, its suspected they bought the licence from a company who didnt actually have it to sell and they just got ripped off, not that much differant from HG. One clarifaction though the line art FASA used was itself original draw in house but the desgins wheren't thats why there are alot of differances in some designs, espically the 3050 artwork for the Marauder and a couple of others Hybridchild
one_klump Posted May 31, 2004 Posted May 31, 2004 ©2004. MACROSS is a registered trademark of Harmony Gold USA, Inc. All rights reserved.By using this Web site, you are agreeing to the Terms of Use. WTF? Macross is a copyright of HG? ok, but what about DYRL?
Hurin Posted May 31, 2004 Posted May 31, 2004 One clarifaction though the line art FASA used was itself original draw in house but the desgins wheren't thats why there are alot of differances in some designs, espically the 3050 artwork for the Marauder and a couple of others That's not quite right. Battletech was originally called Battledroids. And that game did use the line art directly from Macross. In fact, the little cardboard stand-up mechs used those fancy prints that we see so often on the cover of Macross model boxes. There was no difference or alterations made. Only after the game's name was changed to Battletech, and it began to expand, did they slighty rework the designs when they released Battletech Technical Readout 3025. I think they smelled impending trouble and attempted to cover their ass. But the Wasp still looked like a VF-1S valkryie with some of its edges blunted. . . and the Archer still looked almost exactly like a Spartan. They weren't fooling anyone. Nor were they intending to do so, I'd bet. I think they were still hoping to appeal to RT fans in the US while still technically remaining legal. Of course, t probably wasn't a good idea to modify a VF-1 slightly and name it a uh. . . valkyrie. And I won't even touch the straight-up transforming valkyrie rip-off LAMs (Land-Air-Mechs). H
Apollo Leader Posted May 31, 2004 Author Posted May 31, 2004 Is HG also trying to get Macross7? If you type in Macross7.com it takes you the HG shope site?WTF is up with that? *edit: You need to have a RT account I am asumming to get the link to take you to the HG store.I can be wrong though. Harmony Gold has also had the domain name of http://www.mospeada.com/ set to take you to robotech.com for the longest time. But now when you go to that address, HG now has a fully developed Mospeada website in the works! As for HG and www.macross7.com, I wonder if this has anything to do with the aborted Macross 7 Trash? Anyway the next few weeks leading up to the Anime Expo are going to be interesting.
Radd Posted May 31, 2004 Posted May 31, 2004 Is HG also trying to get Macross7? If you type in Macross7.com it takes you the HG shope site?WTF is up with that? *edit: You need to have a RT account I am asumming to get the link to take you to the HG store.I can be wrong though. Harmony Gold has also had the domain name of http://www.mospeada.com/ set to take you to robotech.com for the longest time. But now when you go to that address, HG now has a fully developed Mospeada website in the works! As for HG and www.macross7.com, I wonder if this has anything to do with the aborted Macross 7 Trash? Anyway the next few weeks leading up to the Anime Expo are going to be interesting. Again, I hate thier choice of cartoony, oversaturated colours. I do look forward to them expanding the site, though.
Skull Leader Posted May 31, 2004 Posted May 31, 2004 If they've got the domain names for all of the original works (plus the Macross sequels) bought out, they obviously think they've got something going, or at least are anticipating it.
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